Coordinationg Missions w/ Ace and Bomber Flights

[Duce Lewis]

I suspect that coordinating missions may be more difficult when warping

Please indicate how often you warp in your responses

 

Thanks for participating!

 

 

[Duce Lewis]

I warp just about every mission

Always end up way below Ace Flight or far behind the Bombers

HA almost always bounce my flight but sometimes after long climbs I can reach their altitude

Occasionally I can coordinate tactics with Ace Flight (after long chases) but Bombers are always far away

[andqui]

I just voted about the ace flight because I had to. I never see them in formation unless we're circling the airfield, so I just don't know.

[Dej]

I've played a number of different pilots in campaign missions since this issue came up. I find it difficult to stay with A flight now, which is bad, but am usually above any EA encountered, which is a welcome change. The one bomber escort so far we were a long way from 'em, not truly sure about our altitude respective to theirs.

 

On my last mission A Flight were well ahead and above ours about halfway to our objective, when some bogeys passed at distance. Next thing, A Flight comes tearing past us to go mix it up with the EAs. Lord alone knows how they spotted 'em.

[Duce Lewis]

Just had a 3 Flight Mission

We escorted 5 Hannovers, A & B Flights with 4 each

Tried something new, hit Shift+W several times to skip past the initial circling

Hit Warp immeditely afterward and warped to the front line

Hannovers were 1/2 mile behind and slightly below - Cool Beans!

A Flight was nowhere in sight

Hit Warp again with the same results about 5 miles deep behind enemy lines

 

Continued towards target but the Hannovers turned around and broke into 3 formtions

Turned and tried to cover them but when they're going 180 from each other it got tough

HA showed up on the parimeters and a Dogfight appeared

Finally spotted A Flight fighting some Camels but no clue how they got there

 

Single and pairs of HA started pecking around the Hannovers so we raced back & forth trying to shoo them off

Having a height advantage was a real help as it allowed B&Z tactics and to stay somewhat near the Bombers

Shot several down this way and finally started the homeward trek

Scrapped with several Camels while exiting and finally lost the Bombers

Warped again and caught up with them as they made their turn for their base

 

Losses:

3 Hannovers

1 B Flight DVII

No idea on A Flight

 

I'll try the same Shift+W tactic with A Flight again and see if we can stay together

Edited September 22, 2009 by Duce Lewis

[Duce Lewis]

I flew 3 more Test Flights tonight

 

#1 was a Bomber Escort for an Airfield Strike

Hit Shift+W several times to eliminate initial airfield circling

Warped immediately after this

Ended up 1/2 mile ahead and slightly above the Bombers

We flew on climbing towards the target

Watched the Bombers closely and mirrored their movements

Curiously, the Bombers turned off 6 miles before the target

Followed them around for about 30 min as they turned back & forth

They never got within 5 miles of the target and bombed vehicles (very successfully) instead

They turned for home so I eventually had to Shift+W to follow

 

 

#2 was a CAP behind enemy front lines

I placed the targeting arrow on the Ace Flight leader before take-off

Hit Shift+W to eliminate circling and then Warped

Warp exited when HA appeared ahead

Ace Flight was nowhere in sight but the targeting arrow indicated they were below and far behind

Turned round and flew back and spotted them circling home base

Warped again and they dissppeared behind

Turned round and found them finally flying out from base

Warped a 3rd time and this time they vanished, never seen again

Targeting arrow turned off

Either the Ace I was tracking was destroyed or maybe Ace Flight despawned

 

 

#3 was nother CAP behind enemy front lines

This time only hit Shift+W 2 times and then Warped

Ace flight was 3 miles behind and far above us when warp exited

White Bogie Labels didn't appear so I assume linear distance was greater than 4 miles

They followed us along ignoring a Dogfight we passed over

They ignored us too when we dove on some Camels homeward bound

Never saw them again

 

 

Conclusions:

If you Warp

Shift+W really helps to stay with the Bombers

Although it can place you ahead of the Ace Flight, Shift+W doesn't solve the height difference

 

Thanks to 77 Scout for suggesting to eliminate circling

[Olham]

I had warp issues the last days, always when I did warp a second time after some combat or flying.

First one brought me to Germany's Saarland.

The second changed the colours of airfields in the map - our side, all was red suddenly, and I was

afraid to land, cause I didn't know if the sim would regard them as enemy fields.

The third warp, my Albatros came out vertical, and no matter what I tried, the wings broke faster

than I could save her.

 

After warp, A flight is always in front of me and higher, but I can often catch up to them.

[Duce Lewis]

The third warp, my Albatros came out vertical, and no matter what I tried, the wings broke faster

than I could save her.

