FLUGMUSEUM MESSERSCHMITT

[Olham]

A new website is under construction, called FLUGMUSEUM MESSERSCHMITT.

That site already shows some interesting videos of the Bf109 and the Me 266.

More is to come.

 

http://flugmuseum-messerschmitt.com/

 

Here are three videos:

 

 

 

Edited October 26, 2015 by Olham

[Hauksbee]

It's great to see these planes still flying, and sad to realize that, in 1946, a person with a few extra dollars and a warehouse could have had as many as he wanted for a song. I'm sure that when the F-22 & F-35 replace all the A-10's, F-15's, F-16's, etc., the latter will all be scrapped. Except for a pitiful few that accidentally get over looked. Fifty years from now, dedicated aviation enthusiasts will band together to restore a rare bird to flying condition. It will be shown off at air shows in 2100 A.D., and the young will look upon it with envious eyes and say, "Wow! This is how it was done in the old days."

[Olham]

Haha - yeah, IF they should be able to keep them in flying condition...

Nowadays technology is so advanced and expensive to build - it could well be

that it would not be possible to remake any difficult parts anymore.

[Hauksbee]

Let us hope that, by the end of this century, digital printing will be so good that that will not be a problem.

[JFM]

Great thread!

 

Man! Did you see the rate of climb for that 109-G4, right after takeoff? Awesome. That entire video was Viagra-esque!

[Olham]

Thank you, Jim! Yeah, the Bf109 is often said to have become more and more obsolete.

I am not so sure there. She was still a very powerfull airplane, if she wasn't overloaded

with the wrong weapons or even bombs.

 

Here's a video of American ace Anderson's fight vs a Bf109 - he won, but it was tough.

 

Edited October 28, 2015 by Olham

[Hauksbee]

Thank you, Jim! Yeah, the Bf109 is often said to have become more and more obsolete.

The 109 set the bar very high in the Spanish Civil War. It was a sharp 'wake-up call' to aircraft designers of other nations...as was the Zero fighter in the Pacific. Both gave the rest of the world target goals to shoot for, and, in life, nobody can lead the pack forever.

 

What came as a big surprise to me was the P-40 in the hands of the British. We considered it out of date and handed over hundreds and hundreds of them to England. In the Pacific, Chennault defeated the 'turn and burn' tactics of the Zero with 'boom and zoom'. But in North Africa, the British started out using the P-40 as a ground attack fighter. They quickly discovered that it could go toe-to-toe with the Me-109's and continued to do so well into 1943 when, at last, it started to show its age.

[JimAttrill]

My father was in Egypt in WWII and he worked on P40s.   The only thing he ever told me about those days was that the pilots spent more time watching the oil pressure gauge than looking out for Me109s.   The Allison motor didn't like the desert sand at all. 

[Olham]

The Bf109-version sent to Africa had the addition "Trop" in it's name. It had a sand filter on the air intake of the compressor.

All Bf109s had also little filters in all the oil supply lines, to prevent any little bits and parts getting into the engine.

 

 

 

 

 

[JimAttrill]

There's are two Bf109s in our local War Museum here.  One is a crashed yellow nose Bf109E  from the Battle of Britain which was sent here to help recruiting and the other is a Bf108F-2 trop from North Africa.  I'll have a look at the air filter when I am next there.  The Spitfire VC as used in the Western Desert had a huge Vokes filter fitted which slowed it down a lot (and made it look ugly as well).  I think the later Mk IX and Mk VIII Spitfires had better looking and more efficient dust and sand filters called an Aero-Vee also made by Vokes but much smaller.  The intake on those could be closed when taxying and parked to stop sand getting in. 

 

I have often wondered how long these engines in the desert lasted but haven't found any data on that.   Of course most aircraft either crashed or were shot down anyway so engine wear was a small problem!

[JFM]

Holy crap, Olham! Where's the rest of that 109 drawing? Awesome.

[Olham]

Holy crap, Olham! Where's the rest of that 109 drawing? Awesome.

 

No idea, Jim - it was cut off.

But here is more eye-candy: a real restored Bf109 F "Trop" (could be the one here in Gatow):

 

http://www.jagdgeschwader4.de/index.php/flugwerft-hauptraum/jaeger/messerschmitt-bf-109/g-2-10639

[Olham]

Holy crap, Olham! Where's the rest of that 109 drawing? Awesome.

