FM quality

[Wolpertinger 0]

Hello everybody!

 

I'm new to OFF and recently bought it due to the great reviews that I've read, so my son and me can

do a little LAN-flying together. I'm a long time flightsim fan (since C64 days back in the nineties) but

since I'm a Dad I just can't find much time for it anymore. I've been flying a little IL2 with my son lately

and it seems to me that low tech planes are the way to go (no hundreds of systems to learn ;).

 

So, on to my question. I installed CFS3 first and then OFF into the same directory. Some fooling around

with system settings and off I went. So far so good. Now I have the flight model setting to realistic but

I'm a bit astonished in how it handles. It still feels pretty simple to me, I can pull back like there's no

tomorrow but I don't get into any trouble. Doing that in IL2 would send me into a spin immediately.

 

I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, just want to know if that is how it is. Maybe I've not found the

right button or shouldn't have installed CFS3 first (just let it ask for the dvd) or there is some ini-file

to mess with?

 

Thanks in advance for any comments!

 

rob aka Wolpertinger

[Bullethead 12]

<BR>I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, just want to know if that is how it is. Maybe I've not found the<BR>right button or shouldn't have installed CFS3 first (just let it ask for the dvd) or there is some ini-file<BR>to mess with?

<BR><BR>Besides the realistic flight model, you also have to enable spins, stalls, structural failure, etc.<BR><BR>But assuming you've done that, there's this....<BR><BR>WW1 airplanes were very simple by even WW2 standards.  A great many of them had very benign flight characteristics intentionally, or as a result of having too low a wingloading and/or too high a powerloading to get into any real trouble.  Some planes from that era were notoriously TOO stable and others are still rated as some of the easiest airplanes to fly ever made.  OTOH, other WW1 planes were extremely bad fliers and notorious killers of pilots without the enemy lifting a finger.  <BR><BR>Bear in mind that each plane has its own individual flight model.  Thus, your experience of the flight model depends a lot on which particular airplane you fly.  If you fly a Pup, then everything is easy although you MIGHT break it under certain extreme conditions.  If you fly a DH2, things seem easy right up to the unheralded, unrecoverable spin that seems to happen in the middle of what you think is the good part of its envelope.  Most planes are somewhere in between these extremes, though.  Some are angels, some are sows in heat, but most are generally OK although with a few bad habits that you have to learn to work around, and with further practice can perhaps even exploit.  But remember, you have to filter all this through your accumlated lifetime of simming and/or real flying.  For instance, some folks find the OFF Camel beyond them but others find it easy.  Same thing in real life--it killed a lot of pilots in accidents, but others swore by it.<BR><BR>In general, as time progresses, the flying qualities of planes improve.  Those of 1915-16 vintage are more prone to have nasty surprises in store (tempered by their overall lack of general performance), those of 1918 vintage are usually forgiving (although powerful enough to get into serious trouble) but perhaps touchy in 1 or more areas, and those of 1917 range the gamut.  This meshes neatly with the overall danger presented by the enemy.  The overall threat level remains more or less constant, but as time goes by, it shifts from being largely the fault of your own ride to being largely the fault of the enemy.<BR><BR>At the bottom line, remember that in WW1, a landing speed above 40-45 knots was long considered too "hot" for most pilots.  Therefore, if your plane is built to land at such a low speed, it's going to stall at an even slower speed in level flight.  It will stall at a somewhat higher speed in a tight turn, but if it can't do much more than 100 knots (or often less) at its best altitude, it can be hard for it to turn hard enough even to see an accelerated stall.  As mentioned above, pathetic performance (by later standards) can keep you out of trouble.<BR><BR>Performance-wise, WW1 planes were somewhere between modern ultralights and Cessena 152s.  If you've flown either in real life, or have spent any significant time simming....  seriously, how much trouble can you get into, apart from breaking the plane or falling victim to some poor general design "feature"? <BR><BR>EDIT:  I forgot to say, "Welcome Aboard!"<BR><BR>New guy buys the drinks <IMG class=bbc_emoticon alt= src="http://forum.combatace.com/public/style_emoticons/default/drinks.gif"> Edited October 2, 2009 by Bullethead

[Bullethead 12]

Sorry for the wall-o-text there. But let this serve as a lesson. In general, do NOT edit your posts here, or they can get hosed up as you see above.

 

So in case you missed it trying to read the bastardized HTML and normal formatting, welcome aboard and new guy buys the drinks

[Wolpertinger 0]

Hey Bullethead,

 

thanks for the quick response! Real beer will be served should you ever fly by south Germany, location Lake of Constance! :)

 

Well, for one part I did already think about the possibility of WW1 aircraft being more forgiving ... but the slow landing speeds

and therefore necessarily more stable flying you mentioned was kind of an "aha" thought, thanks!

