Do335

i don't mean to sass SF here but since falcon is the definitive f-16 sim and way up there on the realism scale... you know. there are ofc exceptions. the viper in sf seems to have a very large roll inertia same as the eagle. the FM could use some more fine tuning imo. the real thing uses fbw and gets a force sensing stick so the rolls are really snappy, ailerons actually deflect opposite ways when the pilot release the pressure on the stick to brake down the roll rate.

eehh, i'm not even sure that worked at all before the teen fighters appeared!...

you're on a roll cougar! keep em coming :)

wait... are we saying aim-9Bs can now actually hit things? i might start packing them.

sweet! we need more sf2 videos. the fury is a monster with those 20mikemikes!

interesting... putting the player in command mode. i may not be able to let go like that, but will try it out.

when flying missile fighters no.2 is indeed manageable, just target him on whatever you prefer. after that target is shot down no.2 will go to attack mode on his own until rejoin command is issued. if bandit gets on his tail, a msl shot can clear his six since the attacking bandit doesn't maneuver against you. or, just ask him to cover me, save his missiles only to lob 'em at rtbing migs at the end...no.4 is mostly a lost cause because player has no command to control him. the one thing i found that worked when flying phantoms was just flight rejoin. 4 will kick in burner and leave the mig in the dust while you turn around to engage preferable with sparrows. i suppose this works for cats v mig17s too. however i'm mostly flying f-86s these days. apparently there're no missile and afterburners which.. changes things. i'm somewhat hoping the break command does that, flying more missions to find out atm but.. wouldn't hold my breath on it :|

same here, i'm currently experimenting the break command. if the wingies can't cover each other, maybe just send them all out to attack. the "engage air" command always seems to put no. 2 and 4 in limbo mode..

24th kill for captain Bernie, his lead...

fraps here. also there're many other choices like bandicam etc. true that, leakers always make a mess of everything...

in before the cat fetishists...:) against AI vertical's always the best bet. those deflection shots sure are tricky tho.

does the ol' phantom have a 2nd rwr in the back for the wso? edit: right... remembered he'd turn off the kid in the back too lol

woh... seen my AI flight members go way off course coz of mud spikes but didn't know strikers would start hunting radars on their own... this is weird and imo borderline a bug.

wery wery nice! The Oriskany, panthers and banshees... in color!

