Flyby PC

I was pretty sure, but just wasn't certain about the true colours, but especially the unusual context. Found this good thread since - http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=15149&st=0

Very weird feeling. I'm actually getting a bit apprehensive about P4. Not only am I going to get murdered by AI fighters, but that my murder is going to be extremely detailed and graphic too. Stunning fellas. More images please.

Hmmmm, not sure, but that ribbon might be a VFW medal, Veteran of a Foreign War. It's less of a medal, and more of a veterans campaign type medal, quite a broad kirk I would imagine, but a badge of honour for servicemen who fought abroad.

Fair comment themightysc, but at the end I still wanted to see more of it, not less. I didn't mind the early stuff in the program either. Those BE2's could hardly get off the ground with two people on board, and your aerobatics were seriously limited. A deathtrap with layers! I remember finding Aviator pictures on the website and thinking I'd died and gone to heaven with so many HD pictures of WW1 aircraft at every possible angle. How could anybody get picture of these things I never knew existed??? Even their room full of machineguns on every wall. I'll bet there were people watching that program with their eyes on stalks. Besides, a big part of the TV program was promoting the Aviator's Workshop itself, so I don't mind them seeking a bit of the limelight, they thoroughly deserve the publicity for what they've done and are still doing. I did actually wonder whether the form of the program was slightly squewed towards the aircraft they had available, but then they dropped in quick cameos of Brisfits, Camels, Sure I saw a Niewport in there too, and a DVII at the end, so that argument didn't hold much water. To fit any 'formula' to the program, it was called Top Gun, and I suspect the formula for the script was a WW1 'Icon to Icon' dogfight, and the iconic aircraft for the entente side was the SE5, and the workhorse/glamourpuss for the Germans was undoubtedly the Albatross. Personally, if I had the money, I'd love to sponsor that workshop to make 4 hour long detailed historically accurate programs - one dedicated to every year of the war. I hope that day will come, (not if it's waiting for me to have the money it won't), but once the Aviators workshop has the full compliment of WW1 aircraft assembled and airworthy, I think we'll see a lot more programs like this. I'd also bet a humungous sum of money that the Aviators Workshop respect for historical authenticity is every bit as keen as anyones. But TV producers? Hmmm, who can say?.....

Thanks for that Pol. (It was a genuine question by the way, not pointed towards OFF especially. I saw the swivell mount on the BE2 in the program in just the same location and suddenly wondered. It's exactly as the man said, you jump in and out of planes and see what works. I think the pivot setup would be more comfortable to fire, but wonder whether a flexible arc of fire was any more accurate than a fixed mount. I suspect not). The other surprise was the anti-aircraft artillery. It sounds like it was pretty fierce at lower altitudes, and if I heard correctly, nearly every sortie returned with damage. Luckily the airframes were nearly all canvas the shrapnel would often pass through without hitting anything vital. I'd like to watch the whole program again now.

I'm often critical of TV programs, but I thought it was pretty good. We're all a bit biased here because we perhaps know a little more about it than Joe Public due to our background interest in WW1 flying, but take that in to account and it was pretty good I thought. My biggest criticism is it was only an hour long. How I wish they'd remove some of the crap TV we have to watch to run a full series on a subject like that. It was a bit narrow perhaps, I don't even recall the French being mentioned, but I suppose the editing has to be brutal to fit the hour long slot. Nothing about the big bombers. I was hoping to see the SE5 evading the Albatross too, but I think they'd made their point that it wasn't a fair fight. I think that Aviators Workshop itself is quite uplifting to see. As it goes from strength to strength, and I hope it does, in the years to come I think we're all in for some spectacular sights. Those BE2's didn't half look frail old things though. I have one question though, you know in our Bristol Scout we have the machinegun set at an angle to avoid the prop? Were those guns fixed in real life, or were you able to pivot them?

Hellfire! Panic! The clocks have changed! - Phew, it's 6:30, I haven't missed it. Cough, cough, it's err, ... also still Monday. Never mind, false alarm. As you were gentlemen....

My diving days are over. I developed an ear problem. Nothing serious, - unless you're under water. Your ears balance themselves as the pressure increases or decreases, lke when your ears pop in an aircraft. I had no problems going down the way, but as I started to come up, my ears weren't equalising properly, and I was getting very dizzy due to the pressure building up inside my ear. I was ok if there was something to hold on to for stability until the dizziness passed, but in open water, it was very easy to get really disorientated and I had a couple of minor frights. Well, it's over egging the pudding to call them frights, but let's call them 'warnings' that I might not always be so lucky. Thing is, it was a progressive thing, and for some time before I went to see a doctor I was increasingly nervous about it, and wasn't really enjoying my diving so much. So when it came to the crunch, giving it up wasn't really that difficult.

