Bortdafarm's New Albs I, II, III

[SRT 0]

Hey, how come no one is talking about these new planes? The FM seems a bit odd (having trouble diving), but it great to see these planes not looking like a D.V conversion. Thanks Bortdafarm.

[MOUNTAIN-MAN 0]

Hey SRT...really like Borts stuff, including his flight models..make ya learn how to fly!...never dawned on me to post about them here, always go over to Borts blog and thank the man personally.....just seems the right thing to do . :yes: M-M

[+Tailspin 3]

The DI had a heavy, cast iron, inline engine and was renowned for its diving ability. I doubt very much that it was a "floater".

[Zaphros 0]

Hey, how come no one is talking about these new planes? The FM seems a bit odd (having trouble diving), but it great to see these planes not looking like a D.V conversion. Thanks Bortdafarm.

 

I guess they didn't call them "kites" for nothing...as for the heavy engine i suppose the C-O-G would have to been in the right place to balance that other wise the thing would never have got of the ground...never seen a biplane yet that didn't float a little even in flat calm conditions...in even a light breeze..well they're all over the place ...anyhuw what does it matter???

 

cheers Bortdafarm for some fine looking aircraft...guess that's what really matters eh? must be surely

 

for folks more used to jet fighters it has to be (well no... it doesn't really but you know what i mean..it#s a game after all)

taken into consideration that with a top speed of only around 100mph and with limited engine power on hand even a moderate breeze of ten or 15 mph (let alone any sort of gusty heavier wind) would have an absolutely HUGE impact on the way these old kites behaved and responded..any body who has tried to fly a powered glider against a slightly gusty head wind will recognise the problems in getting the nose down...i think he's added something to the game that few others have even thought about...

Edited April 25, 2007 by Zaphros

[+Tailspin 3]

http://www.theaerodrome.com/aircraft/germany/albatros_di.php

 

 

When Jasta 6 was re-equipped with the D.I in the fall of 1916, Vizefeldwebel Carl Holler was noticeable impressed:

 

"Its rate of climb was excellent. Because of its heavy in-line engine, it had a tremendous diving speed which gave us great advantage when attacking the enemy flying below. Now we did not have to wait very long to obtain a few victories. In short order, one after another, two of my comrades obtained a victory."

 

 

 

I think the term "kites" refers to the manner of construction, but you are correct...what does it matter? Its easy enough to fix and the models are nice.

[Zaphros 0]

http://www.theaerodrome.com/aircraft/germany/albatros_di.php

 

 

When Jasta 6 was re-equipped with the D.I in the fall of 1916, Vizefeldwebel Carl Holler was noticeable impressed:

 

"Its rate of climb was excellent. Because of its heavy in-line engine, it had a tremendous diving speed which gave us great advantage when attacking the enemy flying below. Now we did not have to wait very long to obtain a few victories. In short order, one after another, two of my comrades obtained a victory."

 

 

 

I think the term "kites" refers to the manner of construction, but you are correct...what does it matter? Its easy enough to fix and the models are nice.

 

yes i agree that's the basic jist...mind you i haven't had any problem diving them myself.. !! roll em over down they go..

the only difficulty is in getting the nose down from straight and level flight. (but i can live with that)..once the nose is down tho they dive like anvils which is what the link refers to i think..they weren't overly nose heavy ,it's more a question of momentum once diving that makes the engine weight an advantage (given you don't rip the wings off or course!)...all in all i like the added difficulty given by this approach...it hands the AI a huge advantage and balances the gameplay out enourmously..i'm allways getting left in the dust by the AI and having to reposition and attack from a new postion...had some dogfights last half an hour!!! great fun..

[+Tailspin 3]

"the only difficulty is in getting the nose down from straight and level flight."

 

I think this is the difficuly in question and, perhaps, where it might be a bit overdone. Turning and reversing turns, once you learn how to manipulate rudder and throttle to keep the nose oriented, is manageable. Regardless, its nice to have a discussion on FM's without all the drama. As I've said before, I tinker with everyone's FMs, not just yours, to suit myself and my interpretation of the available information. Thanks go to TK for making that easily possible.

[Zaphros 0]

As I've said before, I tinker with everyone's FMs, not just yours,

 

que??

 

the main difficulty caused for me by the difficulty in getting the nose down is in the aiming ..it ppresents you with problems lining up the final shot..and often the AI can wriggle out from under your guns before you can line them up...makes life interesting

[+Tailspin 3]

que??

 

the main difficulty caused for me by the difficulty in getting the nose down is in the aiming ..it ppresents you with problems lining up the final shot..and often the AI can wriggle out from under your guns before you can line them up...makes life interesting

 

Oh. I meant Bort's.

 

Yes, I agree. However, given the size of the control surfaces I find it difficult to believe that the plane was so unresponsive to forward stick input. A lot of WWI aircraft were noted to be "tail heavy" in that they required constant forward pressure on the stick to fly level but that doesn't necessarily mean they were unresponsive to more forward pressure.

[Zaphros 0]

Oh. I meant Bort's.

 

Yes, I agree. However, given the size of the control surfaces I find it difficult to believe that the plane was so unresponsive to forward stick input. A lot of WWI aircraft were noted to be "tail heavy" in that they required constant forward pressure on the stick to fly level but that doesn't necessarily mean they were unresponsive to more forward pressure.

