navychief 1 Posted January 2, 2004 Military Timetable No matter what your party affiliation, the following is very interesting!!! The Democrats are complaining about how long the war is taking, but... It took less time to take Iraq than it took Janet Reno to take the Branch Davidian compound. That was a 51 day operation. We've been looking for evidence of chemical weapons in Iraq for less time than it took Hillary Clinton to find the Rose Law Firm billing records. It took less time for the 3rd Infantry Division and the Marines to destroy the Medina Republican Guard than it took Teddy Kennedy to call the police after his Oldsmobile sank at Chappaquiddick. It took less time to take Iraq than it took to count the votes in Florida!!!! MAN, is our military GREAT, or WHAT! Navy Chief Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Fates 63 Posted January 2, 2004 Gonna have to mass email that to all my friends now...thanks Cheif! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CowboyTodd41 133 Posted January 3, 2004 (edited) As a registered democrat most forums are a very hostile enviroment for me ;) , (although given the chance I'd vote for John McCain in a new york minute) but that Ted Kennedy thing is hilarious! Anybody remember the SNL sketch with the Clinton no pants line up and bags over their heads and Ted (Will Farrell) walks in with a drink and no pants and says "Line up? I though this was party?" Great stuff. Edited January 3, 2004 by CowboyTodd41 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
olaleier 0 Posted January 3, 2004 I don't mind a "political" debate, and I sure hope the enviroment on BioHaz is better than other places for such...it's ok to disagree! Being a leftie European ("left" isn't a very clear direction in the Norwegian political enviroment btw, thank God) I will just mention that the time from the war begun until mr Bush declared "mission accomplished" aboard the carrier is NOT the problem. I don't follow US debates, but I'm sure the number of US personnel paying the ultimate price is milked for what it's worth by the democrats. I don't appreciate the exploitive nature of such campaigning, it must be a hard time for all Americans. Janet Reno, Hillary Clinton or Teddy Kennedy may have spent much time, but they didn't have to fire so many 21 shot salutes. It's hard to say "It was wrong to start the war" nowadays. Those pictures of Saddam The Amazing Tunnel Rat were very satisfying, but I still stand by my pre-war opinion, there should not be an opportunity for a civillized country to go to war on guesswork and hunches. (Again I hope BioHaz is small enough to sustain such statements, I like discussing this, but in a proper manner, I'm not a Bush-hater) If the ends justify the means, this will set VERY ill precedence. I hope this post is taken the right way. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PG_Raptor 0 Posted January 3, 2004 As a registered democrat most forums are a very hostile enviroment for me Goodness... And here I was beginning to think you were a good guy... lol As for the whole war thing, our (US) military is the best in the world, and they showed it in Iraq. At no other point in history has any nation fought a war with so much speed, losing so few of our own, and with so little colateral damage. Now for the politics. I'm not sure I agree with the reason we went to war (even as a fairly strong right-wing), putting so much pressure on something we weren't sure about. However, the war happened, and nothing will change that. Saddam has been ousted, and now Iraq is on its way toward a democratic future. Whatever you think about it, that's the way it is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
olaleier 0 Posted January 3, 2004 I am going to write a rather long post. I hope you read it. If it looks boring, please take your time. I know long forum posts can be boring, but please bear with me on this, go back and read the rest later if it's too much, I know I would scroll past if someone didn't tell me not to. Noone can disagree with the skill of the US military. Unless you go back to bow-and-arrow days (not including mideval rape and pillage), ODS/OIF is about as clean as you can get a war. It's ugly to begin with. The US military is an amazing machine, certainly for flight-sim nerds like me. For some others it's a mean of killing and conquering, don't be surprised if other people in this world won't share your appreciation of the service. (I am not one of those, but I am not a person that watches CNN with popcorn and "Go Paveway" flags either) As for the politics, here is the problem many of us Europeans face today (us small ones, not the pro/con-find-out-what-fits-your-agenda politicians): Nothing will change the war, no problem there, but properly telling the US goverment what is right and what is not will prevent future incidents that is less fortunate. Such