Thanks Olham. These are my friends, Odin and Pippin. One more observation about the pictures is the colour. When I used to Scuba dive, the deeper you went, the less colour there was. I reckon those images would actually be pretty bleak. Second thing I heard was James Cameron, director of Titanic and Avatar has just dived to the deepest part of the ocean in a manned submersible to film the bottom. I'm curious whether this has anything to do with inspiration for Avator 2. I've heard the sequel to Avatar is planned for 2016, and may be an ocean based story based on Pandora. The third story about the deep, was the contoversial scientist Craig Venter who cracked the code of human DNA is currently on a yacht somewhere 'secret' researching the deepest parts of the oceans for new forms of life with potential for scientific exploration. Apparently he's found million of new life forms, with every survey finding more. The hope they discussed was finding a new fuel/energy source which will help save our planet. Quite a week for deep sea stories.

I saw the trailer. Looks good.

I know a fella drives ROV's for Oil companies, and he seems to enjoy life. Plenty money sloshing about, but nothing quite so exotic as your friend seems to be doing. I don't know him very well, but once or twice he's had to be aware of kidnapping risks and the possibly getting shot, but whether that was true or just the beer talking is anybody's guess. I know he does get himself shipped all over the world at short notice.

So don't you need a pilot's licence for a microlight?

Know what's really nuts? I have a fantasy about building an aircraft and flying it. It sounds mad, but I mean like the early days, no training, no safety etc. The Wright brothers weren't trained pilots, and all these early fliers took their life in their hands with untested and unproven technology every time they took to the air. And for what? Simply to fly. Given the vast increase in knowledge, experience, and common sense, in theory, you should still be able to build your own aircraft and fly it, and while not safe or particularly wise, you'd be a lot safer than those early pioneers were, and it didn't stop them. I'm not serious about doing it of course. But its remarkable how different a world we live in these days. It's a better world in many respects, but if you could somehow reinvigorate the sense of adventure and enterprise which existed back then, I think the world would be so much more inspiring. We were getting there with the space race, but the only things which broaden your minds these days are computer games. There was a post a while ago commenting on the bravery and ultimate sacrifice of Kamikaze pilots in WW2, but I think it takes a special kind of courage to climb on board and aircraft which you don't know can actually fly, fly it when nobody has actually flown it before, and somehow get it back to ground in one piece without killing anybody, yourself included. I don't know what you'd call that, pioneering spirit perhaps, but a safe world can seem very dull at times. My advice Von Baur? Go for it, and enjoy every minute of it. It's a fine and noble ambition to fulfill.

How goes the OFF2 Kitty? If you fellas need any beer money, I'm sure some of us would be happy to chip in to a kitty to oil the wheels of industry. Might help take the sting out of the cost of P4 when it arrives. Just a thought ...

Stumbled across this. Not a bad effort, especially for 1:32 scale.

Sad thing is some day, somebody is going to do that for real, and everybody is going to go "Yeah, yeah, yeah, who did your CGI for you?" "But no, I did it. I mean really did it! I flew like a bird!" "Sure you did, and here's the video to prove it. Yes, yes, yes, be sure to stick that on YouTube now,... Next!"

I was actually being serious for once. Don't need to know the final price to stick away a couple of bucks now and then. Tnen again, I don't like money up front jobs myself. Seeing the money up front can add to the pressure. That's bad enough sometimes, but it can also take some of the fizz out of getting the job finished too. I shall leave the matter in hands of our illustirious leaders and say no more about it. They'll get P4 done, I have every confidence, and it'll be worth every penny.

Yes hoax, but... With something live hydraulic movie animatronics emphasising the movements of your arms, perhaps one day it will be possible to fly with bird wings. Have to say too, it is a hoax, but it looks a very good one.

I don't get you Redpiano. I might agree, OFF's SE5 sounds like it was sampled from a real SE5 engine. I don't know what you want. An SE5 that doesn't sound like an SE5? It's extremely difficult to take a sample of a sound of a real live engine in a given state, and use that sample as a loop to be the standard sound effect for an engine through all it's stresses and strains in a simulator. Having the sound of a real SE5 featuring centrally in the mix is a fantastic place to start from, and love it or hate it, it adds a layer of authenticity which no other Sim even comes close to doing. If you don't 'get' that, then there's an awful lot of stuff in OFF that's just going to go right over your head. You might well think it's naff, but you're not really looking, and I mean it with friendly intentions, but you're also running the risk of offending some people whom most of us hold in very regard.

