Over50

Thanks all for the replies. As you can see by my sig I'm a CH fan (and have been since day one) including the rudder pedals. I also jumped in the TIR5 pool earlier this year and posted accordingly with my prescription glassess issues and other related questions. Frankly, of the two (TIR and rudder pedals), for me personally the rudder pedals are the most beneficial overall taken as a whole. But that's another thread topic. Again, thanks to all for taking time to reply.

I've done a cursory scan of a number of threads and didn't come across it, and not being a regular, was wondering if a ETA (rough estimate) been mentioned for Phase 4?

Ah, question asked, question answered! Many thanks...

Good to hear you solved the problem. Just to add, if you're like me you'll also find it useful to remember F12 as needed to re-align your TIR view while flying to find the optimum view center of your right-left, up-down cockpit and over the top wing head movement scanning.

FWIW, I had the same setup problems as you, meaning I gave up trying to sort through establishing a "profile". Just too much fiddling required - and then half the time the profile was lost between operation sessions which I never did figure out a solution for. I'm running W7 64 bit along with the TIR5 as you are. I also wear trifocals - but I now have computer glasses with just mid-range correction in the upper 2/3's of each lens and the normal 28 millimeter bifocal correction in the lower third of each lens. I posted here in another thread and the guys jumped in offering help as they are now. But after a lot of trial and error the simplest workable solution for me was to set my Speed at .8 (point 8, not 8) and Smoothness to 25. Increasing the smoothness and speed settings did lessen the amount of head movement required to see aft but it was near impossible for me to stay oriented without nausea tendancy due to the excessive, rapid changes of view forward, aft, up, down, and in between when trying to keep an enemy in view while repositioning my plane to attack again. I ended up posting at TIR's support forum and a TIR rep replied recommending the default 1 speed and 10 smoothness settings apply in most instances, and then try lowering the speed from 1 and increasing the smoothness gradually to around the mid 20's. Everyone's vision requirements are different and in my opinion there is no one size fits all, rather, it's trial and error until you can find a workable mix between view speed, range and in my case, nausea affects. EDIT: I found the TIR thread I posted - but had to do with image tearing at the monitor edges as I swung my view rapidly forward and aft. Maybe you'll find something of interest in the comments.. http://combatace.com/topic/55639-trackir-image-tearing-at-monitor-edges/

Just to comment on the motion sickness. As I wear trifocals it was a problem for me initially (about a month ago) after I bought TIR5. While it does take getting used to visually (as most here said it does), for me the major reduction in motion sickness and disorientation tendancy was not setting up TIR for 360 scan range and instead limiting my "normal" head scan view to 90 - 100 degrees right or left of forward with a .8 speed setting. This setting still permits a near full rear view if I turn my head quickly to where my actual view is at the monitor edges. And while the purists here frown on it, I also use the target lock to help me stay oriented while I get my aircraft turned to where I can follow the enemy using TIR alone.

Yup, I get the jerkiness initially, and like you, it stops after a 360 degree outside view scan a couple of times while still setting on the ground, and from then on I'm good to go from roll out to airborne. Of note, the initial jerkiness occurs with the game default view panning and with TIR. This is what makes me think it's cache related, where the jerkiness ceases once the images have been cached. And of note and as I mentioned prior there is NO edge tearing either while I'm on the ground stopped or rolling out but not airborne yet. But once I get above the trees and the terrain view expands the jaggies begin and remain a constant to varying degrees depending on TIR view rotation speed. I've seen some terraincache.xml files in the OFF directory but none of the values are intuitive enough to understand - but I've tried changing values anyway just to see what happens but none had any effect.

Well, no soap. Tried various settings including real time priority as well assigning TIR and OFF separate cores plus adjusting TIR from .6 to over 1 speed ranges and smoothing from the default 10 up to 50. The only other thought I've had has to do with caching, in other words, pre-rendering the image on the fly. For example, with FSX the first time I do a full left to right view sweep and back the image jerks but after that no more jerking. Then, too, I never do see the edge jaggies (with TIR) regardless which means it's probably unrelated to caching the image. Congrats to those who've found a workaround with one of the suggestions here. Just not in the cards for me apparently.

As a matter of fact, no. I'll give it a shot later this evening..

