Airframe stress limits

[+Tailspin 3]

Hey everybody. I've been playing around with G limits and their effect on airframe stress trying to find a good break (literally ) point.

 

First I'll try and explain how it works in the game...as I understand it that is. As I noted in another thread the airframe stress sound effect in game begins at around 4.0Gs and reaches its loudest level at around 5.0Gs. To cause a component to actually break and detach it seems to require a certain amount of sustained G load at a level higher than the MaxG value. G loads are dependent on airspeed and how hard you pull on the control stick. In game most combat maneuvers at reasonable speeds won't generate enough sustained G loads to do damage. However we can set G limits that will affect some maneuvers at higher speeds that when combined with overzealous control input (pulling too hard) will cause damage.

 

I guess my question is what speed is too fast for extreme maneuvers? I am including a CamelF1_DATA.ini with the MaxG limits set to 4.7 on both upper and lower mid-wings for you to try out if you are interested. From my testing if your airspeed is 150mph + and you pull full back on the stick and hold it too long (especially in a dive) you can break off your wings. I have also tested this setting in a high speed 200mph power dive and it is possible to pull out safely if you are careful with stick pressure. You have to pay attention to the stress creaking sound and when it gets to the loudest level you need to back off.

 

Please give it a try and let me know what you think. BTW the Camel 130 is only the "test bed" aircraft and I chose it only because its the plane I fly the most and am most familiar with. I have no idea what its real relative strengths were and don't claim this is realistic as directly related to the Camel.

 

Ooops....almost forgot. This effect has been tested with FE+EP+Apr. 08 patch and stock FMs. It may not work with other versions.

CAMELF1_130_DATA.zip

[+Tailspin 3]

Also as a great addition to the breaking effect I highly recommend adding this sound effect mod by Shrikehawk. Don't forget the update too.

 

http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?autoc...p;showfile=4934

[+Tailspin 3]

Hmmm....I figured there would be more interest in this aspect of the game. Oh well, guess I'll move on to something else.

[stephen honey 0]

Hmmm....I figured there would be more interest in this aspect of the game. Oh well, guess I'll move on to something else.

 

I'll express an interest. It's these lateral thoughts and ideas that increase the dynamics of the game, so congratulations for working on this aspect. Flying at several thousand feet in a canvas and wood box with a car engine bolted to the front must have been a experience to say the least especially if somebody is trying shoot at you at the same time. Introducing these realistic stress elements will highlight the limitations, fragility and vulnerabilty of these aircraft. If it was possible within the game, I would also like to see a tweak to create an active sceen that gives limited visibility through oiled stained goggles, especially with an engine hit. (We already have a tweak to increase head shake).

 

I haven't made many contributions to the game other than a few aircraft skins and one of the reasons why is because I spend a lot of time experimenting with files. I'm playing around with mixing in open cockpit heavy wind buffeting to the individual engine sounds, the idea is to get an increase in pitch and severity in accordance with the speed. Also I would like to increase the number of individual pilot files to give each aircraft its own pilot, (any artwork to create the likeness of a known ace or aircraft paint scheme is not a problem for me its the technical application needed to increase the number of pilots to beyond the present five).

[+Tailspin 3]

Thanks for taking the time to comment stephen. The effects of airframe stress can be increased or decreased and applied differently to each component in the data.ini. Wing tips can be made to break before the mid wings, entire tail sections can break off or just the stabilizers. It can vary from plane to plane, etc. I was hoping for some input on what other people thought the limits should be.

 

I'll be happy to add my thoughts on your ideas if I may. Re: visible oil stains...Since the game has visible damage effects for the various wing and fuselage components it may indeed be possible to add a damage.tga to the internal cockpit view. Maybe its already been tried in the other series' and its not possible? I don't really know for sure. Perhaps one of the older hands at this can comment. As for wind sounds there is an entry in the AircraftObject.ini that would seem to do just what we want.

 

[WindSoundOpen]

MinSpeed=25.0

MinVolume=10

MinVolumeSpeed=25.0

MaxVolume=100

MaxVolumeSpeed=100.0

MinFreq=0.8

MinFreqSpeed=25.0

MaxFreq=1.6

MaxFreqSpeed=200.0

 

However changing the variables doesn't work at this time. TK is aware of this and may fix it in the next patch. Hope so. Meanwhile your solution sounds like a good idea.

 

I wasn't aware of a hard limit to the number of pilot skins. Getting new pilot skins to work is fairly straight forward but I don't know how you could apply them to single planes only. You could make a Von Richtoffen skin but he would be flying all the Dr. I's. Since individual aircraft skins are implemented I wonder if pilot skins could somehow be tied to the aircraft skins? I suppose TK is the one to ask. Sometimes he's receptive to ideas he likes as long as they are withing the capabilities of the game engine.

[Bandy 3]

TS,

Also, don't forget it is summer (in the Northern hemisphere at least, sorry you blokes down under!) and may be vacation time for many.

 

I really think this is a great idea and sounds like it positively oozes a reality check on flying style (perhaps especially for me :blush2:).

BUT it may open a can of worms: ie, how does it affect the AI, if at all? It may change their "behaviour" sort of like how the minimum altitude setting ruins tree top dogfights.

Just something to consider when making observations.

 

Will give it a go! Thanks!

Edited June 29, 2008 by B Bandy RFC

[+Tailspin 3]

....how does it affect the AI?

 

Well thats part of the point of trying to get some sort of consensus on where the threshold should be set. My main purpose is trying to prevent the ability to just yank the stick around at any speed or attitude with impunity. Trying to get a starting point, then see if it affects the AI. Higher settings for MaxG don't affect anything except at the highest speeds...only attainable in a long, steep, power on dive. Lower settings are different. One of my favorite maneuvers for shaking off a determined AI pilot or getting a better advantage is to dive and pull an Immelman (or something like one ). With lower settings I have to watch my airspeed in the dive and gauge my pull up accordingly. As the AI supposedly uses a different, more simplified, FM than the player I'm not sure what effect this will have...if any. I haven't seen any ripping their wings off yet.

[Bandy 3]

....how does it affect the AI?

Well thats part of the point...

 

I was posing a rhetorical question, sorry that wasn't clear...

 

The fact that AI uses a simplified FM may indeed be the saving grace, otherwise it just might tame them down, and it would be d__n hard to perceive if it did.

[+Tailspin 3]

I wouldn't want AI that perform TOO far outside a reasonable flight envelope anyway.