GwynO 16 Posted February 22, 2009 (edited) http://news.uk.msn.com/world/article.aspx?...&ocid=today From baby faced fathers to baby faced killers, this kind of story makes me think the world needs a damn good kick up the backside. Edited February 22, 2009 by Kopis n Xiphos Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nesher 629 Posted February 22, 2009 the world need a damn good kick in the nuts! i think i remember hearing about even younger killers.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MaverickMike 10 Posted February 22, 2009 "The shotgun, which apparently belonged to Brown, is designed for children and such weapons do not have to be registered. " That is most probably the most stupid thing ive ever read. A shotgun designed for kids? WTF are people thinking about? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ONETINSOLDIER 2 Posted February 22, 2009 Whats even dumber is that it is exempt from being registered just because its designed for "children". Not that it would make any difference to the weapon or the person holding it during the commision of a crime, it just seems to neutralise the whole idea of the governments attempt to keep track of all the weapons. Yep, thats our tax dollars at work, once again, Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GwynO 16 Posted February 22, 2009 "The shotgun, which apparently belonged to Brown, is designed for children and such weapons do not have to be registered. " That is most probably the most stupid thing ive ever read. A shotgun designed for kids? WTF are people thinking about? I know there are a lot of entrenched views either side on the issue of guns this and guns that, but truth is guns don't kill people. People kill people and guns just make it a lot easier to do. I had a rifle as a kid and an air pistol but I certainly wouldn't have had independent access or unsupervised time with either of them at age 11. My children will be brought up the same, until they are adults themselves, they will be getting the key to the safe from me. They wont know where the key is kept and they certainly wont be allowed to keep a gun in their bedroom. Obviously we don't know why the kid did it, or even if he did it as the case is not closed from the sound of it. Just maybe the kid is innocent, but certainly there are a lot evil things that happen in this world. That children as young as this or younger are capable to act like that is sickening. What solution I do not know. You can't guarantee that your kids wont turn out psycho even for one split second no matter how well your parenting, you can't keep watch over the kid every single moment of the day nor would that be right anyway. You can't remove every implement of death from them short of putting them in a padded cell in a straight jacket. I just feel sad and sorry for the loss of two lives, one innocent beyond all doubt and a lot of hurt all round. Nesher, you're right, a good kick in the nuts. I believe the Jewish religion as well as the Christian one upholds that God Himself formed that opinion of humanity many years ago. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+76.IAP-Blackbird 3,544 Posted February 22, 2009 11 years?! ... nod words on this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DWCAce 19 Posted February 22, 2009 I'm assuming that when the idiots in the press say 'designed for kids', they're talking about a youth-sized firearm. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MaverickMike 10 Posted February 22, 2009 I know there are a lot of entrenched views either side on the issue of guns this and guns that, but truth is guns don't kill people. People kill people and guns just make it a lot easier to do. I had a rifle as a kid and an air pistol but I certainly wouldn't have had independent access or unsupervised time with either of them at age 11. My children will be brought up the same, until they are adults themselves, they will be getting the key to the safe from me. They wont know where the key is kept and they certainly wont be allowed to keep a gun in their bedroom. good post. I think you are spot on. Im just a little bit surprised at the fact that people design guns for children. Surely its better to not allow kids to have guns at all? Maybe im being a bit narrow minded as I have been brought up in country where firearms are prohibited. Im not against the use firearms for recreational purposes and have been hunting with air rifles many times. When i was younger i fired a few of my fathers rifles. but a 20 gauge shotgun is a bit much for a kid to be handling if you ask me. As for access to the weapons maybe the kid stole the key to the safe, or maybe he was allowed access but either way if the shotgun wouldnt have been there maybe the two innocents would have survived? Its just a who knows scenario i guess Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ONETINSOLDIER 2 Posted February 22, 2009 Actually, a 20 guage doesnt have much of a recoil at all,,,, Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ruggbutt 45 Posted February 22, 2009 Surely its better to not allow kids to have guns at all? Maybe im being a bit narrow minded as I have been brought up in country where firearms are prohibited. Half the kids in my school had guns. I had a gun in my vehicle at school. Kids had guns in rifle racks at school. Nobody ever shot anyone. but a 20 gauge shotgun is a bit much for a kid to be handling if you ask me. A 20 gauge kicks hardly at all with bird shot. He could have killed that woman with a .22 just as easily. As for access to the weapons maybe the kid stole the key to the safe, or maybe he was allowed access but either way if the shotgun wouldnt have been there maybe the two innocents would have survived? Irresponsible parenting is at fault. