Getting the squadron into better formations

[+bortdafarm 1]

only just sussed this but it helps enormously

 

in the AIRCRAFTOBJECT.ini

 

object folder

(-use the cat extractor from the downloads section if your not sure what i mean)

 

edit the

 

[AIdata] section entry

 

MaxRollFormation=5.0

 

reducing it thus to 5 or there abouts prevents all that sloppy zooming about behind you as you head out

they settle down to a good looking flight ..

[+Tailspin 3]

Interesting find, bortdafarm. They do tend to wander around. Does the change seem to affect other things like the squadron's ability to follow you or anything like that?

[+bortdafarm 1]

you get the occasional issue when taking off..they may take a while to get into formation behind you..(those sharp turns straight after take off tend to throw them a bit..but they just take a little longer to form on you.)

other than that nothing seriuos..following waypoints etc fine..and as soon as combat starts or a enemy is detected then they maneuver at full capability..

 

the formation isn't tight they just don't over correct all the time trying to stay behind you..they just make slow casual turns..

[+Tailspin 3]

Sounds good. I'll have to give it a shot. Thanks!

[+bortdafarm 1]

Cheers Tailspin!

 

here's another possible tip for the squadron guys...i have been watching the two seaters flying in combat and one thing kept puzzling me ..why they performed far more effective evasive maneuvers than the fighters..in fact most of the time they were able to shake a fighter and get on it's tail and make an attack of their own...the fighters tend to get confused and break of an attack where-as the two seaters cling on like grim death most of the time..

 

so as an experiment i set all the fighters in the data inis from FIGHTER to ATTACK

 

[MissionData]

NationName=RAF

ServiceStartDate=06/1917

ServiceEndDate=11/1918

AircraftRole=ATTACK

 

 

and set all the two seaters from ATTACK to FIGHTER (lol i know...but the behaviour actually seems to be reversed in game)

 

and now the fighters have the upper hand... make better maneuvers and usually survive most patrols !

all i need to do now is figure out a way of upping their kill rate...

 

any way the combat is slightly more convincing to watch in the next plane view while cruising home...

 

i'll do a new version of my little AI mod as soon as i pick up a few more details

[Buckner 0]

Cheers Tailspin!

 

here's another possible tip for the squadron guys...i have been watching the two seaters flying in combat and one thing kept puzzling me ..why they performed far more effective evasive maneuvers than the fighters..in fact most of the time they were able to shake a fighter and get on it's tail and make an attack of their own...the fighters tend to get confused and break of an attack where-as the two seaters cling on like grim death most of the time..

 

so as an experiment i set all the fighters in the data inis from FIGHTER to ATTACK

 

[MissionData]

NationName=RAF

ServiceStartDate=06/1917

ServiceEndDate=11/1918

AircraftRole=ATTACK

and set all the two seaters from ATTACK to FIGHTER (lol i know...but the behaviour actually seems to be reversed in game)

 

and now the fighters have the upper hand... make better maneuvers and usually survive most patrols !

all i need to do now is figure out a way of upping their kill rate...

 

any way the combat is slightly more convincing to watch in the next plane view while cruising home...

 

i'll do a new version of my little AI mod as soon as i pick up a few more details

 

This sounds like what I have been waiting for! Being new to this, where is the data.ins folder located so I would be able to make this change and try it out? Thank you.

[+Tailspin 3]

bortdafarm....Those are interesting results. Doesn't changing the role of the aircraft cause you to get two seaters as opponents in fighter sweeps and fighters escorting fighters, etc. ? Then again its possible you may have found a bug and it might be worth reporting it to TK to look into over at the Thirdwire forum.

 

BTW...Please don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to discourage you or be negative. I'm only trying to point out that there is sometimes a "cause and effect" aspect to changing something and its not always readily apparent. I admire your interest in improving the sim. Actually, I wish there were more people like you who are willing to get involved instead of just complaining. Keep it up.

[+Tailspin 3]

This sounds like what I have been waiting for! Being new to this, where is the data.ins folder located so I would be able to make this change and try it out? Thank you.