Well, I reset the MaxFPS to zero again and set my TIR to .8 speed and 25 smoothing. No Joy unfortunately. Then I tried various TIR speed settings trying to find the TIR/monitor refresh rate sweet spot .... but still no joy. With every thing tried so far, only slowing my head movement alleviates the tearing. What's maddening is when just setting on the ground with engine running and with all sliders at 5 I can quick scan front to rear and back as fast as I can turn my head w/o any edge jaggies. Same for take off but holding it on the ground with the terrain rapidly changing. But once I start climbing out where the view range begins to increase the jaggies start showing up. Sorry to rain on the parade guys but neither the MaxFPS or TIR speed setting below 1 circumstance has worked for me. Be it a quad core vs dual core or XP vs W7 thing, I'm still out in the cold on this issue. The only remaining fix that's worked for a couple folks is a SSD....which I've already said isn't worth the added hassle and cost just for one game.

Just received a TIR5 and I'm in the process of trying to get used to it (speed disorientation with some motion related effects - as in makes you want to barf...) . One thing that's happening in OFF is image tearing at the edges of the monitor when view panning quickly from rear to front. I remember seeing this issue discussed in the forum and as best I can recall some folks came up with a settings work-around but not sure. Problem is I can't find the thread (or threads) and while numerous TIR related info is in the stickied General Hints thread none concern the image tearing. Would greatly appreciate a link to the thread if anyone has it handy..

Many thanks for the reference. I'm currently running TIR at "1" speed and 25 smoothing and I already run every game with Vsync on to prevent general image tearing which is a constant without it on with this 24" monitor. Didn't really affect my previous 20" LCD monitor that much (vsync off to gain fps) but then there weren't as many pixels to push around either. Anyway, I'll set the MaxFPS back to zero and then see if I find a TIR speed setting that works.

I did try a lower resolution w/o success. Also disabled one of my GPU's so as to ensure just one running, forced Vsync on and off in the Nvidia control panel, none of which helped except with Vsync forced off my FRAPS reported fps ran as high as 125 - right where I capped it in the default "Max" setting. But again, even with the higher frames number I still had the jaggies plus the added (and common) problem of display tearing with rapid motion where I had none with Vsync enabled. Just occurred to me that my Dell 24" IPS LCD has a 16:10 ratio format vs the standard 16:9. Someone smarter than me will have to decide whether that is preventing your "Max" 60 fps setting to address the jaggies in my case. As for "the hot ones"...well, at my age most every woman under the age of 60 would fall into that category in varying degrees. Sad I know...but it comes with living this long...

Hellshade.. My 1920x1200 IPS LCD native monitor refresh is 60 Hz with no other refresh options supported running DVI. So in my case setting the Max fps to 60 matches my monitor refresh rate, which as mentioned helped some but still have the jaggies with terrain included in the fast scanning but as noted none when sitting on the ground with the engine running and scenery detail and terrain at 4 or when airborne looking above the wing with blue sky and clouds while scanning.

No, I understand. But again, I'm really not inclined to spend the money for a SSD and/or SSD RAID configuration for just one game - which is what it comes down to as OFF is the only current game/sim I play in tandem with TIR where the edge jaggies occur. At the risk of being redundant - but I am - the TIR/jaggies thing is a OFF-only thing. Attempting to isolate the root cause has been and remains the issue. In your case SSD speed worked for you. If this is because of the game paging out to the SSD to render the terrain then this has more to do with the way CFS3 and/or the OFF overlay is written. As I don't see the jaggies with FSX running at near max scenery settings in tandem with TIR - and surely FSX's scenery detail is at least equal to that of OFF - with the identical subsystem and hardware just confirms my opinion that it's how the game (CFS3) is written and incorporated along with some refinements with the OFF overlay. I can alleviate the jaggies with one or more of the suggestions posted but not eliminate them entirely. I mean, with a W7 64 bit, I7-930 overclocked to 3. 8 GHz, 6 GB of DDR3 running at 1600 MHz system my rig isn't what I'd call a pig in terms of processing ability. And it isn't with all other games I run except for the jaggies with OFF. I learned early on there as some things in life that aren't worth getting worked up about and this is one of them, where my earlier posted jaunt to McDonalds for a chicken sandwich, Coke and oggling the sweet young things was by far more worthwhile...

