British Twoseater Campaign

[Creaghorn 10]

i had in the past very long german twoseater campaigns until switching to scouts and it was fun (e.G. Ulrich Wolf if anyone remembers).

 

for a while now i'm doing a british twoseater campaign (when time permitts), now january 1916 with BE2c's. i'm using bletchleys mission mod (thank you sir) with all the lone wolf missions, but i have altered them a bit and added more variations. e.G. i erased the formation recon missions.

i must say it's also great fun again not to think too much about dogfighting but doing the tasks of the twoseaterpilots.

i have 90% lone wolf missions with different tasks.

trenchrecon, recon behind enemy lines to photograph suspicious movements, missions without any particurlar task with a handful bombs and target at will if i wish to, contacting troops etc (although the flare-thing doesn't work), and every now and then, if there is an important target indentified (camps, railstations, airfields, trenches) a big scale bombing run with the whole formation. that's the only missions with others involved.

very satisfying campaign so far. i chose a very average squadron because the pilots there don't die in such a high rate. enough time at least to know all your mates (i have a word-file with each AI pilot with a pic and a brief history of the guy, and additionally names from another campaign i took from to represent the observers. if one pilot is missing, then by rolling dies automatically one observer is also missing)

 

i must say it's really fun so far. especially i was used for enemies beeing very aggressive when i had the long roland campaign and here there are not. reason is that enemy scouts see the rolands as scouts, not as twoseaters, and AI against scouts is always more aggresssive. but here with BE's just one or two dangerous attacks and then they mostly leave you. IMO more realistic behaviour of Fokker Eindeckers in those times. only thing i don't like is when running in to larger Fokker Eindecker formations over own territory while i'm trying to reach the lines.

 

cheers

creaghorn

Edited October 12, 2011 by Creaghorn

[DukeIronHand 8]

All these two-seater campaigns people here fly, and are apparently enjoying, have inspired me to give my own a try.

I do have a BR/F2B campaign going but its still really a fighter campaign as OFF lacks "life" for the observer.

 

I figured to do a FE2 campaign starting in January, 1917. The only question now is which squadron?

 

And I'll have to look at the mission files (Bletchley) and perhaps tweak one or two as I did the fighter file.

[Wayfarer 5]

Only thing i don't like is when running in to larger Fokker Eindecker formations over own territory while i'm trying to reach the lines.

 

cheers

creaghorn

 

Creaghorn, that is one thing that bugged me when my I was in 1915/16. That issue seemed to fade in the second half of 1916 (as do the Eindeckers themselves, of course), but I hope it's something they might be able to address in P4.

[+Winder 32]

Creaghorn, that is one thing that bugged me when my I was in 1915/16. That issue seemed to fade in the second half of 1916 (as do the Eindeckers themselves, of course), but I hope it's something they might be able to address in P4.

 

It is - the scaling of the OOB has been sorted....

 

WM

[DukeIronHand 8]

Ah...another P4 sign from the maker!

 

When, when, when?

[Creaghorn 10]

Creaghorn, that is one thing that bugged me when my I was in 1915/16. That issue seemed to fade in the second half of 1916 (as do the Eindeckers themselves, of course), but I hope it's something they might be able to address in P4.

 

it's not a big deal for me because i'm relatively close to the lines anyway, 80% of flying time is over or behind enemy lines. it's great to be on this hughe airfield northwest of Albert. i also went once with this pilot in QC (never die ticked cause you never know and no record of flighttime) on an extended joyride with the bike. very cool

[TaillyHo 2]

All these two-seater campaigns people here fly, and are apparently enjoying, have inspired me to give my own a try.

I do have a BR/F2B campaign going but its still really a fighter campaign as OFF lacks "life" for the observer.

 

I figured to do a FE2 campaign starting in January, 1917. The only question now is which squadron?

 

And I'll have to look at the mission files (Bletchley) and perhaps tweak one or two as I did the fighter file.

 

Duke, make sure you read Bullethead's pilot guide for the Fee over at the SIA thread. As to squads - at that time you'd be best placed in RFC 20 as they are rated 'good', otherwise 22 would be another option.

Good luck with that campaign!

[Wayfarer 5]

It is - the scaling of the OOB has been sorted....

 

WM

 

Oh dear ...I keep telling myself I'll get around to trying a scout, but with all these things that would improve a two seater campaign I can see myself ending up back in 1915 with BE2s again!

[Hasse Wind 46]

I've been flying British and French two-seater campaigns more than anything else for several months now. It's challenging and fun, and occasionally boring too.

 

I'm glad to know we won't be seeing large Eindecker formations cruising behind Entente lines in P4. It's extremely unrealistic and hurts the immersion every time I encounter them in 1915 - 1916.

[33LIMA 972]

I've been flying British and French two-seater campaigns more than anything else for several months now. It's challenging and fun, and occasionally boring too.

 

I'm glad to know we won't be seeing large Eindecker formations cruising behind Entente lines in P4. It's extremely unrealistic and hurts the immersion every time I encounter them in 1915 - 1916.