I'm wondering about how the data ini entries work. The FM data defines lift/drag coefficients, however I can't seem to find where the surface area sizes are defined. Obviously the size of surface area is needed to compute a lift force, from its lift CL. For example, here is the data section for the F-4 phantom's leftouterwing: [LeftOuterWing] ParentComponentName=LeftWing ModelNodeName=wing_left_outer DestroyedNodeName=DAM_wing_left_outer ShowFromCockpit=TRUE DetachWhenDestroyed=TRUE DamageRating=DISABLED MassFraction=0.024 HasAeroCoefficients=TRUE LiftSurface=TRUE CL0=0.0123 CLa=0.6424 CD0=0.0007 CDL=0.0028 Cmq=-0.7695 Cmad=-0.1863 Clb=-0.0091 Clp=-0.0643 Clr=0.0025 Cnp=-0.0032 Cnr=-0.0041 CL0MachTableNumData=23 CL0MachTableDeltaX=0.10 CL0MachTableStartX=0.00 CL0MachTableData=0.958,0.960,0.968,0.981,1.000,1.026,1.060,1.105,1.162,1.162,1.585,1.329,1.101,0.918,0.789,0.699,0.653,0.594,0.533,0.483,0.445,0.407,0.370 CLaMachTableNumData=23 CLaMachTableDeltaX=0.10 CLaMachTableStartX=0.00 CLaMachTableData=0.958,0.960,0.968,0.981,1.000,1.026,1.060,1.105,1.162,1.162,1.585,1.329,1.101,0.918,0.789,0.699,0.653,0.594,0.533,0.483,0.445,0.407,0.370 CD0MachTableNumData=23 CD0MachTableDeltaX=0.10 CD0MachTableStartX=0.00 CD0MachTableData=2.097,1.223,1.096,1.018,1.000,0.988,0.981,1.001,1.015,1.208,1.215,1.451,1.513,1.495,1.476,1.523,1.571,1.546,1.515,1.463,1.419,1.379,1.343 CDLAlphaTableNumData=15 CDLAlphaTableDeltaX=4.00 CDLAlphaTableStartX=-28.00 CDLAlphaTableData=29.160,21.160,14.440,9.000,4.840,1.960,0.360,0.040,1.000,3.240,6.760,11.560,17.640,25.000,33.640 CmqMachTableNumData=23 CmqMachTableDeltaX=0.10 CmqMachTableStartX=0.00 CmqMachTableData=0.879,0.885,0.906,0.943,1,1.085,1.214,1.426,1.826,1.826,18.842,4.021,5.669,6.594,5.259,3.983,2.172,0.693,0.556,0.494,0.454,0.446,0.47 ClbAlphaTableNumData=37 ClbAlphaTableDeltaX=10.00 ClbAlphaTableStartX=-180.00 ClbAlphaTableData=-0.063,-0.065,-0.07,-0.079,-0.089,-0.1,-0.11,-0.119,-0.124,0.937,1.97,1.883,1.75,1.587,1.413,1.25,1.117,1.03,1,0.477,1.267,0.52,-0.088,2.387,2.35,2.283,2.17,1.874,-0.187,-0.15,-0.11,-0.1,-0.089,-0.079,-0.07,-0.065,-0.063 CnrAlphaTableNumData=37 CnrAlphaTableDeltaX=10.00 CnrAlphaTableStartX=-180.00 CnrAlphaTableData=0.000,0.004,0.015,0.034,0.060,0.094,0.134,0.181,0.234,0.293,0.357,0.426,0.500,0.577,0.658,0.741,0.826,0.913,1.000,0.913,0.826,0.741,0.658,0.577,0.500,0.426,0.357,0.293,0.234,0.181,0.134,0.094,0.060,0.034,0.015,0.004,0.000 XacMachTableNumData=23 XacMachTableDeltaX=0.10 XacMachTableStartX=0.00 XacMachTableData=-1.217,-1.219,-1.225,-1.236,-1.251,-1.271,-1.297,-1.33,-1.375,-1.375,-1.071,-1.257,-1.407,-1.531,-1.563,-1.633,-1.645,-1.639,-1.663,-1.675,-1.672,-1.682,-1.706 CheckStall=TRUE CLmax=0.1819 AlphaStall=13.50 AlphaMax=24.39 AlphaDepart=35.21 StallMoment=-0.002 StallDrag=0.001 StallLiftTableNumData=37 StallLiftTableDeltaX=10.00 StallLiftTableStartX=-180.00 StallLiftTableData=0.000,-0.013,-0.028,-0.045,-0.062,-0.058,-0.050,-0.034,-0.014,0.000,0.018,0.053,0.100,0.149,0.215,0.261,0.362,0.565,0.961,0.624,0.386,0.282,0.224,0.178,0.126,0.079,0.040,0.000,-0.014,-0.034,-0.050,-0.058,-0.062,-0.045,-0.028,-0.013,0.000 StallDragTableNumData=37 StallDragTableDeltaX=10.00 StallDragTableStartX=-180.00 StallDragTableData=0.001,0.008,0.021,0.043,0.082,0.123,0.171,0.227,0.292,0.367,0.451,0.562,0.689,0.825,0.937,1.018,1.142,1.122,1.000,1.122,1.142,1.018,0.937,0.825,0.689,0.562,0.451,0.367,0.292,0.227,0.171,0.123,0.082,0.043,0.021,0.008,0.001 StallXacShiftTableNumData=37 StallXacShiftTableDeltaX=10.00 StallXacShiftTableStartX=-180.00 StallXacShiftTableData=-0.304,-0.304,-0.259,-0.233,-0.231,-0.222,-0.206,-0.190,-0.168,-0.152,-0.136,-0.114,-0.097,-0.082,-0.073,-0.070,-0.044,0.000,0.000,0.000,-0.044,-0.070,-0.073,-0.082,-0.097,-0.114,-0.136,-0.152,-0.168,-0.190,-0.206,-0.222,-0.231,-0.233,-0.259,-0.304,-0.304 Chord=2.32 Ymac=-4.83 StructuralFactor=1.2 MinExtentPosition= -5.88,-2.83,-0.68 MaxExtentPosition= -4.04,-0.19,-0.44 CollisionPoint[001]=-5.88,-1.69,-0.37 CollisionPoint[002]=-5.88,-3.02,-0.37 HasVortexEmitter=TRUE VortexEmitterName=WingtipVortexEmitter VortexPosition=-5.84,-1.75,-0.34 VortexG=2.5 SystemName[001]=LeftPositionLight SystemName[002]=LeftLEFlap SystemName[003]=LeftOuterSlat But... how large is leftouterwing? 2 square meters or 200 square meters... can't seem to know looking at this. Appreciate it if FM gurus can shed some light.