Yup, I was running with FRAPS enabled after changing the max fps setting to 60 as you noted to gage what if any improvement. But - and of note - while there was less tearing, it was still present with Vsync at 60 FPS and with Vsync forced off (Nvidia control panel) with my frame rates varying from the low 70's to above 100. Keep in mind in my case, as I posted, interestingly the tearing does not occur sitting on the ground and fast scanning front to rear back or when airborne and fast scanning above the wing with blue sky and clouds. It only happens in my case when airborne and fast scanning horizontally which includes the terrain (again, TIR speed at 1 and smoothing at 25). And repeating, I can fast scan in every other sim (which includes FSX which in my opinion has a more complex graphics content than OFF) at near max detail settings using TIR with no tearing, which to me rules out my hardware or subsystem as a factor. You (I think it was you...) mentioned HDR and Bloom which I hadn't considered but know from other games can greatly affect performance in some games. Where are the options listed in CFS3/OFF ? OK, enough grief for now....I'm going to McDonald's for a McChicken and a Coke and ogle the sweet young things in their "summer" attire .... which is about all I can manage at my age now...

As I noted in another post, my prime interest for owning a PC in the first place is gaming (and personal financial mgm't, etc) and as such a separate 30 GB or even a 60 GB SSD wouldn't be practical when I regularly keep (and play) up to ten games or more installed (currently 11) plus all of the office, security and misc other software apps I regularly use. My 300 GB Raptor is half full right now for example. More power to you for your decision on a SSD specifically to play OFF. Same for other folks who elect to shell out $500 or more for the latest GPU for one or two games. But in my case my now getting-to-be-long-in-tooth GTX 260-216 cards in SLI (yes I know SLI doesn't work with OFF) can handle any current PC game available without having to resort to tweaks, etc., at 1920x1600 and at near to max graphics settings. As for relative cost, I was not a first adopter of the GTX 260-216 GPU's when released (around $360 if I remember right) and picked them up for under $200 each later on - and then not at the same time. The GTX 285's had taken top seat at the time and there was no way I was going to spend $900 to $1000 for a pair of 'em (and factor in a wife to contend with ..... ). Anyway, to keep this in perspective, the tearing only became an issue after purchasing the TIR5. And it only occurs in this game with TIR - and not in FSX, RoF, the IL2 series or Wings of Prey that I play regularly. And, too, as I mentioned sometime after starting this thread I'm a casual simmer (but not arcade), meaning while I really enjoy the experience and marvel at the progress of graphics detail over the past 15 years I try to avoid getting into the deep end of the pool with the hard core simmers so to speak which exist in all flight sim communities (but obviously didn't in this case). To each his own and I don't begrudge anyone devoting as much time or money as they wish toward whatever it takes to run a game to their satisfaction. But I do appreciate the hard core simmers as a resource when I have a question or issue with a game - as witness this thread.

Hellshade.. I tried your suggestion to set the default fps value from "0" to 60. While it did help some for my rig/setup, I still have 'em with rapid head movements. And just to mention, I have my TIR speed set to "1" and smoothing at 25. The prime head scratcher for me is even with all graphics sliders set to (5) I don't get the tearing just setting on the ground (engine running) and doing a fast rear scan or when airborne looking above the wing with mostly blue sky and doing the quick rear scan. But when I lower my view to the horizon which takes in trees and terrain while scanning to the rear and front again the jaggies show up. I've also played with the Nvidia "render ahead" setting by increasing it from the default "3" frames to the max but didn't help. About the only sure way for me to eliminate 98% of the jaggies is to run with minimum terrain and complexity slider settings - but makes the graphics look like a mid-90's throwback. I dunno. There are so many variables given each of our systems (hardware, software) I don't know if there is a one size fits all magic bullet. What works for one person doesn't for another and/or none of the suggestions work. (Sigh).....All said, this is just a game after all. And the scan jaggies are a CFS3/OFF occurance only for me, meaning I don't see it with FSX or IL2 1946 using the TIR and fast rear to front scanning. Early on someone said it's a known problem with OFF so just get used to it (or words to the effect). I'm inclined to agree, especially since nothing I've read so far (and tried) has totally resolved the jaggies with my particular setup/hardware. And since it is a OFF thing only there's no way I'm going to drop $700 on a SSD (assuming it is the fix) just for one game. And with this....it's waaay past my bedtime.......