 

I'm no real pilot and so can only go by how "real" does it feel. In that respect I find IL2 or when talking about jets, the Flanker

series, far more natural. Is that a valid judgement, or how do you compare it to IL2 (maybe apple vs pears, but just think feel

of flight)? It can still be a good sim, no question, I spent my best sim hours in EF2k and when I went back to it after Falcon4

and Lomac I also thought that it had an arcadeish flight model. Still it was tons of fun back then.

 

I haven't seen specific buttons for stalls and spins, but everything I saw concerning flight (wind, aircraft stress, etc.) I put on

realistic/hard. :)

 

Oh, and so far I've only been flying the DIII Albatros (I had to fire OFF up and look ;). I'm still only into my first minutes in this

sim due to time constraints, but winter is coming up and that may have sonny boy and me get some "fresh air"! :)

Also still have to set up the TrackIR and hotas ...

 

rob aka Wolpertinger

[Wolpertinger 0]

Hi uncleal,

 

that is a great little movie (the guy removing the stops is quite a hero! ;). Thanks!

 

Well, I did a search on flight model in the forum some weeks ago but didn't find anything.

I'll check out the noob and beginner sections if I need technical help, of course.

 

rob aka Wolpertinger

[+Polovski 414]

Try out some other craft something more twitchy like the Dr1 or Camel maybe, the Albatros is a good solid performer but a little tougher on the controls.

 

There are tips on flying the Camel in an older thread I think.

[Bullethead 12]

thanks for the quick response! Real beer will be served should you ever fly by south Germany, location Lake of Constance! :)

 

If you're ever condemned to spend any time in my part of Lousy Anna, I'll serve you some real beer (home-made) if you drop by.

 

I'm no real pilot and so can only go by how "real" does it feel. In that respect I find IL2 or when talking about jets, the Flanker

series, far more natural. Is that a valid judgement, or how do you compare it to IL2 (maybe apple vs pears, but just think feel

of flight)? It can still be a good sim, no question, I spent my best sim hours in EF2k and when I went back to it after Falcon4

and Lomac I also thought that it had an arcadeish flight model. Still it was tons of fun back then.

 

The vast bulk of my simming has been in WW2 MMO things like Aces High, which seems fairly close to IL2. Most of the rest has been in RB2/3D and OFF, although I did have EF2K back in the day. All my real flying has been in rather light things, however, with performance about like WW1 planes. The Piper "Traumahawk" in which I took my lessons comes to mind as an example of a fragile, low-powered thing with some evil spin characteristics, which would be right at home in 1916.

 

If you've done a lot of WW2 sims, the WW1 planes are all more anemic than Zekes or even the old Polikarpovs of IL2. Even "fast" planes like SPADs and SE5s are slow compared to anything even a decade later. Essentially, every WW1 plane is a turnfighter, but this is divided up into planes that don't turn very well but lack the power to think about the vertical, planes that turn great, and planes that turn OK but have the macho to do most of their turning in the vertical (although without being able to do real E-fighter moves except at their extreme top speeds and with the enemy rather slower).

 

Oh, and so far I've only been flying the DIII Albatros (I had to fire OFF up and look ;).

 

That's one of the better-behaved planes. It's only real handicap is that you can break the wings off if you go too fast, and it begins to show its age beyond its 1917 heyday. If you want something evil fly, try a DH2 or Fokker E.III. Camels and Dr.Is have some bad habits but are more truly said to be "tricky" rather than "evil". The Pfalz D.III used to be evil (besides having about the worst performance of its day), but the latest patch has tweaked it and I haven't flown it yet, so don't know what it's like now. Early reports by others indicate it's no longer evil, but I'm sure it's still totally outclassed by the opposition in most aerodynamic respects.

[NS13Jarhead 6]

You want stalls? Fly a SPAD VII, or try a low speed barrel roll in a DH-2. The deHavilland I can deal with, but the SPADs are another matter - not enough lift on the wings. Also, I don't like the SE5A, but that's just because the two different guns conflict with my sense of symmetry. I love the Dr.I and Camel. I guess I'm a natural turn fighter vice energy fighter. For what it's worth, one of the long absent board members, WF2, says she has actually flown a Dr.I replica and gave high marks to its FM.

 

 

[Olham 164]

Welcome, Wolpertinger

 

Did you check your "Workshop" settings? The flight model should be on realistic there;

also check some other realism settings there. To get the best possible graphics, go to

check the FAQs at www.overflandersfields.co

 

Oh, and please give me your town (Konstanz am Bodensee?), for the OFF Pilots Map. Thanks!

[Gremlin_WoH 0]

Oh, and please give me your town (Konstanz am Bodensee?), for the OFF Pilots Map. Thanks!

 

Hmmmmm ... Lake Constance ist der Bodensee. Da wären außer Konstanz auf Deutscher Seite etwa noch Friedrichshafen, Meersburg, Überlingen und Lindau etc. aber er könnte auch auf Österreichischer oder Schweizer Seite wohnen. Ein Wolpertinger ist aber das Bayerische Nationalviech. Also Lindau und Umgebung. Spekulation

 

Gruß zum Bodensee und willkommen im Forum

Edited October 2, 2009 by Gremlin_WoH

[Olham 164]

Lake Constance IST der Bodensee?? Warum benennen diese Ausländer immer alles um?