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Dave 2,318 Posted February 22, 2009 Irresponsible parenting is at fault. BINGO! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ONETINSOLDIER 2 Posted February 22, 2009 yeah, I remember my introduction to weapons and what they can and will do. Grampa and me sat on the porch, he waited for a ground squirrel to pop up outta his hole, he then proceeded to vaporize the little bugger and calmly explained to me that it would do that to me, or him, or anyone else, and that firearms are by no means a toy. Admittedly a bit harsh for an eight year old, but I tell you what, its a lesson I took to heart that very day,,, Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Syrinx 13 Posted February 22, 2009 Why does something like this not surprise me ? It's a sad indictment on certain parts of the human psyche. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Stary 2,426 Posted February 22, 2009 The shotgun designed for WHAT? No words for such idiotisms Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Silverbolt 104 Posted February 22, 2009 Shot gun for children? whattaheck? they should arrest the idiot who created it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GwynO 16 Posted February 22, 2009 Young people can and do shoot responsibly. I see no problem in responsible adults teaching young people to shoot either on private property or at a range, hunting ground or similar. There is no problem with having smaller stocks built for that purpose. What the journalist describes as a "gun for kids" has conjured up different sets of images in different peoples minds. Some of you are thinking that this means a gun marketed to kids in the same way as a harmless toy, perhaps packaged in colourful cardboard and plastic. That would be sick, but is not the reality. There are plenty of guns made with smaller people in mind, so a junior firearm is not aimed as a kids toy, it is a firearm all the same but with the needs of a smaller body in mind (some women prefer the smaller size and power for example). I have certainly never seen junior stocked shotguns marketed for kids in the UK yet we do have them available on license. I think there are a number of questions in this case, for example, if indeed the kid does confess to this or is otherwise definitively proven guilty, why did he do it? That is a huge question in itself. Secondly, a much easier question to resolve is how did the kid get access to the gun? If the child could find the key to the locker that easily in my house, I would have failed in my parental responsibility twice, first because my kid didn't get that lesson I taught him about the value of human life, and secondly because only I and perhaps another adult should ever be able to access the gun safe. Although I can teach my children right and wrong as best as I can, it is not a cast iron guarantee because we humans have a little something called free will. Do you think Hitler's father taught him to be a monster? No father can give an absolute cast iron guarantee that their kid will not do something crazy or evil, but every father can and should make it absolutely certain that short of a cutting torch, the kid cannot get access to the guns without first coming through him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eraser_tr 29 Posted February 22, 2009 A shotgun designed for children should make a bang noise, maybe have a flashing light and need batteries. Anything more than that and its not designed for children. ditto on the responsible parenting Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
column5 62 Posted February 22, 2009 There is most likely more to this than what has been reported. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dagger 21 Posted February 23, 2009 the wording IMO is designed to touch a nerve and set off the anti-gun crowd. The wording when you buy a"smaller"shotgun or rifle, is YOUTH model, and NOT child model. I would be willing to bet the reporter is a member of peta and a card carrying member of the anti-gun front. As for the child, and by 11 most young men around here have been hunting and fishing for a few years, heck I bought my grandson a youth mdel shotgun and rifle.This boils down to"where were the adults?"and"why wasn't he instructed on how to handle a firearm in a safe manner?" I have hammered safe handling into his head, and I feel very good about him with a weapon in his hand. If he had free access to this shotgun, I have a problem with the parents and think they should be ones who face punishment. Like I said I have confidence in my grandson, BUT he doesn't have free acces to the weapons. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ruggbutt 45 Posted February 23, 2009 Youth model firearms are also purchased for women (and men) of smaller stature. The stocks are shorter. No such thing as a kids model. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jodandawg 17 Posted February 23, 2009 if this boy is charged for the murder, he should be tried in an adult court. i believe if he did it, he knew right from wrong because he aimed for her head and waited until she was asleep. he should be put in a juvenile facility until he turns 18 and then moved to an adult facility for the rest of his life. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Silverbolt 104 Posted February 23, 2009 A shotgun designed for children should make a bang noise, maybe have a flashing light and need batteries. Anything more than that and its not designed for children. ditto on the responsible parenting Couldn't be more clearer Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eraser_tr 29 Posted February 23, 2009 He knew damn well what he was doing, saw on the news he lied to police about seeing this black van and led them on a while goose chase. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
