Atlantic Fleet - the CombatAce review

[33LIMA 972]

Some more screenshots:

 

If you've played Silent Hunter 3, you'll remember stalking Barham in U-331. Well, this is the Atlanic Fleet version:

 

 

Some U-Boat action against the convoys:

 

 

 

Scharnhorst finds HMS Glorious, in the North Sea:

 

 

Adent and Acasta try to screen the carrier with smoke (which is still too effective, blocking a 'firing solution' even when there is still a line of sight) :

 

 

Stringbag -vs- Salmon and Gluckstein, after Glorious manages to launch a single strike, before a hit on her flight deck puts a sudden halt to flying operations:

 

 

But it all goes horribly Pete Tong:

 

 

I would really like the ability to engage a second taget with a secondary armament in the same firing turn, and I am wondering whether the turn-based firing system takes any account of different rates of fire between lighter and heavier guns. At any rate the overall effect is really something, and the turn-based gameplay means it isn't a click-fest, but provides time to think...which I need lots of!

[dsawan 613]

Can you shell land targets in the game like d-day/

[33LIMA 972]

I think this is sea-battles only! Apart from the maps, I have not seen land yet, let alone shelled it! I have never tried to sail a damaged ship back to port after a battle, or tried to see if I could take Scharnhorst up to shell Spitzbergen (Operation Sicily)! Amphibious operations are not really a good fit with the Battle of the Atlantic, but I suppose they may feature in Pacific Fleet (PC) and Mediterranean Fleet, if we get them.

[33LIMA 972]

Meanwhile, I tried some destroyer action, taking Jersey and Juno out to check up on reports of German destroyers on a possible minelaying sortie off the North Sea coast.

 

The reports were correct. Two of those big enemy destroyers were indeed up to no good - Hans Lody and Erich Geise, as it was to turn out. We illuminated the enemy with starshell and set about seeing them off.

 

 

 

The action that developed was extremely satisfying. The bigger battles in Atlantic Fleet can become a bit of a handful to manage, unless you slow the pace down a tad and take your time to re-orient yourself, each time you move to a new ship - which is one reason it would be good to have the option to designate targets for the AI to engage. But two on two, or thereabouts, is just about perfect! The Huns jinked this way and that and with their heavier guns, traded round for round, starshell for starshell, and torpedo for torpedo. Atlantic Fleet is at its very best in this sort of engagement, everything from destrover-vs-destroyer, to battleship-v-battleship.

 

Juno was hit hard, but with the range winding down, she let go with a full salvo of torpedoes as the enemy raced past on a parallel track. Just when I thought I had missed - the AI in Atlantic Fleet seems to be reasonably good at spotting and 'combing' torpedo tracks - at least one tin fish ripped into Geise. She slowly lost way and began to go down by the bows. Jersey came hard about and headed straight for Lody at top speed, her fire becoming increasingly accurate as the range came down.

 

 

Head on, Jersey was a difficult target and though she took some hits, salvo after salvo from 'A' and 'B' turrets crashed into Lody.

 

 

By the time Lody had rolled over and begun to go down, both Juno and Geise had already slipped beneath the dark waves, and Jersey, while still under way and with all guns in action, was struggling to control fires in her superstructure. Britannia still ruled the waves, but a high price had been paid.

 

 

Brilliant! Simply brilliant!

[+Johan217 5]

33Lima, you did it again. First the Graviteam games and now you sold me on this one!

 

Have just started to learn the ropes but enjoying it already. The campaign sure looks like it will put many games to shame. Personally I am happy that the devs chose a turn-based format, I find that all too often "real-time" is really just a way of forcing the player to beat the game against the clock, leaving no opportunity for actual tactics/strategy or even enjoy the fancy graphics.

[33LIMA 972]

I agree Johan. Continuous gameplay is ideal, but not if it turns the game into a click-fest. Before I played Atlantic Fleet, I disliked the idea of its turn-based gameplay. Now I have been playing it, I'm appreciating that it has real benefits. And with the ability to turn off the on-screen aids - whose clever graphic design makes them quite unobtrusive, anyway - we can now enjoy the fancy graphics to the full.

 

 

 

 

One neat detail I appreciate is the fact that the gun directors and rangefinders rotate so as to train with the guns, rather than being fixed:

 

[+Hinchinbrooke 36]

Good review.  I purchased the PC version today (I already have it on tablet).  It really needs a large screen to do it justice.  It is marvelous to behold............. and fun, intriguing to play.  The campaigns can be hard; trying to destroy ships, keeping your own ships and hoping that you gain enough points to add something decent to your squadron/fleet.