 

Found it, Jim - here is the website of that artist, with the "other bits" of the aircraft:

 

http://www.markstyling.com/bf109fs1.htm

 

Enjoy!

 

EDIT: Just saw, you can buy high quality prints of all his profiles; here's how that would look:

Ace Günther Rall's Bf109 G-2 "Black 13", 8./JG 52, Russia 1942.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 29, 2015 by Olham

[UK_Widowmaker]

German Engineering at it's best.

 

Thank goodness for Hitler...without him, we'd all be in trouble 

[Olham]

Didn't you say only recently, you were often too cynical, Widow?

That basterd has cost the world so much that I get goose-skin, when I read such jokes about him.

 

German technology is not Herr H's achievement - he only fostered it's development,

and of course his plans benefitted from it.

I can admire the technical progress of that time, and the achievements of some of the German pilots

(when they were not, like Rudel, a through-and-through Nazi), but I dislike the fashist ideology

they were used to support. And I'm glad they failed. Believe me.

[Hauksbee]

(when they were not, like Rudel, a through-and-through Nazi), but I dislike the fashist ideology

Speaking of Rudel, (I've not read his biography) how did he stay alive flying Stukas? I thought that from the Battle of Britain onward, flying a Stuka was a death sentence.

.

 

(Another "Cliffs of Dover" screenie...

Edited October 29, 2015 by Hauksbee

[JimAttrill]

Rüdel was shot down a few times (3?) behind Russian lines and managed to get back to the German side.   Notably his observer gunner in 1944-5 was not only a medical doctor but a Knight's Cross holder - Ernst Gadermann.  It seems he was also a good shot.  I did read Rüdel's book but it was a long time ago and I have lost it.   His previous gunner Hentschel was also a Knight's Cross holder but he drowned after a crash.  Rüdel was interviewed (in German of course) by Capt. Eric Brown.  He was, it seemed, just about the ultimate believer in the Nazi faith.  Not exactly a laugh a minute.   From Wiki "Rudel was a teetotaler and non-smoker. His fellow pilots coined the phrase Hans-Ulrich Rudel, er trinkt nur Sprudel (Hans-Ulrich Rudel, he drinks only sparkling water)." 

[Olham]

Well, in short: he must have been good at what he did - but I don't think I would have liked him.

Still though, I prefer an honest man who still admits AFTER all was lost, that he is a true Nazi,

to all those liars who "never had anything to do with it all".

I still wouldn't like him - but I knew where he stands.

[Hauksbee]

Well, in short: he must have been good at what he did - but I don't think I would have liked him.

Agreed. Fanatical, "true believer" types are often prickly because so few come up to their exalted standards.

 

Jim: Thanks for the run-down. I guess he wasn't as bullet-proof as I had thought. I'll have to read his accounts someday

[Hauksbee]

Try flying with a Unit Insignia like this these days!

.

[Olham]

Yeah, indeed!

[JimAttrill]

Here is the Bf109F-4 flown by Marseille - note the negro boy insignia and the victory markings on the tail.

 

[Olham]

Here is the Bf109F-4 flown by Marseille - note the negro boy insignia and the victory markings on the tail.

 

The "negro-boy insignia" is not Marseilles personal emblem, but that of JG 27, which operated in Africa.

 

What is "political uncorrect" today, was quite common in the past, even until the early 60s.

The American song "Ten little Injuns" soon became "Ten little niggers" - in a German version it's called

"10 kleine Negerlein".

German chocolate company SAROTTI had a "Mohr" (spelled like the French "maure") as their emblem.

They only changed it in the 90s, into a more golden-skinned figure.

 

 

[JimAttrill]

Robinson's jam used to use a 'gollywog' on their labels.   Apart from the fact that the Golly (a form of Dolly) was black, the word 'wog' has always been an insult to any dark-skinned person.  It was reputed to come from "western oriental gentleman" and if you believe that you are on a different planet.   There is a common expression in England "Wogs begin at Dover" (or Calais in some sayings)  so that includes the rest of the world!  The derogatory word "wog" is reputed to come from the black doll gollywog and I reckon that is right. 

 

The garage man in the Noddy series of childrens books has been replaced by a white man.  Noddy and Big Ears have been reputed to be in a homosexual relationship but I suppose that is ok now, if not preferable to some. 

[Olham]

Garage man? Noddy series??? Jim, I'm from a different cultural area - could you enlighten me?