gbnavy61

From what I've heard, the re-engined Tomcats surprised the Eagle drivers greatly when they first came on the scene. The F-15 guys had the F-14A figured out, but got their asses waxed by the A+/Bs. I'm also reminded of another story I read. Some F-14A's were down in Florida and had a mock engagement with some F-15's out of Tyndall, I think. I believe it was a 4v4 setup. They not only smoked the Eagles in WVR combat, but got simulated Phoenix kills on all the Eagles before the Eagles even knew they were there. Like the Shah said, the Eagle might have been the 'Air Superiority' fighter, but the Tomcat was the 'Air Supremacy' fighter.

The Iranians kicked major ass with the F-14 against Iraq - which had help from just about every major nation at the time, including the US (which helped Iraq learn some Tomcat secrets), but particularly the USSR and France. Ironically, the only country offering support to Iran back then was Israel. The Iranians who were the "Shah's pilots" were very well trained. They got all their knowledge and skill straight from Grumman and the Navy. The pilots and RIOs trained after the Iranian revolution (after the US stopped the training program) were the less experienced ones, with more political indoctrination than military. However, once the war began, the Shah's pilots that hadn't fled the country to avoid persecution, torture and imprisonment, were all let out of jail to fight the Iraqis. They not only tangled with Iraqi pilots trained by the Soviets and French, but occasionally came up against them in combat - particularly the Russian and East German pilots flying Foxbats. The Iranians thought the Tomcat was a great dogfighter, though it was hampered by those lousy TF-30's. They had a good number of Sidewinder kills to go along with the Sparrow, Phoenix, and even the odd guns kill. The reason the Iranians went with the Tomcat instead of the Eagle was because the Tomcat was the total weapons system. The Eagle was a good dogfighter, to be sure, but it lacked the radar, TCS, and long-range punch of the Phoenix. Additionally, the Tomcat's variable geometry allowed for lower approach speeds and therefore didn't require the same long runways as the Eagle. The Eagle had a radar nowhere near the AWG-9's capabilities and had to rely on the Sparrow for BVR kills - limited by the fact that it's a semi-active radar missile.

The only reason the F-15 is still serving is because the F-22 costs an ungodly amount of money. The USAF can't afford to do a one-for-one replacement. Eagle Eater, Baby!

Hadn't thought of it like that.

Yeah, unless you're getting us some Tanker assets to gas up on the way in and out.

Yeah, I can't recall a specific instance, but I'm sure I've had at least one flight that has left me saying, "If that other SOB wasn't in the second seat, I might not be here to think about it right now." Makes you reflect. Good story.

Thanks.

What do you mean by "we were out of Europe by the 50's?" We're still there. Aviano, Italy and Ramstein, Germany to name two off the top of my head. Anyhoo, the problem is that Russia holds too much of the leverage right now. They don't have to take anyone too seriously, because they know the will or means to back it up isn't there. It'd take a lot of international cooperation with implications of force to back the Russians down right now. Edit: I'll shut up for a while, because I find I'm repeating myself.

Yeah. What makes you think that after Russia accomplishes those "limited" objectives that they will listen when somebody says, "Ok. The Georgians won't bother those folks in S Ossetia anymore. You can leave now?"

On the up-side, they'll probably never forget that again. If they're flying at all anymore.

Wowzers. Still, better to have overstressed the hell out of the bird than plant it and take all those aircrew with. The old choice of: if we do nothing we're dead, if we do something we might die anyway, but there's a slight chance we'll make it. I'll take option B as well. Maybe I should check in with some of my P-3 buddies. Any photos out there?

I guess the crux of the issue is what the technical definition of an "independent state" is, regarding S Ossetia and Abkhazia. I don't think the Russians have any legal basis to be occupying those territories. Therefore, they have committed a hostile act against a neighboring country. I certainly don't like that the Georgians were blasting their own citizens, but they had the "right" to do that since it's their country. Russia is just taking advantage of the situation. Russia has Europe by the balls with energy resources and the stupidity of the US has left it too weak - politically and militarily - to counter Russia on its own. The Russians know this and they'll press until they think they can't actually get away with more. I agree that the West/NATO is now in a position to send a message to the world based on what they do or fail to do on behalf of Georgia. I hope Georgia is not sacrificed, but I have concerns that it will be. (Reminds me of Czechoslovakia pre-WWII.) I have a feeling, regardless of what Ukraine does, the Russians would probably not press the issue because I think that would draw a major international response - with more than talk to back it up. (Like Poland in 1939.) Anyone else seeing parallels here?

Man, they're dropping like flies here. RIP, Chef.

Also read something I find kind of funny. Russia sortied ships based in Ukraine to head to the Black Sea waters off Georgia. Ukraine said if the Russians blockade Georgia, they have the right to deny the Russian ships entry into port on their return.