 

This is why the greatest need for the OFF planeset is 1915-16 German and French 2-seaters, which we'll get in P4 with the Morane parasol and the Aviatik CII, both really excellent choices, especially the former as it saw RFC/RNAS service too (even German, as the Pfalz A type). At that point, a 1915-15 Entente scout campaign will become viable.

 

Scout campaigns for any period before 2-seaters are available are a waste of time IMHO. A bigger problem for RoF (I won't say 'the other sim', as there two 'other sims' ie FE as well) which has few 2-seaters and zilch before late '16 (DFW) and mid-'17 (F2B, Br14, RE8 will help but still 'nada' for 1915 and nearly all of 1916).

 

Then (I've said it before and I'll say it again) OFF needs a 1917-18 French 2-seater (Br14 A & B preferably), a DH4 and another, later-war German 2-seater (Rumpler CIV coming but no sign yet of the former two much-needed gap-fillers).

[Hasse Wind 46]

Then (I've said it before and I'll say it again) OFF needs a 1917-18 French 2-seater (Br14 A & B preferably), a DH4 and another, later-war German 2-seater (Rumpler CIV coming but no sign yet of the former two much-needed gap-fillers).

 

We'll see them and more in the expansion packs, I guess.

[Olham 164]

It is - the scaling of the OOB has been sorted....

 

WM

Signs of life from somewhere under a pile of notes, sheets and print-outs!

I love this to happen - just when you think they don't have time to even look

into the forum at all, you get a short, but sweet surprise like this one.

Good show!

Edited October 12, 2011 by Olham

[DukeIronHand 8]

Duke, make sure you read Bullethead's pilot guide for the Fee over at the SIA thread. As to squads - at that time you'd be best placed in RFC 20 as they are rated 'good', otherwise 22 would be another option.

Good luck with that campaign!

 

Thanks for the tip TaillyHo.

 

I think you are correct about 20 Squadron. Oddly I was thinking about them already as they figure greatly (FE2-wise) in the air war of early 1917.

 

I did d/l the FE2 SIA but never studied it which I will do now.

 

I have already done the file change to make the FE a "fighter-bomber" in the past so I figure I am raring to go

[themightysrc 5]

Why not have the Albatros C series in the game? Surely straightforward to model and then to produce the many variants?

 

I'll add a big yea to an add on of two seaters in any case, and if that might include various birds from 1915-16, then so much the better, particularly French and German ones.

 

Don't worry devs - we know you're flat out and over stretched. Just go with the numbers and don't get hung up on richly detailed aircraft for the early period. You're filling out a war, and I can't imagine that too many people would cry foul if two seaters we get weren't as exactly modelled as the scouts, which, let's face it, is why many/most people play. IMHO.

[Hasse Wind 46]

Don't worry devs - we know you're flat out and over stretched. Just go with the numbers and don't get hung up on richly detailed aircraft for the early period. You're filling out a war, and I can't imagine that too many people would cry foul if two seaters we get weren't as exactly modelled as the scouts, which, let's face it, is why many/most people play. IMHO.

 

I have to disagree. P4 is going to be a great improvement over P3 in the visual department too, and it would be a shame if the two-seaters weren't up to the new standards. I'd rather wait a bit longer for properly made models than get things faster but in a less polished state. And it would be harder to make more people interested in two-seaters, if they were modelled more poorly. This is the situation in P3 for the most part, and there's no reason to not improve things in P4.

[+Winder 32]

I have to disagree. P4 is going to be a great improvement over P3 in the visual department too, and it would be a shame if the two-seaters weren't up to the new standards. I'd rather wait a bit longer for properly made models than get things faster but in a less polished state. And it would be harder to make more people interested in two-seaters, if they were modelled more poorly. This is the situation in P3 for the most part, and there's no reason to not improve things in P4.

 

ALL 2 seaters are being overhauled....

 

ALL craft.

 

WM

[Hasse Wind 46]

Wonderful. You're the best.

[Olham 164]

I knew they'd never do it "half-baked". Great news again, Winder!

[TaillyHo 2]

Thanks for the tip TaillyHo.

 

I think you are correct about 20 Squadron. Oddly I was thinking about them already as they figure greatly (FE2-wise) in the air war of early 1917.

 

I did d/l the FE2 SIA but never studied it which I will do now.

 

I have already done the file change to make the FE a "fighter-bomber" in the past so I figure I am raring to go

 

Duke, just know that the Fee is a rather unique flying (and fighting) experience compared with anything else in OFF. My only word of caution about you being raring to go, would be to suggest you enlist your first Fee pilot a whole year earlier - so you are only going up against EIIIs (not a particularly fearsome opponent).

 

Once you've got the hang of Fee-specific skills - like following a more nimble opponent in such a way as to optimise the rather limited ammo supply your gunner has to work with (and remembering in the Fee, you don't actually get to do any shooting - unless you swap seats and let the AI steer the ship!!) - then you could take your chances in 1917 (knowing you'll have Albatri, Rolands and DFWs to 'play' with).

