Shotgun 27 5 Posted May 7, 2009 http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/africa/05/07...iled/index.html The attempted attack happened Wednesday against the USNS Lewis and Clark, a dry cargo and ammunition ship that supports the U.S. Navy 5th Fleet and coalition ships in the area, the Navy said. Two pirate skiffs pursued the Lewis and Clark for more than an hour as it headed north, the Navy said. They got as close as one nautical mile from the ship. The Lewis and Clark sped up and tried to escape the pirates, and the ship's security team issued verbal warnings to the approaching skiffs, the Navy said. The suspected pirates, who were then two nautical miles behind the Lewis and Clark, fired small arms at the ship. They fell a mile short of the ship's stern, the Navy said. The Lewis and Clark sped up and the skiffs stopped their chase. Maybe next time they'll try it on a guided missile cruiser. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
firehawkordy 34 Posted May 8, 2009 The thought of a military ammo ship in the hands of pirates is scary, at least they were able to out run the f***s. I say to hell with world opinion and kill every last one of them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Typhoid 231 Posted May 8, 2009 http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/africa/05/07...iled/index.html Maybe next time they'll try it on a guided missile cruiser. some of them tried it on a French FFG. They are now "guests" of the French Navy! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
macelena 1,070 Posted May 8, 2009 (edited) A couple of days ago, a skiff was rammed by our fleet tanker. I´m concerned about the real purpose of those who try to get aside warships, as far as it is not a good deal. Reports indicate that they use to learn about the ships they are about to attack. I see two options 1:Al-Qaeda was already present in Somalia in 1992, and they worked with the warlords against the UN troops. Perhaps this time they are using their influence again to bitch around 2: The pirates arrested will live better imprisoned in the west than free in somalia. Here in Spain, some inmigrants used to do something easy to get to jail, live well for a term, and be dispatched back home. Edited May 8, 2009 by macelena Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Emp_Palpatine 501 Posted May 8, 2009 (edited) The thought of a military ammo ship in the hands of pirates is scary, at least they were able to out run the f***s. I say to hell with world opinion and kill every last one of them. Sure, some heavy military response could help allievate the problem... Sadly, those people hold a few hundreds (somewhat between 500-800) sailors in hostage on land as a sort of insurance. There is no organized pirate authorities, but those people are not totaly dump unfortunately and if they feel threatened, they probably will harm the detained sailors. Having hundreds of civilian slaughtered is quite a heavy price to pay... Edited May 8, 2009 by Emp_Palpatine Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Growler67 0 Posted May 8, 2009 (edited) There are far too many willing to capitulate and pay a ransom rather than take a "non-negotiate" position. Those willing to actually defend against such "activities" will have their own assets safer (not immune by any means) but that just means there will be many more "easy fish" for the taking. Unless a stance is unilateral the problem will not be rectified. That said.................... The caliber used in the recent SEAL operation hasn't been disclosed and I make NO claims that a .50 cal was used for a shot taken at 75 meters. I didn't make these "posters", just thought they were pertinent to the thread as it relates to my position regarding such. That said............ I'm just sayin' ETA: noticed I forgot the "coup de gras" US NAVY pic, sorry. Edited May 8, 2009 by Growler67 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Dave 2,318 Posted May 8, 2009 OMG those are great. I love that answer. "The recoil." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Growler67 0 Posted May 8, 2009 (edited) I wonder if there is a "pool fund" to buy the hats in bulk so that they can be sent over there and dropped from above over the coastal areas for "equal" distribution. I don't have much, but I can share what little I have Edited May 8, 2009 by Growler67 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Prowler1111 14 Posted May 8, 2009 I say..nothing a couple GBU-39´s can´t fix..c´mon, these guys aren´t as organized as the Iraqui military machine, position some global hawks, follow the damn skiffs, they must have a port, then get some SEALS or SAS around, locate the hostages , and then just surgically bomb the s**t out of this world..IT WAS done during the Libya crisis, most definitely done during Desert Storm, and was everyday biz at Iraqui Freedom (so i´m told)..and there you have this issue finished..IMHO. Best regards Prowler Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
column5 62 Posted May 8, 2009 I have a question. Perhaps someone more nautical-minded can educate me. First, look at this pic: This is a cargo ship. I assume it is at least somewhat representative of cargo ships as a group. As you can see, the distance from the surface of the ocean to the deck is considerable, with no ready means to scale it. My question is...how exactly to these Somali pirates threaten the ships? Do they threaten to shoot RPGs into the hull, or...? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+SkippyBing 8 Posted May 8, 2009 I believe nautical tradition involves throwing a hook with a rope attached up to the deck and then scaling that. A second pirate skiff could stand off and cover them but to be honest with the lean manning on these ships there's a good chance that wouldn't be needed. Hell some of the big tankers if they boarded forward the crew probably couldn't get there before a couple of pirates were on-board! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Growler67 0 Posted May 8, 2009 My question is...how exactly to these Somali pirates threaten the ships? Do they threaten to shoot RPGs into the hull, or...? A means of scaling the distance is usually accomplished by grapling hook (or similar 'homemade' equivalent) attached to a rope (or two). Knotted or not, climbing up to and over the rail isn't too difficult at that point. Keep in mind that the attack doesn't usually begin with the boarding. It is generally initiated with a couple/few RPG's followed by small arms fire until the Captain slows or stops the vessel in fear of more "attacks". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