I'd tend to agree with this as well. ---- I think Russia is using the opportunity to weaken Georgia and gain back some of it's lost Soviet Empire - or at the very least, exact a little revenge on a former Soviet region who wants in with the West via NATO. I'm not sure what Georgia hoped would happen going into this thing. If I have read correctly, the Georgians took the first act of moving troops into the disputed S Ossetia, which only furnished the Russians with an opportunity to claim provokation (genocide or whatever they want). Who knows who shot first? Doesn't matter anymore, the stuff has hit the fan. Now that the fighting has begun in earnest, it's going to be difficult to tell Russia to stop - not before they get what they want, anyway. I'm not sure what should happen with S Ossetia. It certainly seems like an internal Georgian affair to me, and I think Russia ought to butt out. I don't condone killing people to exert control over a geopgraphical area, but it is part of history and likely will be for a long, long time. Killing is wrong, but very few (if any) countries can claim to have established themselves without a violent history (the Revolutionary War, the Civil War, the Russian Revolution, etc.). I think we ought to be very wary of Russia, particularly with Putin still in a position of authority. I believe they've more than recovered from the economic collapse with the fall of the Soviet Union. Now they're flexing their muscles and trying to send the world a message that they're still a major player. So far, it's limited to a regional conflict, but I could see it going further - perhaps not now, but maybe in the not-too-distant future.

1. Every WO*/FE/SFP1 is a stand alone program - has everything you need (aircraft, maps, etc.). So, no you're not required to have SFP1. 2. You can have mutliple installs of the same game (WO*). This allows for having a version of WOV that is modern day jets, and one that is set in WWII. Hope that helps.

I'd tend to agree with this.

Are you kidding? If we even have any interests in the conflict, our news (particularly Fox) is not going to be very objective at all.

First off, love the MF Crusaders. Just a tits airplane and well done by TMF. BZ, lads. Now onto the unpleasantness... Running Vista, using WOI w/ latest update, and TMF Weapons Pack for WOI (May '08). I experience this problem w/ some Crusaders but at times the starboard side Y rail appears upside down. Actually, it's more correct to say that the starboard rail appears to be the port rail, just just rolled 180 degrees and stuck to the starboard side. I think this is a glitch and not designed into the model on purpose. Every photo I found seemed to indicate that the rails on each side should mirror each other (on both sides the upper AIM-9 is slightly forward of the lower). It's not a major problem - she still flies like a dream (a Mach 1.7+ dream), but as one who appreciates the aesthetic qualities of the Crusader, it bugs me. Has anyone else encountered this phenomenon, and if so, is there a way to fix it? Also, not sure what that black bit is on the starboard side. Is it related, or is that supposed to be there? Lastly, anyone know if a true photo recce version is being pondered?

Yeah, this was sad news. I enjoyed most of Bernie Mac's stuff. RIP.

Well, the issue may not need to be addressed. Still, it would be interesting to know what causes it in some and not the others. Perhaps it's a quick-fix .ini edit or something we could do ourselves - not requiring a whole new download. Either way, something is different between the versions because you are able to see the canopy open or close from inside the cockpit on certain F-8's. Try it out, I'm not making this up. The mirrors are on the canopy frame, not the windscreen frame - you can watch them go away as the canopy opens.

I've experienced the same cockpit disappearance in WOI in the MF Crusaders (I'm not sure if other planes are effected since I've really been just sticking with the 'Saders lately). I set my mission wx to random and if I get "inclement," the fog is inside the cockpit with me and going through the clouds, all I can see is the gunsight on the combining glass. I have a mix of graphics settings, not strictly "unlimited" set so I'm not sure what other commonalities I have. Also my resolution is substantially lower - I think I'm only 1024x960 or a setting higher. No idea on your mod questions. I'm using the MF Weapons Pack May 08.

Ok, here's a new one (for me at least). I noticed on some models, the canopy open/close animation works fine, but the view from inside the cockpit doesn't show the canopy opened/closed, while others do. I think it works fine in the B and J, but the D and E show a closed canopy regardless of the animation. Is this another issue related to these two being the first F-8's released, or something else?

They all look nice (and better on the Tomcat - except maybe the D'backs).

Easiest I've experienced so far is the Tomcat - though I typically FLY NAVY and don't much bother with the rest. Tomcat's got the BVR reach and also the speed, power, maneuverability, and countermeasures to get around most threats. The F-8 is also pretty easy to fly and fight with. I've been shot down a few times, mostly from being out of missiles and trying to make a guns run on a tail-gun equipped bomber - not my favorite thing to do. Once, though, I did experience a realistic Crusader bite-you-in-the-ass-ism. I was coming in behind this MiG for a guns pass and realized a little too late that I was going to overshoot. Trying to salvage what I could and stay behind him, I popped the boards out, and tried a pulling roll off to one side - it had worked for me before. This time, I think I pulled a little too hard and the sucker departed and was spinning about half a second later. There I was falling to earth with about 1000' between me and the mountain top. Only enough time to mutter some obscenity and pull the handle.