[DukeIronHand 8]

Oh TaillyHo how much more real could OFF get?

 

I'll be realistically simulating a low-time pilot fresh out of flight school and rushed to the front as a replacement for losses sustained under the lash of the Alb scourge.

 

I'll just avoid the mess binge prior to my first flight!

[Creaghorn 10]

Oh TaillyHo how much more real could OFF get?

 

I'll be realistically simulating a low-time pilot fresh out of flight school and rushed to the front as a replacement for losses sustained under the lash of the Alb scourge.

 

I'll just avoid the mess binge prior to my first flight!

 

 

that's exactly the point. how much more real could OFF get?

especially in early 1916/late 1915 the whole thrill is not the fighting itself. if you look through young british two seater pilots eyes, then you know there is the wunderwaffe fokker out there, and that's enough to scare you because your virtual self doesn't know yet how obsolete the fokker in real is. you know that there is somewhere a guy named boelcke and another one called professor immelmann who are caching twoseaters one after another. but your job in twoseaters is looking at the ground, and in this great scenerie there is enough to look at. when you are over the lines, then you look down and ask yourself what's that small facility? what convoy is that? is this a farm or something else? is this railstation getting supplies? could be a target for a bombing run tomorrow.

and that's the things you do in the rather passive months. when an offensive starts and hell breaks out, then there is much more to do because you are helping the chaps down there as good as you can.

you have enough great scenerie and immersion to live a good twoseater campaign. actually much more than cruising through the air looking for enemies.

 

 

Don't worry devs - we know you're flat out and over stretched. Just go with the numbers and don't get hung up on richly detailed aircraft for the early period. You're filling out a war, and I can't imagine that too many people would cry foul if two seaters we get weren't as exactly modelled as the scouts, which, let's face it, is why many/most people play. IMHO.

 

seems that for a moment the impatience overwhelmed you. do you really think that the devs would do it like that, do you?

[themightysrc 5]

HI Creaghorn,

 

I'm sure they'll do it 100% as they normally do!

 

It was simply my contribution based upon logistics. I probably omitted to say that I meant AI only aircraft, as opposed to flying ones. The problem for OBD is, as acknowledged by them I think, that they've not got the resources to fulfill everyone's wishes for new planes covering all the gaps in all the periods to everyone's satisfaction - that would take literally years, I sure. My suggestion was where 'the supporting cast' of also rans was produced - say, the BE8, for instance - that most people wouldn't really hanker to fly in given their utterly dismal performance, then less detailed models would suffice as the only time you'd be looking at it would be via a gunsight!

 

Of course, if the devs wish to prove me wrong about resource constraints and produce P4 with a slew of new aircraft that are all flyable and richly detailed, then I'll be more than happy to break out the Moet and toast them.

 

 

Cheers,

Si

[33LIMA 972]

If this goes the way I think it's going, it looks like we will get the best of both worlds - many new planes, and all of them flyable. The new factor is Winder's specific enquiry here about interest in plane packs, a sort of HITR with 'just' planes (and the associated squadrons, skins etc, but little or no other stuff like terrain or Workshop upgrades). So once P4 is out, the dev's can switch the effort onto planepacks, a revenue stream for OBD and a new plane stream for us. Granted, many of the planes that won't be in P4 may be the less sexy ones, but I for one would be very interested in planepacks with such types as the Pfalx DVIII and DXII, LVG CVI, Halb CLII, AEG GIV, Roland DVI, DH9, DH4 (still hoping to see than in P4!), BE2e, AW FK8, Martinsyde Elephant, Vickers gunbus, FE8, Salmson 2A2, Br14, Voisin 5, a Letord or a Caudron, even the unloved 'Bloater...as you know, there are so many, and a judicious mix in each pleneset of sexier and less sexy planes would help keep sales up.

[themightysrc 5]

HI Lima,

 

Well, we can but hope. I'll be happy either way, I'm sure, but I'm simply keen to see the skies filled from 1915 with more varied aircraft and if plane packs are the way to achieve that, there'll be no grumbles from me. I just hope that when they decide the aircraft to include they bear in mind first and foremost the numbers used of each type and over what period - the exact reason why the DFW was a great idea and why the Fokker DVIII should never, IMHO, have seen the light of day, given the numbers and operational life. I wonder how many Hanriot HD1s saw service? Now wouldn't that be nice - the Belgian air force in P4....

 

Cheers,

Si

[DukeIronHand 8]

There is also an additional problem.

 

Its not just making the plane and all those skins (complicated and time consuming as that must be) and dropping it into the OFF folder.

 

Many other files have to be changed, I think, to integrate them into the campaign structure.

 

Hey 33LIMA! What are you doing here? I was waiting for further results of your two-seater/observer Field of Fire testing. Back to work! Or is this your lunch break?