[agrippa]

Is there a place where I can download a Vietnam campaign for Strike Fighters? In the downloads section here I've only found mods that make the commies playable, doesn't do me much good if I don't have the campaign to begin with.

[Southernap]

You want to look for Wings over Vietnam at your local computer store or online. Which uses the SF game engine and covers the war from the start of Rolling Thunder in 1964 to the end of Linebacker II in 1973. The playable sides are USAF, USN, USMC. The flyable aircraft are F-8, F-105, F-4, A-6, A-7, A-4, F-100.

[csb]

Combatace has at least 3 Vietnam campaigns that work with SFP1.

The 3 I have use the DRV terrain(also available here)

"Vietnam 1968 on... " http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?autom...p;showfile=2780

"Rolling Thunder"

"Operation CounterStrike"

There is also a terrain called SEA, not sure if any campaigns have been written for it.

[jtin]

csb, on Feb 2 2007, 06:28 AM, said:

"Vietnam 1968 on... " http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?autom...p;showfile=2780

That campaign is pretty old. I was trying to add ground objects, but I couldn't get them to appear. I only made it because I couldn't get Gepard's Rolling Thunder to work. You best bet is to by WoV.

SEA is at avsim, but I think it has some tile problems.

Or you could try making a campaign yourself. Look in the knowledge base for more info.

[csb]

jtin, on Feb 3 2007, 12:03 AM, said:

That campaign is pretty old. I was trying to add ground objects, but I couldn't get them to appear.

Hi,jtin

Well, what is wrong if it is old. It works.

They all work, although Rolling Thunder and Vietnam 1968 are the only two I have played since SP4.

jtin, on Feb 3 2007, 12:03 AM, said:

Your best bet is to buy WOV.

Now, you're just trying to earn your commission :wink: Just joking.

I have only SF Gold, that's enough. Although YAP sounds very interesting.

[jtin]

I just think that WoV is worth the money...

I'll try to make a new campaign on DRV, how about 1973?

The scenario:

It is now January 1, 1973 and Operation Linebacker II has failed to decrease the North Vietnamese will to fight. The U.S. is making one last ditch attempt to settle this for once and for all. We need "Peace with Honor" NOW! This time there will be no mercy. The U.S. ground force will be doubled and new bombing sorties will be conducted. This time with no off limit targets except for civilian areas. The U.S. public is not going to stand any more years. We have to settle this now. It's up to you...

Yeah, yeah I know it wouldn't be feasible at that time, but this is just a game! :biggrin:

[Southernap]

Jtin,

How about this one,

Year:1975
During Operation Frequent Wind, the North Vietnamese Army shoot down a couple of the helicopters carrying American Civilians. All on board these helicopters are killed. The US military responds with military strikes against the North Vietnamese Army.

This would give you a chance to add an pair of F-14A squadrons along with most of the other WOV aircraft. VF-1 and VF-2 were on board the USS Enterprise when the Enterprise was deployed to Task Force 77. Though the squadrons didn't cross the beach they did provided air cover of the fleet.

Or this one

"Dixie station"
Create a campaign that covers the first 10 days of a 30 day line period in Vietnam for a carrier air wing where they would fly operations off South Vietnam. These were usually close air support missions or Armed Road Rec missions along the Ho Chi Minh trail through out the whole time of the Vietnam war. Usually after this line period the ship would head north and start to fly operations in Yankee station.

[jtin]

Southernap, on Feb 2 2007, 11:34 PM, said:

How about this one,

Year:1975
During Operation Frequent Wind, the North Vietnamese Army shoot down a couple of the helicopters carrying American Civilians. All on board these helicopters are killed. The US military responds with military strikes against the North Vietnamese Army.

This would give you a chance to add an pair of F-14A squadrons along with most of the other WOV aircraft. VF-1 and VF-2 were on board the USS Enterprise when the Enterprise was deployed to Task Force 77. Though the squadrons didn't cross the beach they did provided air cover of the fleet.

I like it! I think the introductory text would be something like this:

In the midst of the chaos of Operation Frequent Wind, a flight of UH-1 helicopters were shot down by North Vietnamese soldiers. Another flight of South Vietnamese UH-34s were also shot down. Only a few crewmembers survived, only to be captured, and presumably, executed or held hostage. The F-14s that were deployed to provide air cover in the evacuation are now ordered to retaliate. Other forces will be subsequently deployed. You are the spearhead of the attack. As part of Operation Frequent Fire, VF-1 Wolfpack, equipped with F-14A Tomcats has been deployed to the USS Enterprise.