 

I actually like the turn-based play.  Too many ships doing stuff at the same time, and you're tearing your hair out, trying to cope.  I have Storm Eagle's Russo-Japanese War and Jutland.  Trying to monitor large fleets is very stressful.

 

For $10 it's a veritable steal.

 

And a Med version would the icing on the cake.

Edited March 12, 2016 by Hinchinbrooke

[+Stary 2,426]

 

 

I have Storm Eagle's Russo-Japanese War and Jutland.  Trying to monitor large fleets is very stressful.

 

 

 

Exactly, have them and the people who complain about AF's UI seem to never have played those. Which is sad as those are titles with some potential but killed by insane decisions from start

Edited March 13, 2016 by Stary

[33LIMA 972]

Turn-based gameplay is not too bad for modern ground combat, where - at least from the time that fire and movement drills came into general use - troops in or expecting contact would tend to move in 'tactical bounds', with halts in between, for fire, observation or new orders. As real warships don't 'go firm' between moves, continuous gameplay is just innately better suited to naval warfare.

 

Anyone designing a real-time WW2 naval battle game should really get an XP or earlier PC and familiarise themselves thoroughly with Fighting Steel. FS provides the tools and commands that are necessary to make continuous naval suface combat work, especially when you are in comamnd of several ships and are facing a similar-sized enemy force. For example, as the commander of a division, you can order 'targetting modes', which tell ships to engage (for example) either the greatest threat to themselves ('Threat targetting'), or the enemy opposite them ('Battleline targetting') and so on. The key thing is providing AI which enables subordinates to act according to such instructions, thereby avoiding  the need for micro-management and click fests, while giving the player just enough time to think - at least, as much time as he would in real life. FS also lets you fight your own ship in detail, while giving such 'tactical directives' to your other captains. And even when fighting your own ship, you can designate targets and order speeds and courses, and the singe-ship-handling AI will do the rest, like engaging whatever targets you have designated, including using main battery and secondaries at the same time, against the same or different targets. This sort of approach won't go so far as being able to handle the full Battle of Leyte Gulf, which is more of an admiral-level, strategy game scenario, but it can adequately handle its components eg Samar.

 

Atlantic Fleet is of course much superior to Fighting Steel in many ways, not least in integrating the land, planes and subs that FS had to leave out, and of course there's the massively superior visuals. And I would not under-estimate the challenge in getting all of these elements to work well in a real-time game, which FS's developers decided was too much, as their manual's 'designer's notes' make clear. Fighting Steel left out the land, planes and subs to make the project deliverable and the game workable; Atlantic Fleet adopted a turn-based approach. Both succeed nicely, in their own ways.

[Do335 382]

I still play naval warfare simulations' (NWS) Steam and Iron, and Rule the Waves. They only have 2D graphics but are very excellent naval games.

 

And yeah before that looked at SES' Jutland. Game was... problematic. Such a shame.

 

 

ps we've likely mentioned most naval games to date... just don't say world of warships...

Edited March 13, 2016 by Do335

[+Stary 2,426]

how about World of Warships then?

 

Steel Ocean I must try some more

[33LIMA 972]

Just had another go at Bismarck's last fight, playing again as RN but this time completing the battle. Not really a fair fight, even though Bismarck seems to have fixed her rudder damage!

 

As on the last play-through, I manouevred King Geroge V and Rodney independently, while gradually closing in with my two County class cruisers.

 

 

 

The un-damaged Bismarck is a more dangerous foe than in the real-life battle, managing to land hits on both my battleships, and starting a fire on Rodney, near 'C' turret. Still, we soon found the range and as per real life, Bismarck went down gallantly, with her colours shot off rather than struck.

 

 

 

Down she went, to where Robert Ballard would find her, many years later. Come to think it, that might make a good sim, Jacques Clouseau/Robert Ballard Simulator.

 

 

Anyone who has an interest in WW2 naval warfare really out to give this great big gem - it's certainly not a little gem - a go. I'm finding it a joy to play, and the ships, scenery and effects are lovely to behold.

 

[+Johan217 5]

ps we've likely mentioned most naval games to date... just don't say world of warships...

Task Force 1942.

[Do335 382]

Task Force 1942.

eh good one Johan... gotta love the microprose classics.

 

Got anything more recent? I'm always on the look out for missing naval games. They're a bit rare/tough to find.

[33LIMA 972]

Couple of units I don't think I've illustrated before...

 

...British T Class submarine, above and below the surface:

 

 

 

...and a Lancaster, with 'Grand Slam' bomb (hitting Tirpitz while she's under way isn't as easy as when she's moored in a Norweigan fjord)...

