Manual wing sweep?

[Default]

I'm guessing the answer is no, but is there any way to manually control the degree of wing sweep in the add-on MiG-23 and MiG-27 aircraft in WOE, or any other swing-wing aircraft, for that matter? I was under the impression that the MiGs did not have an automatic sweep system, but I understand that the game engine may not allow for manual sweep settings. Thanks for any info, great forum and resources here!

[Jarhead1]

Nope, animations have to be added in 3DS Max by the maker and if they dont make them manually sweepable, then u cant do it.

Edited September 21, 2008 by Jarhead1

[Default]

Oh well. Thanks for the quick and informative reply!

Edited September 21, 2008 by Default

[Jimbib]

Nope, animations have to be added in 3DS Max by the maker and if they dont make them manually sweepable, then u cant do it.

 

I don't think that was what he was asking. If the wings sweep on an aircraft at all, then most likely there is an animation slot added by the modeler in 3DS Max. The action of the wings sweeping in the Thirdwire series doesn't really make a difference to the flight model, as the series does not support different flight characteristics at variable geometry phases of the wings. See, if you take a look inside the data.ini of one of the aircraft, or any sweep wing aircraft for that matter, there should be an animation ID that is linked to a swing wing 'component.' For simplicity's sake, this component is usually set as a highlight device, allowing it to automatically sweep as velocity increases or decreases past a certain point. Take the third party MiG-27D mod for example, what you could probably do to make it a manual operation is change the current wing sweep data entries...

 

[LeftSwingWing]
SystemType=HIGHLIFT_DEVICE
DeploymentMethod=AUTOMATIC_MACH
Setting[1].Angle=45.0
Setting[1].DeployValue=0.80
Setting[1].RetractValue=0.85
Setting[2].Angle=72.0
Setting[2].DeployValue=0.40
Setting[2].RetractValue=0.45
MaxDeflection=72.0
MinDeflection=0.0
ControlRate=0.2
AnimationID=1
CLiftdc=0.0710
CDdc=0.0200

[RightSwingWing]
SystemType=HIGHLIFT_DEVICE
DeploymentMethod=AUTOMATIC_MACH
Setting[1].Angle=45.0
Setting[1].DeployValue=0.80
Setting[1].RetractValue=0.85
Setting[2].Angle=72.0
Setting[2].DeployValue=0.40
Setting[2].RetractValue=0.45
MaxDeflection=72.0
MinDeflection=0.0
ControlRate=0.2
AnimationID=1
CLiftdc=0.0710
CDdc=0.0200

 

To something like

 

[LeftSwingWing]
SystemType=ANIMATION
InputName=ANIMATION_1
DeploymentMethod=MANUAL
AnimationTime=6.0
AnimationID=1
CLiftdc=0.0710
CDdc=0.0200

[RightSwingWing]
SystemType=ANIMATION
InputName=ANIMATION_1
DeploymentMethod=MANUAL
AnimationTime=6.0
AnimationID=1
CLiftdc=0.0710
CDdc=0.0200

 

Only problem with this is you would not get the intermediate wing sweep angles of 45° and 72°, however, you can see that manual wing sweep is possible.

[+CrimsonRoamer]

Example from F-14A

 

 

[LeftSwingWing]
SystemType=HIGHLIFT_DEVICE
DeploymentMethod=MANUAL //<=change from automatic mach
Setting[1].Angle=24.0
Setting[1].DeployValue=450//<=change to allow wing-sweep at most airspeeds
Setting[1].RetractValue=500//<=change to allow wing-sweep at most airspeeds
Setting[2].Angle=48.0
Setting[2].DeployValue=450//<=change to allow wing-sweep at most airspeeds
Setting[2].RetractValue=500//<=change to allow wing-sweep at most airspeeds
MaxDeflection=48.0
MinDeflection=0.0
ControlRate=0.6
ModelNodeName=LeftWing
RotationAxis=Z-Axis
CDdc=0.0150
CLiftdc=0.0800
ReverseModelOrientation=TRUE

[RightSwingWing]
SystemType=HIGHLIFT_DEVICE
DeploymentMethod=MANUAL //<=change from automatic mach
Setting[1].Angle=24.0
Setting[1].DeployValue=450//<=change to allow wing-sweep at most airspeeds
Setting[1].RetractValue=500//<=change to allow wing-sweep at most airspeeds
Setting[2].Angle=48.0
Setting[2].DeployValue=0
Setting[2].RetractValue=500
MaxDeflection=48.0
MinDeflection=0.0
ControlRate=0.6
ModelNodeName=RightWing
RotationAxis=Z-Axis
CDdc=0.0150
CLiftdc=0.0800
ReverseModelOrientation=TRUE

 

[RightFlap]
SystemType=HIGHLIFT_DEVICE
CLiftdc=0.10
CDdc=0.025
Cmdc=0.010
DeltaStallAlpha=-2.06
AreaRatio=1.00
DeploymentMethod=AUTOMATIC_AERODYNAMIC_LOAD //change from 'manual with blowback' for all flaps
Setting[1].Angle=25.0
Setting[1].DeployValue=113.2
Setting[1].RetractValue=130.9
Setting[2].Angle=55.0
Setting[2].DeployValue=113.2
Setting[2].RetractValue=130.9
MaxDeflection=55.0
MinDeflection=0.0
ControlRate=0.2
ModelNodeName=Right_Flap
AnimationID=10
//RotationAxis=X-Axis
//ReverseModelOrientation=TRUE

 

Try that perhaps

 

EDIT: dammit Jimmy you posted while I was typing. Anyway, if this works it'll allow three position sweep

Edited September 21, 2008 by CrimsonRoamer

[+CrimsonRoamer]

I refined the deploy values and it actually works perfectly

 

the following manuvers were done at about 450knots

 

 

The same trick should work on any aircraft with a swing wing

[+CrimsonRoamer]

I refined the deploy values and it actually works perfectly

 

the following manuvers were done at about 450knots

 

 

The same trick should work on any aircraft with a swing wing

[Default]

Okay. I'm able to trigger the wing sweep animation on the MiG-27D, but haven't yet puzzled out how to do it in steps. But, if I'm reading what you're saying right, it doesn't really matter, FM-wise, as the degree of sweep isn't aerodynamically modeled. So, either live with the pilot workload-simulating task of manually sweeping the wings at certain speeds (which doesn't actually affect anything other than visually) or live with automatic mach number actuation of the sweep (which the MiG-27D doesn't actually have in real life). Thanks again for the resonses!

[Fubar512]

The series supports swing wings, aerodynamically (as well as visually) as highlift devices, with the advantages......and disadvantages, of that sort of control surface.