There would need to be some research such as what helicopter squadrons were involved. Also, some skins are needed. Too bad the HH-53 isn't freeware, or else it could be included. I'm thinking the list of flyable aircraft would be:

A-4F-USN
A-6A-USN/USMC
AH-1G-USMC
F-4E-USAF
F-4J-USN
F-111D-USAF
F-14A-USN
UH-1B-USMC
UH-1B-CIA/Air America
UH-1H-USMC
UH-34-ARVN
AH-34-ARVN
OH-6A-USMC

This would probably be just a mostly chopper campaign, centering around finding and rescuing the missing helicopter crews. I'm thinking I could make this for SFP1 with DRV as well as WoV. Any thoughts?

[jtin]

I'll probably also include the SH-3 and HH-3.

In case anybody's wondering:
Changes:
I want to make the convoys in armed recon missions include tanks and infantry, not only trucks. I'll also make extensive new target areas with patrolling infantry, tank clustered areas, and I'll make the truck routes next to them, so you can have a fire fight in armed recon missions. Isn't that what helicopters are designed to do? I'm also looking into popluation the areas with destroyed tanks and buildings, as the war has already been going on for a long time! I'll also have to adjust the frontline, as the story is after a North Vietnamese take over. All of South Vietnam would be taken over and the only airfields available would be the ones in Thailand and there would be carriers and helicopter carriers!

To do list (in order of needing to be done):
Make skins
Make needed ground objects
edit target areas
edit movement.ini and front line
make campaign
make screens
get neccessary permission to release
enjoy!

If anyone needs to help, this is what I need:
I would like a skinner for airplanes. I think the only skins I would need are the ones for the helos and a VF-2 tomcat skin, if there aren't ones already. I can do reasonably well in MS paint, (considering it is MS paint), but I don't think it'll be that good and it'll take a long time.

I would need a skinner for ground objects (or someone to help me). I'm thinking of converting a tanker to a helicopter carrier, to supplement the OH Perry and LHA-1. If anyone wants to make ground objects with models, then all the better.

If anyone wants to do screens, then that would also be welcomed. The stock screens won't really fit the theme...

I can (sort of) handle the .ini dancing, but the artistic stuff is what I lack.

I can easily imagine that this willl evolve into a BIG project, and I work very slowly, since I have little free time, so don't bug me about when I'll be finished. I'll try to release a BETA when it comes to an acceptable stage, but it IS a BETA so it would not be totally finished.

If I can't find anyone to help me, then the project will still continue, but it'll just be slower and the artistic stuff might be lacking in some areas.

This will NOT be a fully-inclusive campaign, as the A-Team has withdrawn their stuff and some of the authors of stuff (such as the UH-1H) I won't be able to contact.

One last note: If anyone can think of a better name, please feel free to PM me or post in this topic. Operation Frequent Fire is sort of cheesy...

[jtin]

Post over from SimHQ:

I just found out that DRV doesn't cover Saigon (Ho Chi Minh City)! I don't think I can do it as originally intended (DRV and VietnamSEA), and I think I need to add a terrain creator to the list of needed people. That's something I have no idea how to do.

I'm also looking into the idea of an all-incusive mod, as the A-Team has contatcted me, saying with their permission I may be able to re-release the models. Does anyone know who created the UH-1H?

http://www.simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?...e=0#Post2130914

[Johan217]

Hi Jtin,

If you are looking for screen artwork, there is plenty in the downloads section. Kout has made a great Vietnam themed menu replacement here

WOV already includes a decent set of decals for many US squadrons that were active in Vietnam, I don't know if these are included in SFP1/WOE?

If you need any assictance with the ground war portion of the campaign, I'll be happy to help.

[jtin]

That looks like a good menu replacement set, but I was thinking of something with helicopters (most of the flyable squadrons fly helicopters).

I think SFP1 has the decals (obviously not for the A-6, F-8, or A-7s), but not as many. I don't know about WoE. I think I'll start with WoV, since if I want to make a SFP1 and WoE version, I would have to make another map. I'll look into it after I'm done with WoV.

What do you mean by assistance? I have a couple of questions about the ground part of the campaign.

As you probably already know, I'm planning to populate the map with not only targets, but stationary shooting ground targets to make the CAS missions more exciting. Does the frontline absolutley control what side it's on, or can I make it so that it will not change sides?

Are there Armed Recon missions in campaigns? I think I read somewhere there aren't.

How are strategic nodes used? Do they control the battle points or are there places that the game uses to make the frontline?