 

Hi Buckner and welcome to the forum. If you'll stand by I'll get an ".ini tweaks and changes" thread going with some fixes and tweaks and a short "how to" on extracting files. Been meaning to do it but just haven't gotten a round tuit.

[Buckner 0]

Hi Buckner and welcome to the forum. If you'll stand by I'll get an ".ini tweaks and changes" thread going with some fixes and tweaks and a short "how to" on extracting files. Been meaning to do it but just haven't gotten a round tuit.

 

 

Thank you for setting that up. Made the changes to the German ACFT and was able to change the ATTACK/FIGHTER settings to. Thanks again.

[+bortdafarm 1]

bortdafarm....Those are interesting results. Doesn't changing the role of the aircraft cause you to get two seaters as opponents in fighter sweeps and fighters escorting fighters, etc. ?

 

yes you could be right there!!

i'll keep playing and see how it works out in game..it may be affecting the numbers of fighters in certain missions..i dunno...i have tried setting all to ATTACK...but it's quite difficult to tell what was intended to happen using the stock settings and wether the changes have changed the type of aircraft doing the different mission types..i must admit that if i can get an improved feel to the AI behaviuor and maybe even the long hoped for but never achieved balanced between player kills and fellow AI squadron kill numbers i'll accept that aganst any negative impact on the other features within the campaign..i doubt i can do it tho

 

my pet gripe alert!!

why oh why does the AI allways take a back seat when games are developed--my only gripe that covers every game/sim i've ever played !!! when will devs realise that in single player ..at the end of the day the AI IS THE GAME!!!!

 

gripe alert over...

 

 

i think i've cracked the AI maneverability and they both get into good attack positions AND make every attempt to evade when under attack (most times) so what i need is to get them to open fire with a little more aggression...if they fire often enough they will get the kills..

 

on the whole i find messing about with stuff like this a good way to pass the time and FE is a good sim worth while spending the time..thanks for the positive words they are most appreciated..and i do understand that what migth be good for one issue might very well create other problems which other folks won't like being messed with or damaged...good thing here is that it's just a mod i'm making so it's not compulsory!!

 

i don't think the ATTACK/FIGHTER role is a bug .. i just noticed that the ATTACK ROLE AI was noticably smoother and more well intelligent than the FIGHTER ROLE AI......just one of those things i like to swop round when i notice them to see what happens! (can't resist the temptation to try these things out)

 

i'l check to see if i can see if the campaign assigns aircraft to airfields/missions/ escorts etc by name or by role ( i know it uses the PRIMARY?SECONDARY ROLE section (?) one assumes)...that should help clarify things alittle..wether the role affects the AI only or wether it affects the actual campaign it self..

 

i'm still looking for the dang weather stuff...this is Europe!! it's allways overcast ..well a good deal of the time anyway.. if i can find the ratio that controls how many missions are in bad weather and how many in good and so on i'll be altering that but i can't find it anywhere..any thoughts?

anyhuw lots of things to mess about with...which is what i like to do...the computer equivilent of "doodling"

Edited December 16, 2006 by bortdafarm

[+bortdafarm 1]

perhaps if i try something like this for the two seaters?

 

 

AircraftRole=BOMBER

AircraftCapability=DAY

Availability=VERY_COMMON

Exported=FALSE

PrimaryRoles=RECON,ARMED_RECON,STRIKE

SecondaryRoles=TRANSPORT

 

 

what do you think?

[+Tailspin 3]

All I can suggest is try it out in various mission types using different player controled aircraft. You can always add to the primary and secondary roles to enable a wider player selection of missions. How the sim will handle the changes and how it will choose AI aircraft, .

[+bortdafarm 1]

All I can suggest is try it out in various mission types using different player controled aircraft. You can always add to the primary and secondary roles to enable a wider player selection of missions. How the sim will handle the changes and how it will choose AI aircraft, .

 

 

will do!

at first attempt using the bomber asignment and limited primary/secondary role entrys it seems to be quite happy with the alterations...there seemed to be more fighters around than usual and found quite a few squadrons of the Bomber two seats escorted by large numbers of fighters...which may be part of the dynamic of the campaign (which by the way does actualy seem to be a proper dynamic campaign (?)

if so then this truly is an amazing sim...if the failure in patrols results in the reduction in supply for your side and possibly an increase in supply for the enemy resulting in more enemy aircraft and fewer friendly ..then zoot alors...that is fabolous ...i'm fairly sure that's how it works do you know??