[Wolpertinger 0]

Hey hey, this is a nice and friendly place! Thanks chaps, for all the answers!

 

I'll try all those areal recommendations. Gotta work on the house today (it's national holiday over here) but tonight

I gonna give it another go (installing TrackIR first, though).

 

@Bullethead:

Homemade beer ... RESPECT! I'd love to give it a try, but it's been a while since my last visit to the US ('94). Just

two weeks ago I set up my first 15 gallons of wine and that should be fermenting nicely now. I'm more the beer

kinda guy, though!

 

I always wanted to become a pilot but that was not to be. The closest I get to flying myself is with my motocross

machine and that is not overly high or far. Anyway.

 

@Olham:

Yep, I did check, and recheck, and yet recheck the Workshop settings. I'll check out your graphics tuning link,

as I do get quite low frames at times. Thanks!

 

The town I'm staying is called Meckenbeuren (close to Friedrichshafen, home to the Zeppelin).

 

@Gremlin_WoH:

You're right, a Wolpertinger is a bavarian legendary beast. Being a Bavarian and also consistently called a crazy

and definitely off-the-norm guy it kinda describes me pretty well.

 

@uncleal:

I have seen this flic before, impressive stuff. The stuff he's saying is nothing special, just some audio background

to accompany his great juggling.

 

 

Ok folks, thanks again!

 

Later!

 

rob aka Wolpertinger

[Olham 164]

For the non-Bavarians: a Wolpertinger is a beast mixed together from various animals.

Like this one:

 

 

[Hasse Wind 46]

If you feel like you're having it too easy, I recommend you start a career flying the DH2. Pretty soon you'll start having deadly spins for no good reason at all.

 

Willkommen, Herr Wolpertinger. Der Kaiser braucht uns alle!

 

(Though I have to wonder how on earth you're going to fit into the cockpit with all those horns and duck feet...)

[Blue781 0]

Willkommen, Herr Wolpertinger. Der Kaiser braucht uns alle!

 

 

 

My Thoughts exactly Meine Herr... Welcome to the front, its been a deadly meat grinder since 16 with no end in sight.. The drinks are on you of course as we only expect you to live 2 weeks anyways.. hahahahaha ;)

 

to steal a line from Aces High (an GREAT movie by the way to get u in the mood)

 

Why give us parachutes when they can send schoolboys with 14 hours flying time to us instead....

 

Welcome again to the forum and to ze endless war against the krumpet menace!!

 

Blue781

[Wolpertinger 0]

Hehe, the Kaizer, ey?! I iz here, though with one too many already! Been sitting on the garage in my

furry seat with a horn full of finest brew, staring into the full moon.

 

Anyway. It's wifey's evening tonite and missy is to be thoroughly pleased ... but I may get OFF re-installed

and TrackIR going alongside (pah, and they say men can't handle multi-tasking! ;) .

 

Aces High ... saw the movie long ago ... pretty good! But same goes for the ol' Maiden song: "... There goes

the siren that warns of the air raid ... got to get up for the coming attack ... gathering speed as we head

down the runway ... run, live to fly, fly to live, do or die!"

 

Alrightey folks, put a few bullets where it hurts!

 

rob aka Wolpertinger

[Bullethead 12]

Homemade beer ... RESPECT! I'd love to give it a try, but it's been a while since my last visit to the US ('94). Just two weeks ago I set up my first 15 gallons of wine and that should be fermenting nicely now. I'm more the beer kinda guy, though!

<BR><BR>Making beer is no harder than making bread from scratch. It's the same thing, except with beer you keep the liquid and with bread you keep the solid. HOWEVER, ales are considerably easier to make than lagers. So, unless you like UK beers, you'll find it difficult to make anything like is common in Germany. <BR><BR>Almost forgot--we have a "wolpertinger" beast or 2 around where I live.  Native to this area are the carnivorous Bopotamus and it's prey, the Nauga.  The latter is valuable for its skin, which of course is naugahide.  Out in the swamps nearby, there's also the skunkape, and of course the craygator.  Out in my native Texas, there's the Jackalope, which looks like the front part of the wolpertinger pic Olham posted. Edited October 4, 2009 by Bullethead

[Olham 164]

Now we only have to wait a little, 'til someone comes up with the bigfoot.

[Wolpertinger 0]

Yep, UK beers are fine, Guinness is my favorite to be honest. My friend also made his own brew, which wasn't much more than

throwing some hops into a bucket of water and adding some yeast (or sum'n close to that, I wasn't there). "Real" brewing is a

more complex process I understand ... actually, I don't, but what the heck, lets just pop one! Cheers!

 

Back to topic I found out that TrackIR is a nobrainer, just start it and it works! :)

 

Still need to work on the low frames, but for that I'll search the forum, no worries! ;)