If you want to help make the campaign, sure! I'll need all the help I can get. Thanks for you assistance!

Basic campaign development stuff:

I think I'll include these aircraft:

A-1H
AH-1G
A-4E and F
A-6A
A-5B
A-7A and B
AH-34
B-52D
F-4B, D, E, and J
F-8E
F-14A
F-111D
O-1E
OH-6A
OV-10A
UH-1B
UH-1H
UH-34
SH-3A

MiG-17
MiG-21
An-2
Su-7
Su-9

Feel free to make suggestions for both aircraft and ground objects that would fit. I'm thinking of using some of the WW2 ground objects for S. Vietnam and N. Vietnam.

I'll need information on what carriers would've been deployed and what squadrons they had, and also what squadrons would have been relocated or based in Thailand, since in the campaign, all of Vietnam is the enemy.

Thanks for any information!

[Johan217]

jtin, on Feb 20 2007, 01:00 PM, said:

What do you mean by assistance? I have a couple of questions about the ground part of the campaign.

As you probably already know, I'm planning to populate the map with not only targets, but stationary shooting ground targets to make the CAS missions more exciting. Does the frontline absolutley control what side it's on, or can I make it so that it will not change sides?

Are there Armed Recon missions in campaigns? I think I read somewhere there aren't.

How are strategic nodes used? Do they control the battle points or are there places that the game uses to make the frontline?

If you want to help make the campaign, sure! I'll need all the help I can get. Thanks for you assistance!

This is exactly the stuff I can help you with :) When I was making the MiddleEastWar campaigns I got very deeply into scripting the ground war.

When you lay down the initial front line in your campaign (in terrain_movement.ini), you also have to define the alignment (friendly/enemy) of every ground target area (in terrain_targets.txt). As the frontine shifts, the alignment of targets will also change. You cannot control this yourself.

Sadly there are no armed recon missions in the campaigns.
CAS missions are functional, but not 100%: you will see the FAC aircraft, but it won't mark any targets. CAS missions are always directed against moving ground units (i.e. tanks, armoured vehicles). You will only get a CAS mission if there is a (friendly or enemy) ground offensive happening at the time.

This is where the strategic nodes come in. The strategic nodes are target areas that function as waypoints for groundunits during an offensive. E.g. If you want an offensive to start in A, capture B and end in C, you will need to define strategic nodes going from A to B and from B to C. Also, groundunits can only appear in targetareas that are defined as a strategic node. If you put a ground unit in Saigon but don't define Saigon as a strategic node, the ground unit will never show in the campaign. Finally, you can use strategic nodes to control the victory conditions for the campaign. To do this, you must declare the force's BaseArea (as defined in campaign_data.ini) as a strategic node. If this place is captured by the opposing force, the campaign ends in a victory for the opposing force.

I hope this clarifies it a bit.
If you need help with scripting or testing the ground war portion of your campaign, just let me know. I'm really looking forward to a Vietnam campaign with some proper ground action :)

By the way, don't forget to add the F-105! :)

This post has been edited by Johan217: 21 February 2007 - 06:38:21 AM

[jtin]

Yeah, this is the part that I'm sort of confused with, but your explanation cleared it up... sort of.

This is what I think happens so far.

The campaign starts with the ground units in their start positions, which have to be strategic nodes (?)

Based on the intel, they move torwards the enemy units which are positioned at the strategic nodes (?)

This is the front line moving.

If your mission is succesful in a CAS mission (which is triggered by destroying *I think* five tanks) and even if all the friendly tanks are destroyed, the offensive will be succesful.

If friendly forces capture the base area of the enemy, there is a win.

If enemy forces capture your base area, there is a lose.

If the missions exceed the max missions or max date, there is a stall.

I still have some questions.

You said start out at A, capture B, and end in C. Can there be 3 base areas? Would that be made by making a force 003 (if possible)?

Are strategic nodes randomly located and the names don't matter or are they targets in the terrain_targets.ini? Or are they cities in the citylist.ini?

If this is all true, there will have to be a LOT of strategic nodes to get the ground war on the level I was thinking of. :grin:

Thanks for your help and it certianly clarified a lot!

[Johan217]

jtin, on Feb 22 2007, 06:23 PM, said:

You said start out at A, capture B, and end in C. Can there be 3 base areas? Would that be made by making a force 003 (if possible)?