 

stunned and amazed by this ..

 

there is an issue with bombs and bombing i seem to have ..even as stock i can't understand how to select and drop bombs (at least from the Se5A) i select the air to ground weapon but all i can select is the normal MG's no bombs available even when added in the hanger screen..

the reason i ask this is that if bombs are available and work for the AI and this responds to the BOMBER assignment....then it may be possible to duplicate the two seaters and have them set up with different armement and loud outs specifically for bombing missions...limiting them to STRIKE roles...

 

do bombs work ....i havent seen anything bomb anything as yet??? (stock or other wise ...so far)

 

anyhuw the

 

AircraftRole=BOMBER

AircraftCapability=DAY

Availability=VERY_COMMON

Exported=FALSE

PrimaryRoles=RECON,ARMED_RECON,STRIKE

SecondaryRoles=TRANSPORT

 

set up works fine for the two seaters...(thus far)

 

last patrol the enemy tried a mass attack on an airfield dozens of two seaters all escorted by even more fighters... complete mayhem haven't had so much fun in a game for ages!! "Huns...thousands of 'em!" that's why i ask about bombs...they should have obliterated the aerodrome..but not one bomb dropped..

my AI squadrom mates put up a fairly good show...(top ho!!) and one one was lost which was pretty stowt stuff considering the number of enemy..sadly tho they didn't get any kills...mind you if they survive long enough to gain experience points (does the campaign actualy do this or is it just static info on the roster screen?) if they gain from surviving then maybe they will get some kills as they continue improving..heck i dunno...wish the manual was more in depth on this stuff...

 

i'll check the files and browse around looking for other possible asignments...

 

i'll try to figure out how to duplicate one of the aircraft and customise it specificaly for bomb runs...the try adding it to the campaign ...wouldn't mind flying the Albatros..must be possible there's a cockpit for it some where here...anychance of a tutorial section for the sim how to add new or duplicated aircraft?

 

(if i figure it out i'll write one..if there's not one allready)

Edited December 16, 2006 by bortdafarm

[+Tailspin 3]

will do!

at first attempt using the bomber asignment and limited primary/secondary role entrys it seems to be quite happy with the alterations...there seemed to be more fighters around than usual and found quite a few squadrons of the Bomber two seats escorted by large numbers of fighters...which may be part of the dynamic of the campaign (which by the way does actualy seem to be a proper dynamic campaign (?)

if so then this truly is an amazing sim...if the failure in patrols results in the reduction in supply for your side and possibly an increase in supply for the enemy resulting in more enemy aircraft and fewer friendly ..then zoot alors...that is fabolous ...i'm fairly sure that's how it works do you know??

 

stunned and amazed by this ..

 

there is an issue with bombs and bombing i seem to have ..even as stock i can't understand how to select and drop bombs (at least from the Se5A) i select the air to ground weapon but all i can select is the normal MG's no bombs available even when added in the hanger screen..

the reason i ask this is that if bombs are available and work for the AI and this responds to the BOMBER assignment....then it may be possible to duplicate the two seaters and have them set up with different armement and loud outs specifically for bombing missions...limiting them to STRIKE roles...

 

do bombs work ....i havent seen anything bomb anything as yet??? (stock or other wise ...so far)

 

anyhuw the

 

AircraftRole=BOMBER

AircraftCapability=DAY

Availability=VERY_COMMON

Exported=FALSE

PrimaryRoles=RECON,ARMED_RECON,STRIKE

SecondaryRoles=TRANSPORT

 

set up works fine for the two seaters...(thus far)

 

last patrol the enemy tried a mass attack on an airfield dozens of two seaters all escorted by even more fighters... complete mayhem haven't had so much fun in a game for ages!! "Huns...thousands of 'em!" that's why i ask about bombs...they should have obliterated the aerodrome..but not one bomb dropped..

my AI squadrom mates put up a fairly good show...(top ho!!) and one one was lost which was pretty stowt stuff considering the number of enemy..sadly tho they didn't get any kills...mind you if they survive long enough to gain experience points (does the campaign actualy do this or is it just static info on the roster screen?) if they gain from surviving then maybe they will get some kills as they continue improving..heck i dunno...wish the manual was more in depth on this stuff...