column5 62 Posted May 8, 2009 climbing up to and over the rail isn't too difficult at that point. OK, it seemed like it would be a difficult task to accomplish...but I guess if you are practiced at it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Silverbolt 104 Posted May 8, 2009 Is an RPG effective with all the wind blowing at the see , and the waves? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JediMaster 451 Posted May 8, 2009 Depends on the range and size of the target. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+SkippyBing 8 Posted May 8, 2009 You'd have to be a pretty poor shot to miss a cargo ship, although I'm guessing they start off with a few warning shots anyway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+hgbn 91 Posted May 8, 2009 You'd have to be a pretty poor shot to miss a cargo ship, although I'm guessing they start off with a few warning shots anyway. It will be like standing in the barn shooting and NOT hit the barn Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Growler67 0 Posted May 8, 2009 Is an RPG effective with all the wind blowing at the see , and the waves? They are most effective when they detonate upon impact. Many do not, but that doesn't really minimize or mitigate the threat when they are being shot at your vessel. Crew, passengers and cargo can/will be injued or damaged not to mention the potential risk of a fire being started if the deonation occurs in a "lucky" spot. Keep in mind that the crews are in most cases unarmed and few are armed only with fire control aparatus such as water hoses. Hardly equal to small arms and explosives. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Typhoid 231 Posted May 8, 2009 an RPG will really screw up most ships, including a lot of combattants, if it hits them in the right place. Generally speaking an RPG will go right through the hull into the interior of the ship just fine. About the least vulnerable ships would be a double-hulled tanker. Most any other ship would not want to take a couple of rounds if they could help it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
firehawkordy 34 Posted May 8, 2009 In answer as to how the pirates get on board a ship that size, most have a platform and accommodation ladder somewhere on the vessel. here is a typical arrangement.... http://www.flickr.com/photos/sierra2u/3227844319/sizes/l/ The Jacobs ladder usually is pulled up while underway but the accommodation ladder is usually fixed in position, so all the bad guys have to do is to snag that access point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
charlielima 328 Posted May 10, 2009 It seams to me 5 middle aged "sailors" with M-1 Garands with iron sights would induce a decision making process for the pirates as they rapidly gain weight in 150 grain increments too choose another target, or career. Assuming they are still capable of any kind of cognitive thought process that is. Well Doggies! I'm still waiting for the news about the " Mother Ship" sinking. Our French brothers are there. Remember the Rainbow Warrior? And that was in New Zealand. :ph34r: CL Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+SkippyBing 8 Posted May 10, 2009 It seams to me 5 middle aged "sailors" with M-1 Garands with iron sights would induce a decision making process for the pirates as they rapidly gain weight in 150 grain increments too choose another target, or career. You say that, one of the ones that got captured recently had a private security team on board. After they ran out of ammo they jumped overboard to avoid being captured by the pirates who they'd probably just pissed off. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Emp_Palpatine 501 Posted May 11, 2009 Most of the time, they do not shoot at their targets, apart from warning shots. They shoot when angry -successfully escaping ship, or successfull defense. They sneak around the boats, using their small and very manoeuvrable crafts and usually climb the hull using ladders or roppes. Once they are onboard, they are likely masters of the ships, using their weapons to threaten the crew. Most of the time, they do not care about the cargo. They want the crew, in order to get some ransom, as they know that ship owners won't care that much about goods, but that people are unvaluable. The only defences, apart from weapons, for the ships are evasive manoeuvers (can make quite big waves) and very high pressure fire hoses. But if it fails, and if the pirates got the ship, it's hopeless if the highjacker manage to bring the ship back to their nest: the hostages will join other hostages and be used as a shield (remember we are not speaking one or two hostages, but close to a thousand!) as long as ransoms are not paid. So, what the Alabama did: ie defeating the pirates during the attack; or what French Navy usually do (ie retaking the ship before it touch the land -even if one time, they landed in Somalia to get the sailors back) are the only practical and politically acceptable solutions. Not much can be done for the already detained hostages, but (very) agressive defense for ships is indeed a priority. By the way, growler pics are great ! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Baltazar 0 Posted May 11, 2009 Hey I think this guys were outgunned a bit, but just a bit.... http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/i...E51C2QZ20090213 Cheers, Fox Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