 

ok wondered what was happenning for a second..

you'd have to say he's managed to add a little "flight" to the game.. for me anyhuw...that frustration at yet again losing the kill because you just can't get the damn nose down to line up the shot on the one hand drives me nuts...(much swearing at the screen) but on the other has me kinda smiling to myself because given the limitations of AI in any game to be out flown by the AI even if it is completely artificially arrived at is something worth persueing...the planes fly fine and are not un-maneuverable it's just at the very last second you can't get the thing lined up quickly enough to shoot! LOL...i dunno.. early slow flying planes bounced about like corks on water in rough conditions and we don't get much of that sort of thing in sims so what ever it is it sort of throws some sort of extra siumlated "weather"? into the mix...i don't think it's meant to be taken seriously as a neccesarily accurate techincal feature..more of a general "life isn't that simple" element !! dunno

[MOUNTAIN-MAN 0]

Zaphros....believe you hit the nail on the head right smartly....Borts FMs were specifically made to add the challenge, and the fun, back into the game and in that he has truly succeded....His FMs are all I fly, and after taking the time to learn them, flying anybody elses is just plain boring..........Glad to see someone else enjoying the good stuff the man has given to us, while everyone else was worried about getting it "right"( virtually impossible with the medium we have to work with!) Bort just wanted to make it fun, and did, bless his crusty old hide anyway!!.....fly hard and have fun Mr. Z M-M

[Zaphros 0]

Zaphros....believe you hit the nail on the head right smartly....Borts FMs were specifically made to add the challenge, and the fun, back into the game and in that he has truly succeded....His FMs are all I fly, and after taking the time to learn them, flying anybody elses is just plain boring..........Glad to see someone else enjoying the good stuff the man has given to us, while everyone else was worried about getting it "right"( virtually impossible with the medium we have to work with!) Bort just wanted to make it fun, and did, bless his crusty old hide anyway!!.....fly hard and have fun Mr. Z M-M

he he! ..i need a swear box by the computer tho!!!

[+Tailspin 3]

ok wondered what was happenning for a second..

you'd have to say he's managed to add a little "flight" to the game.. for me anyhuw...that frustration at yet again losing the kill because you just can't get the damn nose down to line up the shot on the one hand drives me nuts...(much swearing at the screen) but on the other has me kinda smiling to myself because given the limitations of AI in any game to be out flown by the AI even if it is completely artificially arrived at is something worth persueing...the planes fly fine and are not un-maneuverable it's just at the very last second you can't get the thing lined up quickly enough to shoot! LOL...i dunno.. early slow flying planes bounced about like corks on water in rough conditions and we don't get much of that sort of thing in sims so what ever it is it sort of throws some sort of extra siumlated "weather"? into the mix...i don't think it's meant to be taken seriously as a neccesarily accurate techincal feature..more of a general "life isn't that simple" element !! dunno

 

I agree that the flight characteristics of the early birds like the Eindeckers, Parasols, etc. were difficult at best. However I think that started changing with aircraft of the N11/DH 2 class and changed again even more with the Albatros. This is why I differ on whether the "flighty" and unstable characteristics of the earlier planes are appropriate where the Albatros D series is concerned. I'm not suggesting that any of these planes early or later were "stable" by modern standards. I'm speaking in relative terms.

[Zaphros 0]

I agree that the flight characteristics of the early birds like the Eindeckers, Parasols, etc. were difficult at best. However I think that started changing with aircraft of the N11/DH 2 class and changed again even more with the Albatros. This is why I differ on whether the "flighty" and unstable characteristics of the earlier planes are appropriate where the Albatros D series is concerned. I'm not suggesting that any of these planes early or later were "stable" by modern standards. I'm speaking in relative terms.

 

all the aircraft in the game seem pretty stable to me..

[+Tailspin 3]

all the aircraft in the game seem pretty stable to me..

 

Standing on your tail when trying to reverse your turn is not a stable trait IMHO.

[Zaphros 0]

Standing on your tail when trying to reverse your turn is not a stable trait IMHO.

 

jeeez .....

[+Tailspin 3]

I guess the jig is up, huh?

[Zaphros 0]

I guess the jig is up, huh?

 

what on earth are you blathering on about man???

 

guess SRT has his answer i know i do..it's perfectly clear this forum has a troll as a moderator....

 

i don't care who you think i am i'm gone...too bl**dy ..right who needs this carp

Edited April 26, 2007 by Zaphros

[+Tailspin 3]

Gotcha Bort! Did you think I didn't know it was you from the beginning? Thing is, anytime you want to you can post here under your original handle and be welcome. But leave the phony persona behind.

[Zaphros 0]

Gotcha Bort! Did you think I didn't know it was you from the beginning? Thing is, anytime you want to you can post here under your original handle and be welcome. But leave the phony persona behind.

 

 

...i don't care if you think i'm the Queen of England..it's of no interest to me... .

i had a feeling this wasn't a conversation about the albatros FM...it seems to me it isn't me that's been flying false colours eh???

just a thought....last post from me here....crazy

[Bandy 3]

Did that just happen????

Deja Vu or I'M the Queen'O'England....

[+Tailspin 3]

Of course the discussion was about the Albatros FM. Everything I've said were my sincere thoughts on the subject. I think its clear where the tomfoolery is coming from. Have a nice day.

[+Tailspin 3]

Ok, I'm re-opening this topic with a offer to you, Bort. Why don't we just quit playing these silly games and call a truce? Lets turn your visit here into a something positive. Lets take the opportunity to leave the past behind and start over again. I was serious when I said you are welcome to post here any time you like. I won't bother you with boring discussions on A/C performance and quirky FMs. I promise. I'm dead serious. Lets leave it behind us like two grown men.

[Gr.Viper 131]

Yeah, guys, stop it already

[Firecage 1]

Well Brandy we can't tell if your the queen or not ... you have to be able to do that cool little hand wave the royal family has before Im willing to believe ya 8)

 

I Started to say something about proving to us your the queen by showing us a pic of you in a dress but ... im not sure I want to see that the more I think about it 8) j/k