 

i'll check the files and browse around looking for other possible asignments...

 

i'll try to figure out how to duplicate one of the aircraft and customise it specificaly for bomb runs...the try adding it to the campaign ...wouldn't mind flying the Albatros..must be possible there's a cockpit for it some where here...anychance of a tutorial section for the sim how to add new or duplicated aircraft?

 

(if i figure it out i'll write one..if there's not one allready)

 

I've not played a campaign yet but I think there has been a bug reported with bombs not showing up on some aircraft in the campaign. They work in single missions buy choosing "bombs" in the pull down on the loadout screen. I don't think they're available unless the mission type calls for them. You should also be able to get them as a default loadout by editing the Loadout.ini for the aircraft.

[+bortdafarm 1]

I've not played a campaign yet but I think there has been a bug reported with bombs not showing up on some aircraft in the campaign. They work in single missions buy choosing "bombs" in the pull down on the loadout screen. I don't think they're available unless the mission type calls for them. You should also be able to get them as a default loadout by editing the Loadout.ini for the aircraft.

 

 

cheers..i just hada look at it...changed the type of mission that gave the SE5A's bombs to include all types of mission..but no luck...you can allways (even before) select bombs from the loadout screen pre mission...but i can't select them in the campaign patrol...it just cycles thru the normal machine guns..

i did try editing the weaponary setion for the Se5A data.ini as that showed that the maximum weight limit for bomb loadout was less than the weight of the two 25lb bombs...that sounded like the fix..but no luck again...not sure what the problem is..

i tend to only play the campaign ,as i can use time excell or skip to next action to shorten the thing if i don't have the time and i like the sense of continuing on thru something as i play...i like to see what the campaign cooks up for me ..makes every go a surprise sort of thing

[+bortdafarm 1]

here's the latest WIP version of my AI mod if any one fancies see-ing if it helps matters..

AIMODv2.zip

[+Tailspin 3]

...not sure what the problem is..

 

I'm pretty sure its a known bug in the campaign. On the list for the next patch?

[+Spectre_USA 7]

I am at a stage in the campaign where the Hun has been driven from the skies! (20 - odd missions)

 

Have taken to flying nothing but solos the last dozen or so, as the wingmen only absorb damage and distract AAA,

they are all but bloody useless as mud-movers or fighters.

 

But, anyway, the situation has presented gaggles of 2 seater missions to bomb airfields, but they never drop.

 

The only bombs I've seen are when I hit Hun 2 seaters and they jettison their loads. When they were actively offensive

still, I was too busy to see if they dropped normally.

 

TK, is indeed aware of no bombs, even though they say they are loaded, as I posted up a week or two back about

it, and he responded that he'd look into it.

[+Tailspin 3]

Thanks for the info Spectre, I thought it was you who reported it. I tried to find your post earlier at Thirdwire but was looking in the wrong place.

[+bortdafarm 1]

I am at a stage in the campaign where the Hun has been driven from the skies! (20 - odd missions)

 

Have taken to flying nothing but solos the last dozen or so, as the wingmen only absorb damage and distract AAA,

they are all but bloody useless as mud-movers or fighters.

 

But, anyway, the situation has presented gaggles of 2 seater missions to bomb airfields, but they never drop.

 

The only bombs I've seen are when I hit Hun 2 seaters and they jettison their loads. When they were actively offensive

still, I was too busy to see if they dropped normally.

 

TK, is indeed aware of no bombs, even though they say they are loaded, as I posted up a week or two back about

it, and he responded that he'd look into it.

i agree cheers for the info... be very nice to have the bombs working in the campaign hopefully it will get a look in when the patch gets built..the airfields are destroyable as are the canvas hangers....so destroying an airfiel or having your own destroyed should on paper have a big impact on the campaign dynamics and it will just look so atmospheric watching bombers make their runs...give a good reason to shoot them down as well...