A, B, C in my example are strategic nodes, not baseareas.
You can declare as many forces as you like, but according to TK this will lead to problems with the campaign (issues with the front line etc). So it's best to stick to just two forces.

jtin, on Feb 22 2007, 06:23 PM, said:

Are strategic nodes randomly located and the names don't matter or are they targets in the terrain_targets.ini? Or are they cities in the citylist.ini?
If this is all true, there will have to be a LOT of strategic nodes to get the ground war on the level I was thinking of. :grin:

Strategic nodes are indeed TargetAreas in the terrain_targets.ini.

An example:

[StrategicNode024]
Area=Jerusalem
ConnectTo[001].Target=Netanya Harbour
ConnectTo[001].BasePoint=578870,617030
ConnectTo[002].Target=Tel Aviv "Ben Gurion"
ConnectTo[002].BasePoint=582500,610900

This is the strategic node for Jerusalem. It connects the TargetArea Jerusalem to two other TargetAreas: Netanya Harbour and Tel Aviv "Ben Gurion". These must be the exact names found in terrain_targets.ini. The BasePoint= must be followed by the exact coordinates of that TargetArea in terrain_targets.ini.

And as you can see from this example, you can easily have 24 or more strategic nodes :)

[jtin]

That clears up a lot more. Thanks.

I still have a couple questions. Sorry :blink:. In the strategic node block, what does the ConnectTo mean? Does that mean in order to capture the whole area, the units have to go to the first place, then the second? Does there have to be two, or can there be less or more?

I'll add the F-105D, F, and G.

I'm going to send out a call for help for the modders. Can anyone build a road model? Sort of like the train tracks? It can use the Road1.tga in the terrain.cat. I know it can be done through tiles on the map, but I'm not that good with the TE and the object roads can be targeted and they would show on KMD. It can just be a straight piece, say 6 feet long and 5 feet wide? I want to test the feasability of my idea :biggrin:. Thank you so much!

[Johan217]

jtin, on Feb 23 2007, 06:29 PM, said:

I still have a couple questions. Sorry :blink:. In the strategic node block, what does the ConnectTo mean? Does that mean in order to capture the whole area, the units have to go to the first place, then the second? Does there have to be two, or can there be less or more?

You have to think of the StrategicNodes as waypoints. They start in one TargetArea and lead to one or more other TargetAreas.
In this example, the Strategic node starts in Jerusalem and leads to Netanya Harbour and to Tel Aviv "Ben Gurion". Now, a groundunit that sits in Jerusalem can go either way: to Netanya Harbour or to Tel Aviv "Ben Gurion". There always must be at least one ConnectTo target, the maximum is 5 I think.

[StrategicNode024]
Area=Jerusalem
ConnectTo[001].Target=Netanya Harbour
ConnectTo[001].BasePoint=578870,617030
ConnectTo[002].Target=Tel Aviv "Ben Gurion"
ConnectTo[002].BasePoint=582500,610900

jtin, on Feb 23 2007, 06:29 PM, said:

I'll add the F-105D, F, and G.

The F-105D was withdrawn from Vietnam in late 1970. After that, only the F and G Wild Weasel versions were used in the theatre.

[Lexx_Luthor]

Just a PluGG for getting Wings Over Vietnam.

Example -- chopped A-7 cockpit used inside Pasko's and Team's stunningly 3D B-58 external model crew compartment...




GET TEH WOV -- The ThirdWire NAVY cockpits may never again become available.

[jtin]

Lexx_Luthor:
Sort of hijacking the thread, but I have to ask the question.
How do you do it? :biggrin:

Johan217:
So are you saying that the ground units can go to one "waypoint", but not the other and still capture the strategic node? Or does the fact that they're (using your example) sitting in Jerusalem mean that they have already captured it?

I'll take out the F-105D. My mistake :blush:. After poking through some information, I found the A-10 entered service in 1975. I think I'll make an A-10 squadron appear somewhere :biggrin:.

Now moving deeper into development, I'm thinking of including (at least at the fire bases) some parked helos. I know there's one in the factory place, but it doesn't have a skin? What's the maximum amount of polys a ground object can have? How can you know without the max file or a copy of max? The above mentioned road object would be very nice too. Thanks!

[Lexx_Luthor]

jtin::

Quote

Lexx_Luthor:
Sort of hijacking the thread, but I have to ask the question.
How do you do it? :biggrin:

I'll probably poast a thread at ThirdWire Modder's Corner about what to do to chop the cockpits. Your poast here did remind me to backup my new findings about this. That was the one thing I have not done yet, and a "USAFMTL-esque" style hard drive crash (a crash with no backup) would have set me back to having nothing. :biggrin: Thanks for making me think. It took quite a bit of work with a hex editor to get the results I desired, and I wouldn't want to do it again.