 

 

Missed her by several hundred feet! Still, it would have been a shame to have mangled such an elegant virtual warship!

 

[+Stary 2,426]

eh good one Johan... gotta love the microprose classics.

 

Got anything more recent? I'm always on the look out for missing naval games. They're a bit rare/tough to find.

 

Shells of Fury 1914 is an odd but somehow interesting title if you're into WW1 submarines

[+Hinchinbrooke 36]

Atlantic Fleet is the first game I've purchased since 2012, such is my jaundiced view of 95% of games these days.

 

Just enjoyed a slugfest between Nelson and Scharnhorst.  Nelson sunk the German......... eventually, but her lack of speed told, and she had to be scuttled, such was her damage.

 

Great fun.

[+Johan217 5]

I just had a more modest battle, HMS Hotspur vs T-22, but it was a naibiting experience nevertheless. And while playing I found another advantage of the turn based system: I find it makes the anticipation of the incoming enemy salvo more tense, well for me anyway!

[Do335 382]

Stary: thnx, will take a look!

[+Hinchinbrooke 36]

Well done everyone.

 

Medals all round.

 

[33LIMA 972]

I would have liked the ability in Custom Battles to be able to specify the location of the battle (which may not make much difference, as I haven't seen land and am not actually sure it exists, outside of the maps!) and to be able to set up an air attack without the need for at least one nearby ship, to 'call in the strike.' But create a little convoy, pick a sub to do battle with it, and the latter can call in the planes of your choice...

 

 

The advantage of having a sub nearby, of course, is that he can deal with the survivors, surfacing to use the deck gun after letting go with the tin fish...

 

 

The merchant ships are often modelled with AA or other deck guns and will certainly shoot at and sometimes knock down attacking planes, but they cannot engage surface targets, so your U-Boat is quite safe...

 

 

I would definitely like the ability to designate targets for the AI to engage with guns, including the ability to engage in the same firing turn with different weapons; and faster rates of fire for smaller calibres.  And for when you are gunning yourself, ranging with single shots, not salvoes, and the option to have wind and ship movement taken care of by your ship's analogue fire control computer in the Transmitting Station, so your role is more like that of the guys in the Director Control Tower, complete with some initial delay while you track the target, before feeding this down to the TS for them to factor in the rest, pass this on to the guns, and then sound the firing gong (you can hear them at about 49:40 here) so you can hit the Big Red Button. However, as it is, gunnery is very interesting and rather challenging, especially if you have wind effects turned on!

[+Johan217 5]

Just two things on my wishlist for now:

 

1) Map plotting tools (at least a ruler/compass and an angle ruler)

2) I feel that capital ships are too vulnerable to torpedos. It seems like it always takes just a single hit to sink a battleship. This is especially annoying since enemy subs tend to start at very close range. Granted I am still in 1939 so I guess the destroyer shield isn't particularly effective and maybe it will improve over time. At least the game models dud torpedos, which is a feature that has saved me a couple of times now!.

[Silberpfeil 356]

Excellent!  Make the location a day or two past Gibralter enroute to Bizerte, throw in a couple Buckley and/or Edsall class DE's to prosecute the U-boat and fend off the torpedo-bombers, and you've got yourself an historical battle! 

[33LIMA 972]

I really like the Custom Battle generator, which I have been using to have a crack with some of the aircraft in Atlantic Fleet, like the B-24 Liberator, which as well as an RAF Coastal Command version, is also available in USAAF finish (or should that be USN, in which case it's a PB4Y)...

 

 

...and there's the Short Sunderland, one of which was credited with shooting down six of Kampfgeschwader 40's Ju 88C long range fighters, in the Bay of Biscay in June 1943, only for the same mostly Aussie crew to fall victim to another KG40 formation, two months later...

 

 

It's also a good way to set up practice missions of your own, up to the ten ships per side limit. I just got my first U-Boat kill while escorting a small convoy in an 'I' Class destroyer, though my slow reactions in turning the convoy away from the sonar contact astern meant that a tanker at the rear of the centre column caught a torpedo, before I could get after our assailant.

 

 

 

I had a few cracks at the periscope with my guns, one of which I think did some damage, as the submarine seemed more intent upon putting another tin fish into the tanker, rather than getting away. I had a forward-firing 'Squid' but in my excitement, turned the wrong way at the last minute. Damn and blast! A rapid course reversal managed to take me over the U-Boat so I was able to let fly with my depth charges. I had slowed down a bit and was probably lucky they didn't blow my stern off, but nobody was more surprised than I, to find we got the sub.