TrackIR 5 w/clip. Software 5.0b CPU: i7 930 Quad Core OC to 3.8Ghz Zalman 9900 Cooler Evga TRI SLI x58 Mobo RAM : 6GB Patriot 1600 MHz running at 1600 Video: (2) Evga GTX 260-216 SC (factory over clocked) w/896 RAM *(only run one GPU w/OFF) Current Nvidia 197.45 driver 24" Dell 2410 IPS Flat Panel Monitor HD: 300 GB WD 10K Raptor PS 860 Watt PCP&C w/single 12v rail at 64A rms SB XtremeGamer Fata1ity Pro sound card 7 Case Fans, DVD-ROM & DVD-RW OS: Windows 7 x64 edition OFF BH&H, HitR patched to 1.47 Never experienced edge tearing (jaggies) with rapid game default view panning. Did experience some stuttering when panning view on the ground with Vsync enabled but helped tremendously when I disabled Vsync with my previous E8400 based system running XP w/SP3. With my new I7 rig (and with a single GPU) I can run all sliders at 5 with no vsync with frame rates ranging from the upper 60's to low 90's depending on proximity to ground and denser rendering. Of note, enabling Vsync still induces some stuttering when on the ground and panning with or without TIR. Just to add, all system configuration rendering options are at the default values.

Frankly I don't feel any of the comments made so far remotely constitute "heat" and "aggressiveness" unless one feels personally slighted by others expressing doubt as to SSD's performance. There have been no personal attacks implied or otherwise from what I've read, which then would constiture heat and agressiveness in that context. Just because someone doesn't own/use a SSD doesn't relegate their reserved skepticism comments as confrontational. Maybe it's time to end this thread before someone really does get their shorts in a bind..

This thread has become an apples to oranges comparison discussion as far as I'm concerned - and I started this thread with the topic header "TrackIR - Image tearing at monitor edges". As I read it here's what it has come down to: One person has reported "hardly any tearing" (which infers some still exists) using TIR after installing a SSD, One person who uses TIR (if I read correctly) reports no image tearing since installing 2 SSD's, One person who doesn't use TIR (if I read correctly) reported no image tearing with SSD's - which infers he did using the game default view panning, And then there's the majority of us who have stated no image tearing using the game default view panning but have since they started using TIR which spans versions 3,4 and 5. The only commonality is no commonality where no two subsystems are identical in tandem with or without TIR. The only constant if I've read correctly is not one person has experienced similar OFF image tearing in any other game using TIR nor any when using the OFF default view panning w/o TIR. I would think the conclusion should be obvious....

For folks like me where gaming is the prime reason for owning a PC, spending +$200 for just 60GB of storage is next to useless when you factor in W7's foot print and games today averaging up to 10 to 13 GB in size which leaves little room for office type applications, security and other utility apps. In terms of storage to even get within shouting distance of my 300 GB Raptor a 250 GB SSD would have cost over 3 times as much here in the states. That's a heck of price premium to gain a few milliseconds of processing time. Or in the case of OFF, fly with no jaggies that are present when using TIR...

FWIW When I built my first SLI rig in May '08 my first priority was a top quality single +12v rail power supply with a +60 RMS amperage rating based on the recommendation of an Evga rep who specifically advised that a single +12v rail eliminates power balancing considerations with multiple +12v rail power supplies. As such I opted for a PC Power & Cooling 860 watt flavor with the following spec's: 860W Continuous (930W Peak) @ 50°C Heavy-Duty Caps, Inductors, Heat Sinks, Etc. External Fine-Tune Voltage Adjust (+3.3, +5, +12) Premium Sag and Surge Protection (.985 PFC) Ultra-High Efficiency (84% Typical) +12VDC @ 64A/70A Peak (Powerful Single Rail) Ultra-Tight Voltage Regulation 24Pin, 8Pin, and 4Pin M/B Connectors 4 PCI-E and 15 Drive Connectors NVIDIA SLI Certified (Dual 8800 Ultra) Ultra-High Reliability (200,000 Hr. MTBF) Since then I've upgraded to a Tri SLI Evga mobo paired with a I7-930 which I have overclocked to 3.8 GHz in tandem with (2) Evga GTX 260-216 SC (factory over clocked) GPU's, opted for a 300 GB 10K Raptor HD, and beefed up my case fans to a total of 7. I have yet to see even a hint of graphics display issues with any game, from Crysis to BFBC2 in addition to every worthwhile flight sim. Yes, the PS cost over $200, but as the saying goes, you get what you pay for. As for TIR use with OFF and the fast scan tearing, like most folks here I have no need for a couple of SSD's aside from the humungous cost premium - which I debated even opting for the 10K Raptor vs a standard 7200 HD of the same capacity.

You win! You win! Hail the almighty SSD.

OK! So much for my theory. I surrender! My inbox runneth over. Raptors are crap, forget about coding, GPU's, CPU's, mobo sub-systems and hail SSD's!