Fubar i think i finally understood what you said http://bbs.thirdwire.com/phpBB3w/viewtopic.php?p=25313#p25313 when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth. my FM needs an overhaul...

OK... thanks fubar.

hi Fubar! Thanks for the reply. I'm more wondering about how it works with the data ini entries. Opened a new thread here http://combatace.com/topic/83599-where-are-the-sizes-of-surface-areas-defined-in-the-fm-entries/

Can I ask a dumb question... So we have all the data points defined in the FM. For example CD, CL of the wing etc. But apparently they're all coefficients, and what calculates them into a force would all requires an amount of surface area. So where is the size of the surface area defined? min/max extendpositions or... does the game engine automatically calculates it from the 3d model file? Seems to me the former is somewhat inaccurate and latter is a bit unlikely...

^yep realized that, gotta move them parking spots some time, mayhaps between the island and the cats... thnx for the heads up.

ooops found them.... disregard..

had the same problem... hated it because it always happened when i'm right on the other guy's tail and about to shoot then --> slideshow. minimized it by reducing the "visibledistance" of the emitters in the ps.ini, if you wanna try it http://combatace.com/topic/78638-fps-friendly-particlesystem-file/ PS to the old timers, is this why TK never included the b-52s in the 'nam campaigns?

On a side note.... how do you set parked aircrafts on these straight decks? I tried for a few hours and always ended up losing a wing. The AIs are fine since their collision is turned off while landing but, not for my own ac... ouch: TheWarrior sorry for the OT..... consider this a bump!:D

Hmmm SF is indeed interesting when referencing my own experience. Falcon4.0 is very moddable. Everything, I mean everything except the code can be modded. Compared to SF, bah locked 3D models, so for example wanna mod an F-4J into an S, not so easy. But when Falcon4 dev seemingly stopped around 2009~10 its community shrank considerably. But look at SF, for the past 2 years nothing significant has emerged from TW, just some bug fixes, if one can call em that, and some basic DLCs, but the activity here remains... constant? It's not 20 new threads a day but it's always going and the download section keeps growing. It's interesting. Reminds me of eco systems, turn a rain forest into barren land and nothing will come outta it again. But burn down a prairie, the grass will just grow back. I still believe that official code dev and even data changes are always a big factor. But I've been led to believe SF is more immune to it. I ask myself, if there's never been an SF2NA will you still be flying this, and the answer is yes. Looking down the line, it seems the gaming industry as a whole is facing a decline in quality, so probably nothing similar will even come around for quite some time. However I'm thinking too much. Apparently what matters most in the web world is always the now and now ain't so bad, be thankful for TK for this little gem and thankful for the modders that keep working on it and enjoy the flights is all.

nice one, sweet camera positions, loved the carrier trap.