 

 

A great game. Simplified, but it just 'feels right' - all the fun of an arcade game, but with more than enough of the wargame and the combat simulation in there, to make it not feel like you're playing one. A hard balance to get right, but Killerfish have pulled it off. Great fun, rewarding of skill, jam-packed full of content, and a joy to behold. Love it.

[33LIMA 972]

...and Atlantic Fleet's dynamic 'Battle of the Atlantic' campaign has got me playing, something that the mighty Fighting Steel's campaign system never managed to do. Even when a turn doesn't generate a battle that you're called to fight, the results update screens give you something really good to look at...

 

 

And battles there are, a-plenty. I'm still finding my way and attacking cautiously to boot, avoiding risks rather than staying to fight it out toe-to-toe with the Royal Navy. At first, I keep my surface ships close to home waters and leave it to the U-Boats. Suddenly, I'm called to take over a battle that has developed. A mini-wolfpack, U-27 and U-28 working together, has encountered a small convoy and is well placed to attack, with one sub on either side. One is in a good position to have a crack at one of the two destroyer escorts, at the head of the convoy, and does so successfully, while the other goes for one of the merchantmen on the other side. The destroyer turns at the last minute, possibly having spotted my torpedoes. But my fan of three tin fish has been aimed with successive tracks short of the calculated interception point, in anticipation of a turn. He is quite badly knocked about by a single hit.

 

 

Two of the other sub's torpedoes also hit home, crippling a cargo ship, which begins to go under. Before the second destroyer can intervene from its station at the rear of the convoy, my first sub uses the torpedo I kept in the front tubes for self-defence to hit another cargo ship. Then I disengage, rather than hanging around with the undamaged destroyer's asdic pinging and all our front torpedo tubes needing reloaded.

 

 

Not long afterwards - I forget how long - the same two U-boats meet another convoy - with a battleship escort, as well as three destroyers. This time, the warships turn into my first sub's torpedoes and I have to settle for a hit from the other one, on a frieghter, which is damaged but does not sink. Again, rather than press my luck, I rather sheepishly go deep and disengage, passing up on the oportunity to sink a battleship as surprise has been well and truly lost.

 

Plucking up my courage, I decide to move Scharnhorst, Gneisenau and a destroyer, Leberecht Maas, from a holding position off Norway. The three succeed in breaking out into the mid-Atlantic, to the same zone where my two U-boats have been finding plenty of pickings.

 

 

My new-found valour is soon rewarded - my little battlefleet runs into a convoy, with just a single destroyer for escort!

 

 

 

We work up to full speed and begin a turn to port, to bring us onto a converging course with the convoy. Suddenly, my plans are thrown into disarray - the convoy has air cover! A Sunderland flying boat bumbles in for a bombing run, undeterred by our flak. He must be operating at maximum range, from one of those lakeland bases in Northern Ireland.

 

 

To make matters worse, his aim is good and a 250-lb bomb hits Maas, starting a fire. Verdamt! Fortunately, the Sunderland is on his own, and has shot his bolt.

 

 

The enemy destroyer now makes smoke to screen the convoy as it turns away to flee, then he charges us, shooting, possibly trying to get within torpedo range. He lands a single hit on Maas, but my two battlecriusers give up shelling the retreating merchantmen to concentrate their fire on the threat steaming right at us.

 

 

The bold destroyer soon goes down; my shooting eye seems to be in, today! And Maas succeeds in putting out the fire. She's a bit down by the bows, but still seaworthy and in action. I gather my force together. Guns silent for now, we rumble at top speed after the now-defenceless convoy. I hold my fire until we are practically on top of the fleeing ships, and after that it is really just a massacre. As I come abeam of the enemy, I switch from shooting with the forward 11-inch turrets and bring my 5.9 inch secondary batteries into play, to conserve the heavy-calibre ammunition.

 

 

So, a good result for the tonnage war! Maas is damaged but operational, and I will send her home at once - mid-Atlantic is not really a healthy place for German destroyers, with their unreliable high-pressure machinery and endurance limited by the need to retain fuel as ballast, to counter top-heaviness. But having wiped out one convoy, Scharnhorst and Gneisenau will continue to prowl the North Atlantic for a while, slipping back to a friendly port before the Home Fleet arrives to make the area really unhealthy for us. Perhaps I will draw them onto our U-Boats!

 

 

I have the impression that my two submarines had not reloaded their bow tubes when they ran into the second convoy, which may be a glitch; but that apart, I'm finding Atlantic Fleet's dynamic campaign really quite convincing - and rather addictive!