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knoby1973

SF2 Europe - Harrier Problem (Trouble Hovering, on Thrust Vector Control...)

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Anyone having trouble with the Harrier's Takeoff and Landing - VTOL "Thrust Vector Control"? I just installed Strike Fighter 2 Europe; (I’m having a great time by the way)... But when, I fly the GR 1-3 Harrier(s). I’m experiencing some Gimble Lock issues.. I noticed if I take off on Base and try to hover above (Ascend-take off - up). I cannot take off; when trying to get the aircraft to go up then the nose of the aircraft falls back down. Other Scenario is I am starting a mission in the air, and I want to hover all the way down to the ground (Descend). Once I cut my throttle to Zero, and maneuver my Thrust vector. I drop in altitude; I go down, cannot hover in altitude or control my descent.

 

So I talked to a few folks on the Forum here, then they said that my "Stores" - Ordinance my be too heavy for take off and land. I generally am “Armed to the Teeth” and do have 30,000 lbs plus loaded Fuel and Bombs, and few MATRAs LOL... I know my CONFIG on my CH Combat Axis Wheel is set and when I do an external view on my aircraft I can operate the thrusters with “Vector Control Feature mapped correctly “They Move Back and Forth". Also Note on the Strike Fighters 1 Europe, I had no trouble regardless of how much weight I had. So is this a new feature that is added to Strike Fighters 2 Europe, where the weight is causing the Aircraft to not hover? And as I remember one of the folks online here said that if I dump all my weapons on a run, then I should be able to Vector down , descending or ascending in hovering altitude at this point….Any Ideas?..on what the problem to this Symptom could be?

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...Once I cut my throttle to Zero, and maneuver my Thrust vector. I drop in altitude; I go down, cannot hover in altitude or control my descent.

 

...

 

I doubt you'll be able to do much (especially hover) with your throttle at 0.

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Okay..so basically I need to have a little throttle and balance the thrust vector control as well... Or do you recommend anything else?

 

 

 

I doubt you'll be able to do much (especially hover) with your throttle at 0.

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If you want to practice hovering, do not put anything under the wings and don't load ammo. That will let you take off and land vertically, but the Harrier is highly unstable in hover mode (seriously, it's worse than almost any helicopter).

On an ordinary mission you can't really take off vertically since you're too heavy, but after expending the ordnance and burning some fuel you might be able to land. That's a good way to fail a mission, unless you do a helicopter-style landing: simultaneously slowing down and descending while keeping your eye on a spot on the ground, going into hover a metre above the spot for a second and vertically descending onto the concrete.

 

I doubt you'll be able to do much (especially hover) with your throttle at 0.

That as well. Thrust vectoring is of little use without the thrust.

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What Malibu said.

 

Also keep in mind, and I know you couldn't do it in WoE not with a full payload, the Harrier is not designed or capable of vertical Take Off with a full combat load, maybe for a light scramble but that's about it. Also if you use short take off you can take off in a few dozen meters. For a short take off the real plane uses a bug that as soon as the plane reaches a certain speen (relatively slow) the nozels rotate down (not full down) and that way it can get airborn real fast, real short. Because the wings are generating lift and then you get the engine thrust pointed down. You can do the same in the game but there's no bug and you have to point the nozels manualy once you feel you're fast enough. Just Try it and see.

 

And I don't think you are ment to try to descend from altitude using VTOL, I can imagine all sort of way's of ending upside down doing that. Even an Helicopter will soon find it self in trouble trying to descend too fast straight vertical.

U can use thrust vectoring in some cool air-combat manovers though, Like decelarating fast and gaining altitude, a hit-the-brakes manover that not even Tom Cruise could pull off in his Tomcat, If you are sucessfull in making the bandit Overshoot, you can use your extra altitude to gain speed and let him have some.

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In addition to what others have said you will find you require near full throttle to hover whn carrying minimal external stores (i.e. ecternal tanks and a pair of Sidewinders) and circa 1200lbs internal fuel. The only time a Harrier will normaly be in a true hover is at an airshow, even coming aboard a ship it will still have the better part of 30knots A/S + wind.

 

Craig

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Okay..so basically I need to have a little throttle and balance the thrust vector control as well... Or do you recommend anything else?

 

 

 

 

 

You need to have A LOT of throttle. All the thrust vectoring does is vary the direction of the thrust from the engine. For regular flight, the nozzles should be pointed back. For hovering, VTOL, etc... you vary the angle of the nozzles to get the right combination of vertical thrust and forward/backward thrust.

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Thanks, for the useful information. A question though, when you go to an Airshow and see a Harier Hover up off the ground. Is it using a combination of throttle and thrust vector? what is their operation?

 

In addition to what others have said you will find you require near full throttle to hover whn carrying minimal external stores (i.e. ecternal tanks and a pair of Sidewinders) and circa 1200lbs internal fuel. The only time a Harrier will normaly be in a true hover is at an airshow, even coming aboard a ship it will still have the better part of 30knots A/S + wind.

 

Craig

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Thanks, for the useful information. A question though, when you go to an Airshow and see a Harier Hover up off the ground. Is it using a combination of throttle and thrust vector? what is their operation?

 

 

 

Your throttle controls how much thrust the engine is producing.

 

Thrust vector controls which direction that thrust is pointed.

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Also you have to Remember that is impossible to take off vertical with a full load out due to too much weight for the engine and plus in real life they dont take vertical due to,Too much fuel consumption. plus you also have to remember in this sim not all planes are simulated properly. But how ever with the right weight and throttle control it is possible to hover above ground it takes alot of practice.I can tell you this when you take off have your nossle pointed 75 to 85 degree's downward even with a heavy loadout you will have a very short takeoff.

Edited by mach driver

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British GR Harriers are Classified as S/VTOL Meaning, Short/Vertical Take of / Landing. Short Take off when loaded, Vertical when darn near empty.

 

Get a rolling start, and vector down (forgot how much, like 40-50 degrees), ascend, put nozzles back to zero

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