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The Day the Admirals Cried...


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#1 Hauksbee

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 11:46:55 AM

A nice collection film clips of the U.S.Navy experimenting with airplanes sinking Battleships. In most cases, obsolete American ones. But there is one that marked a watershed in naval/aerial warfare: the sinking of the Ostfreidland, a German battleship seized after WWI. At the time, it was an article of faith among the hard-core "Battleship Admirals" that an airplane could never sink a battleship. When the Ostfriedland rolled over and sank there were tears on the cheeks of several Admirals who were there as observers. (or, so it is said).

 

OSTFREIDLAND.jpg

 

 


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#2 Gepard

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Posted 17 May 2017 - 01:43:44 PM

One correction. The name of the ship was "SMS Ostfriesland".

https://en.wikipedia...MS_Ostfriesland



#3 Hauksbee

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Posted 18 May 2017 - 10:14:07 AM

My bad. I'll put that in long-term memory.


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#4 Fubar512

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Posted 18 May 2017 - 04:05:17 PM

Major Correction.  At the time of her sinking, she was the USS Ostfriesland:  http://www.wrecksite...ck.aspx?137746  :biggrin:  

 

Here's a recent sonar image, along with coordinates. The wreck lies in 400 feet of water, so I doubt that I'll be checking it out any time soon.  If I am not mistaken, the original USS New Jersey, and the USS Virginia, are resting a short distance away (as is the USS Monitor).

 

http://atlanticwreck...l/Mitchell.html

 

Ostfriesland-2m-Multibeam-Coordinates.jp


Edited by Fubar512, 18 May 2017 - 04:14:49 PM.

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#5 Olham

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 11:07:58 AM

There had been an SMS Ostfriesland? I hadn't known that until know.

Ostfriesland (East Frisia) is my native homeland; it lies east of the Netherlands, by the North Sea.


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#6 Hasse Wind

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 11:30:41 AM

SMS Ostfriesland was a Helgoland-class battleship - among the most modern battleships serving in the Kaiserliche Marine during the Great War. She had three sister ships: Helgoland, Thüringen and Oldenburg.

 

SMS Ostfriesland took part in all the major naval operations of the German navy in the war, also the famous Battle of Jutland in 1916.

 

SMS Ostfriesland.jpg


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#7 Gepard

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 11:59:36 AM

SMS Ostfriesland was a Helgoland-class battleship - among the most modern battleships serving in the Kaiserliche Marine during the Great War.

 

The Helgoland class was not one of the most modern ships. They were average during WW1. Modern were Kaiser-,  König- or Derfflinger-class ships



#8 Hasse Wind

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 12:21:43 PM

Well, they were only a few years old, so I'd still call them pretty modern.


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#9 Fubar512

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Posted 19 May 2017 - 02:10:53 PM

When one takes into consideration that dreadnoughts were for the most part, practically obsolete by 1914 (replaced by the "super dreadnoughts"), so Michael is correct.  The Helgoland class, the majority of US battleships, and many of the Royal Navy's BBs, were "old" ships by the beginning of WW1.

 

Technology was advancing by leaps and bounds back then.  When the USS New York and Texas entered service in 1914, they were allegedly the most powerful battleships afloat.  Three years later, they were considered just so-so.


Edited by Fubar512, 19 May 2017 - 03:01:52 PM.

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#10 Heck

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 07:03:24 AM

When one takes into consideration that dreadnoughts were for the most part, practically obsolete by 1914 (replaced by the "super dreadnoughts"), so Michael is correct.  The Helgoland class, the majority of US battleships, and many of the Royal Navy's BBs, were "old" ships by the beginning of WW1.

 

Technology was advancing by leaps and bounds back then.  When the USS New York and Texas entered service in 1914, they were allegedly the most powerful battleships afloat.  Three years later, they were considered just so-so.

One interesting thing about the New York and Texas: the US Navy purposely reverted to Triple Expansion Engines in this class, because they weren't happy with US turbine manufacturer's product quality. It worked, because every class after that had turbines. I always wished the New York was a monument in my home state, rather than at the bottom of the Pacific.


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#11 Fubar512

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 08:36:41 AM

One interesting thing about the New York and Texas: the US Navy purposely reverted to Triple Expansion Engines in this class, because they weren't happy with US turbine manufacturer's product quality. It worked, because every class after that had turbines. I always wished the New York was a monument in my home state, rather than at the bottom of the Pacific.

 

Heck, have you ever visited the USS Texas? It's an experience. It was a ship designed back in the day when the average sailor was less than five foot eight in height.  I found myself having to walk around slouched over below decks.  :biggrin:


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#12 Heck

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Posted 20 May 2017 - 10:43:31 AM

Heck, have you ever visited the USS Texas? It's an experience. It was a ship designed back in the day when the average sailor was less than five foot eight in height.  I found myself having to walk around slouched over below decks.  :biggrin:

Never got the chance, Fubar. I did visit the Massachusetts in Fall River; most cool. Got to go into a Gato boat, and destroyer built near the end of WW2. Here in Albany, NY, we have the USS Slater, a destroyer escort. She's cramped, but there always seemed to be headroom, so Texas is a view of a completely different time.


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#13 Fubar512

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Posted 21 May 2017 - 04:24:53 PM

Heck,

 

I've been aboard the old "Mame" in Fall River (35 years ago!), the USS New Jersey in Camden, and the USS Texas in LaPorte. I want to visit the USS North Carolina, as a late co-worker of mine served on her from mid-'42 - early 1945.


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#14 Hauksbee

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Posted 23 May 2017 - 12:08:34 PM

Never got the chance, Fubar. I did visit the Massachusetts in Fall River; most cool. Got to go into a Gato boat, and destroyer built near the end of WW2.

From 2000 to 2015, I lived in Westport, Mass...a mere stone's throw from Fall River. I toured the USS Massachusetts. Somehow I thought such a big ship on the outside would be spacious on the inside.  No so.  All inside rooms were small; one might say 'cramped'. Turns out, on a warship, "ship functions" trump "human needs" every time. Then we went over to the Destroyer "USS Kennedy" and got another lesson in "small".  It was late in the day so we didn't do the complete tour; only poked our heads in. That was enough to see that a Destroyer was a narrow hallway with a ship built around it. Daylight was fading fast and we spent the last moments before closing time to take a look at the Submarine USS Lionfish. This made the Destroyer look positively roomy. Again, a central hallway packed with machinery and weaponry. You bunked between, above and under torpedoes. The engine room was a huge diesel engine with perhaps three, maybe four, feet between it and the hull. The conning tower had an upper and lower floor. The upper had the periscope with enough room for one man to look through it. Maybe a second man on the other side. The floor below, the command center, was...well, picture the smallest bathroom you've ever been in. Every Hollywood submarine you've seen, (with six to eight officers looking at nautical charts on a dining-room sized table), is a lie.


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