I've had this same problem

I think it may be due to seting AutoTrim with nose above the horizon

I set AutoTrim with nose slightly down now and haven't had the problem recently

And yes it does break wings

I found it's best not to fight the manuever by pushing stick forward

Best to pull back into a loop

 

HTH,

[Olham]

I never use auto-trim, but trim the craft after take-off. And always nose slightly

below horizon. No, my suspicion is rather, that the new air start option messed

something up. Before that, I never had warp issues.

[Bullethead]

I need to explain my answers.

 

The questions were phrased as "after climb-out", which I take to mean flying in realtime. After all, the whole purpose of warping is to avoid the tedious climbing. So if I'm going to warp, I do it the instant my last flight member is airborne and the game says it's now possible. This happens well before I've completed 1 circle of the airfield and can still count the leaves on trees. So the real question is, am I going to warp or not?

 

I don't fly prior to 1917 because there's not enough action and the planes are all anemic (and some of the main fighters are also outright dangerous to fly).

 

In 1917, I almost always warp. Even though warping robs you on altitude, I do it anyway because in this timeframe I only fly for the Entente (I'm not into padding my score with helpless Fees and Quirks) and it's perfectly legit to have the Germans well above me most of the time because they climb better. Warping in 1917 is MUCH less fraught with problems than in 1918. Sure, you're lower than you'd like to be, but A Flight is almost always right there above and ahead of you, and they almost always follow through with the briefed mission. The only times I don't warp in 1917 are if I'm flying a SPAD or Pfalz, where warping is suicidal due to the loss of altitude it entails, or if I'm attacking a nearby ground target and want to stay low to avoid attention.

 

In 1918, I almost never warp. First off, warping in 1918 is problematic--the game often crashes on me. Maybe this is due to the sheer number of planes, maybe it's becasue the various squadrons can't agree on where the front lines are. Second, the problem with A Flight going astray is much more common in 1918 than it is in 1917. If you warp in 1918 and the game doesn't crash, you'll often come out of it in the midst of a huge herd of enemies with A Flight nowhere to be seen because they peeled off and left you long ago while you were warping. Thus, I only warp in 1918 if I'm on a defensive patrol far behind friendly lines, where the density of airplanes is at 1917 levels and doesn't crash the machine, and even then I still don't do it in a SPAD or Pfalz.

 

When I'm flying realtime in 1918, I notice that A Flight leaves the circuit after only 1-2 laps and while still at treetop level. They fly off while remaining low while I climb well above them and fall slightly behind. As we approach the 1st waypoint before the objective, A Flight starts to climb steeply but doesn't slow down any, and sometimes they actually get above me and ahead (by this point, I'm about as high as my plane can go and still have enough macho to fight effectively). I'd say this happens about 1/3 - 1/2 the time. But the rest of the time, before they climb so high, or by this point if they have climbed, they usually go haring off after something known only to themselves and I have to go on without them. As OBD has said, this thing with A Flight going astray is a known issue that's being worked on as we speak. However, it's what happens in the game right now, so I have to base my answer on what I see.

 

So, as it stands right now, in 1918 it seems coordinating with A Flight is usually a forelorn hope. About the only way you end up with A Flight is if you are based at or near the lines in a busy area, so both of you get sucked into the same huge fight before A Flight has a chance to go off on its own. In 1917, however, I usually have no problems staying near A Flight, warping or not. They seem much less likely to go astray.

 

Coordinating with bombers is much easier than with A Flight, regardless of time, because bombers behave predictably. This doens't mean it always works, but at least you can count on them being in a given area at a given time.

 

As has been been mentioned, there's a discrepancy between what the briefing says, what the waypoints show, and what happens during flight. The waypoints always show a rendezvous with the bombers about 1/2way to the target, but the briefing says they're already over my field and that's where they are when I take off. AFAICT, the bombers only care about the waypoint where they separate from you to go home--the rendezvous waypoint is completely ignored.

 

So, the bombers start at operational altitude right overhead and they don't wait for you. This forces you to forego circling your field gaining altitude--you have to set off at once climbing as best you can while staying fast enough not to fall too far behind. In 1917, when warping doesn't crash my computer, I avoid this problem by warping ASAP, which puts me right with the buffs whenever I come out of warp. In 1918, however, it CAN cause problems. Warping isn't a good idea but most of the squadrons I fly for are based very close to the front, where going anywhere without gaining some altitude beforehand is suicide. So, I take the time to make couple of circuits and climb to about 5000' before I head after the bombers. By this point, the bombers are long gone and I have to try to catch them. Usually, they're under severe attack by the time that happens, if they're not dead already.