I don't have a problem with the sounds in OFF. I don't think they're realistic to an actual aircraft, (that's impossible), but they are certainly good enough to suspend belief and convince yourself that you are in an aircraft. Ironically, if you had real sounds piped in, I suspect that they would feel extremely unrealistic, and would damage your eardrums to boot. What I don't understand is the comparison with other flight sims. What dozen sims are you referring to? Because all my Il2 derivatives, Forgotten Battles, 1946 etc, sound like you're flying into battle in sewing machines. Battle of Britain wasn't much better, Wings of Prey wasn't very impressive either. ROF I can't remember, I haven't had it installed for some time now. Come to think about, OFF sounds aren't really bad at all, and at least there is some thought been put into the engine sounds, AND and admin function to let you adjust it if you don't like it. Case not proven in my mind Redpiano, not by a long shot. What Sim do you consider has the best sound effects? I'll likely have it and give it a go for comparison. Be aware too, CFS3 is an 'older' game, and you can edit the sound files as you like. I used to love the sound of my Merlins cranked up to 11 and ripping tears in the sky. They didn't really sound like Merlins of course, but they sounded powerful and distinctive enough to put a grin on my face. If you don't like the OFF sounds, sample some sound you do approve of, and we'll give them a go.

I'd love to fly. First choice would be an open cockpit, (in a warmer climate perhaps), but it always struck me that bomb aimer or turret gunner in the front of an aircraft like a He111, B17 or a Lanc etc, but have been an amazing place to sit. Not so clever once the shooting starts perhaps, but an awesome front row seat all the same. Anybody watch scrapheap challenge? A few years ago, they had an international show with teams from th US, UK and France, and they all had to build an aircraft from scrap. From memory, I think the US tried to build the Wright Bros flyer, and the French tried to copy Bleriots cross channel aircraft, but the Brits just said we're not copying anything, and just building an aeroplane that flies. The US and French aircraft did fly, but the maiden flights were very cautious, and little more than a quick hop off the deck. The UK pilot was either a complete nutter, or had uncommon faith in his scrapheap built aircraft but took off and soared to a height of several hundred feet and did several circuits of the airstrip. I don't mean it in a Nationalistic way, but it was a very uplifting thing to watch, They were 'kind of' given their propellers, or at least 3 were hidden in the scrapyard, but everything else allegedly came from the scrapyard. I'm always suspicious about such a TV program, and how 'real' and naturally occurring the scrap actually is, but all the same, the aircraft did fly and it did look a fun project to be involved with. I look around my yard, but there's not much chance getting my 4.5ton forklift to fly...

I've seen that Lou, yes, but that footage doesn't look quite the same as what this lady was describing seeing. That's kind of why her words struck me as odd. She describes it as burning in the air for a long, long time (her words) as opposed to exploding. It didn't lose bouyancy immediately as it would if an explosion ripped through the hydrogen cells all at once, it would quickly come hurtling towards the ground. We all know hydrogen is very flammable, but only once there is oxygen there too. To really explode, you would need the hydrogen and oxygen mixed before ignting. A 'ball' of hydrogen would only really burn at the perimiter where it can disperse itself and where there is contact with Oxygen in the air. If there was no explosion ripping through the cell walls, they would only fail sequentially as the fire consumed them. She describes fire, an engulfing fire which took time to destroy the aircraft, but no explosion. I don't know what altitude the Zeppelin was at, or how thin the air was to support fire. The Hindenberg was nearly on the ground. I'm left wondering whether things still burn with the same ferocity at 25,000ft, particularly if the object was nearly stationary relative to prevailing winds. Bother! Tried to upload the Podcast but it's 13 Mb and the limit is 10. I'll try editing it later. It's only the last minute that talks about it.

Hmm, reading up, there were about 50 raids on Britain, and they weren't considered stategically valuable apart from scaring the population, (which they did). There were however over 1000 patrols over the North Sea scouting for shipping activity and mine laying, and even on occassion dropping to low level to pick up men from ships, or search ships for contraband. It's quite interesting, because the way these the Zeps actually fly in CFS3, if you let them get away from you, you have a devil of a job getting altitude to take them on. I often wondered whether it was a realistic engagement in a combat Sim to catch a Zeppelin when vulnerable at low level, or even chase a Zeppelin as it raced to climb away out of danger. Unless you caught it on the ground at take off, I presumed it wouldn't normally be the type of target you'd typically engage. But if they did drop down to interact with shipping, then it is indeed quite a reasonable supposition to make, although I imagine the airship captain would pick any such locations for a landing very carefully. Despite the Hydrogen and Blaugas filling, they weren't easy to set on fire either, and it was only after incendiary bullets were invented that they could be brought down. The ships were rigid, and filled with hydrogen or blaugas (propane like) cells, so if the gas burned rather than exploded, there wouldn't be one massive fireball, but several slightly less massive fireballs, and each cell would succumb to the flames in turn, meaning I suppose it could indeed stay bouyant for some time while burning, as bits of rigid structure fell away. Quite a horrific way to go if you think about it...

Yes, fantastic Lou. I had always assumed these were little more than nuisance raids. It's late in the day to be discovering they were considerably more serious than that. They even raided Scotland in 1916. I never even knew it. I also believe for all that talk about anti-aircraft artillery and air defence, in the early days, the simple altitude of the Zeppelin meant these were ineffective, and Zeppelins could attack at leisurely pace with virtual impunity. That all changed of course....

Is P4 - OFF 2 going to have Zeps? Not a request, - just an enquiry.