is not strange to history. To excuse some Europeans, most of the voices against the US effort seek to find the strongest voice with regards to their agenda. It is easier to reach to the most obvious arguments, or the arguments that brings the most rhetoric power. This is true both for presidents and for left-wing activists. The arguments can be such as "Oil = Blood", augmented by the business-connections in the Bush government, or the good old "Imperialism" which still strikes a sore chord (i.e. harmful to others) among many European citizens. We have done much harm to Africa, Asia and America. (This is true for all Westerners btw, always remember that) Now think. (Bear with me) If you've once punched someone in the face to satisfy your view of justice (he did something wrong etc), got arrested since it was illegal , got punished and learned your lesson through the punishment (or "Utopia" as it is referred to) you would probably give much effort in to tellling other potential violators what wrong they were about to commit. This is the core. The outside is not as simple. I won't bother dipping in to it. You all know that each country has it's own agenda. What I want to say is that we aren't all bad here in Euro-land. And we don't think you are all bad over there either. But we are afraid that you will continue this logic and commit other, worse acts. I know I felt bad when I saw posters that said "France is next", even though I knew it really meant nothing. I know many, with more power and influence than that particular redneck, think "Syria and North Korea are next". I am a young fool. People older than me and my drunken escapades tell me that again and again. But I will challenge both and repeat the old line: History repeats itself. No matter how much technology we may develop and how much ethics our academics may study, we will always kill eachother, always. Sometimes without guilt, sometimes with. I am sure the Romans said the same. "Now we are a righteous society". Never.. I am not saying that the American government is evil, but you have taken a step in that direction, regardless of that step having positive effects. This has happened before and it will happen again and again, hundrdes of years and thousand of years after your death. Now, I am very happy for Iraq's freedom. But you cannot expect a clean military operation to reap clean results. And you cannot expect further future operations to rid yourselves of the 9/11-scar, out of which the whole world bled, I won't say that such (or at best, lesser) operations will prevent you from it. I know some will do. Yes, we have enemies. I declare I am on one side. And that is the side of peace, whether it is obtained by military force or abstaining from it, finding other means to calm the tension between the western civilization and the muslim powers that may oppose it. Peace is the ultimate goal. Perhaps a step towards it was achieved with Operation Iraqi Freedom, or perhaps we took a step back. We will know in due time. I hope the coalition troops did not give their life in vain, and I hope the American government will adopt a line that does not dictate US supremacy, but world peace. We are your friends and you have saved us before, we owe you so much. Please help us stay friends. If you have read this entire post, please give yourself a pat on the back. I apologize for it's length but it felt very good writing it. Thanks to dictionary.com for making it possible :) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cretin 0 Posted January 3, 2004 The military is great. Politicians of all denominations suck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
navychief 1 Posted January 3, 2004 Cretin, that is a VERY true statement! All politicians lie too. It's just that some lie more than others. Heh, heh. Navy Chief Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Armourdave 0 Posted January 3, 2004 It took less time for the 3rd Infantry Division and the Marines to destroy the Medina Republican Guard than it took Teddy Kennedy to call the police after his Oldsmobile sank at Chappaquiddick. Let's not forget the RAF also had a part to play in the destruction of the Republican Guard. Cheers Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Fates 63 Posted January 3, 2004 SO....we could say that: The RAF destroyed the Republican guard faster then the paparazzi could get there <C> Fates Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CowboyTodd41 133 Posted January 3, 2004 SO....we could say that: The RAF destroyed the Republican guard faster then the paparazzi could get there <C> Fates Oh snap! Oh shoot! Oh no you didn't! No you didnt! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ruger{2RHh} 0 Posted January 3, 2004 Chief, we need more people like you to run the Navy Circus Somebody has got to babysit them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
