Whats worst?

[+TexMurphy]

Ok so Im making some generic PflazD3 skins for different Jastas...

 

Ive got a choise and that is to use decals for crosses or to paint them.

 

If I use decals then the cross will be true to its time but not necessarily to the paint job.

 

If I paint them then the skin wount necessarily be true to its time.

 

If I have the black Jasta 7 skin (which should have a iron cross) then its wrong in a 1917 campaing. On the other hand a Jasta 21 skin with a Maltese cross is wrong in 1918.

 

Im tempted to go for the decals and have the crosses true to their time. Generic skins arnt ever gonna be right anyways.

 

Whats your take on it?

Tex

[Barkhorn1x]

I agree w/ going w/ the decals as it's one less thing to worry about and as you said; w/ a one skin per unit limit you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. So, better to have the crosses uniform rather than have the skins strictly accurate IMO.

 

Thinking out loud in this area, what we need for accurate markings are the following:

- multiple skin option based on a date range

- GAS decals that feature that "interim cross" - March-May of 1918 *** - which was the Maltese cross "squared off"

 

***That's not there already is it?

Edited November 7, 2007 by Barkhorn1x

[+whiteknight06604]

Ok so Im making some generic PflazD3 skins for different Jastas...

 

Ive got a choise and that is to use decals for crosses or to paint them.

 

If I use decals then the cross will be true to its time but not necessarily to the paint job.

 

If I paint them then the skin wount necessarily be true to its time.

 

If I have the black Jasta 7 skin (which should have a iron cross) then its wrong in a 1917 campaing. On the other hand a Jasta 21 skin with a Maltese cross is wrong in 1918.

 

Im tempted to go for the decals and have the crosses true to their time. Generic skins arnt ever gonna be right anyways.

 

Whats your take on it?

Tex

 

Maybe you could make the decals that are right for each time,include them in the respective skin folder and make 2 decal.inis that can be changed depending on when you plan to fly?Not perfect but MIGHT work.

[+p10ppy]

I tend to paint "most" of my marking on the skin

you can make the skin much nicer imho

better blending weathering and placement...

Once you have a layered image file set up its not to much work to change the markings and make a new set of skins

 

that said, for the generics i would/should use decals for the smaller bits (serialnumbers etc)

 

How are you guys changing decals by date?

(or skins for that matter)

didn't know you can do that

 

campaign file ?

[Barkhorn1x]

How are you guys changing decals by date?

(or skins for that matter)

didn't know you can do that

 

campaign file ?

 

Don't think you can as I believe it is hard coded into the EXE.

 

As far as I can tell the Decal.INI only defines position and "type" of decal to access. The specific decal accessed is obviously based on a combination of Country, a/c type. skin choice and date in the case of the German Alb. D3/D5/D5a. The Dr1 seems to default to the Maltese cross despite the date.

 

If Tex uses the decal file for, say, the DVa on his Pfalz D3 default skins he will probably get the same results. I don't know how hot the positioning will look tho'.

Edited November 8, 2007 by Barkhorn1x

[+p10ppy]

id be a little surprised if is hardcoded (not much seems to be)

theres this in the nations.ini

 

AlternateDecal=GERMANY_OLD

 

don't know what it means tho

 

the GERMANY_OLD must point to one of insignia0XX.tga i guess

 

there may be another ini or lst file somewhere like the squadronlist.ini for national insignias

 

Edit:

was staring me in the face

 

from the nations.ini

 

[Nation004]

Name=GERMANY

--------Snip-------

ActiveDate=03/20/1918

AlternateDecal=GERMANY_OLD

 

--------Snip-------

 

[Nation019]

Name=GERMANY_OLD

--------End-------

 

so that means that...

 

Nation004 = insignia004.tga

Nation019 = insignia019.tga

 

hope that helps

Edited November 8, 2007 by p10ppy

[+TexMurphy]

Well its simple I just use the FilenameFormat and it chooses which of the two insignias to use. That wasnt the question.

 

Question was should I do it like the screens below, (note work in process, placement of decals is not right yet)

 

 

 

The second one does look wrong because we are all so used to seeing the first combination. On the other hand at least I have not seen any late Jasta21 paint jobs at all so I dont know if they even had Pfalzes past the cross change date. But if they had then they could have just changed the crosses on their planes and not necessarily the entire paint job.

 

Tex

[+peter01]

Nice skin, very distinctive. I like the look of the earlier crosses.

Edited November 8, 2007 by peter01

[raven-1]

since its generic i perfer the old style,it looks alot better.looking forward to these tex!

[Barkhorn1x]

id be a little surprised if is hardcoded (not much seems to be)

theres this in the nations.ini

 

hope that helps

 

Woohoo good work. I now realize that I am not familiar w/ all of these blast INI files!!

[Barkhorn1x]

The second one does look wrong because we are all so used to seeing the first combination.

Tex

 

Historically;

- a pre-03/18 build Pfalz DIII would have had its Maltese crosses "squared off" to comply w/ the new regs - post 3/18 of course.

- a factory fresh post-03/18 build Pfalz DIII would have the Balkan cross.

 

So... the second one does not look odd - if we assume it was built post 03/18.

Edited November 8, 2007 by Barkhorn1x

[+sinbad]

Tex-

 

Did you resolve the template question?

 

I'd like to have a go at PDIII skins as well.

 

I've been away from FE for a long time due to RL health matters so I am not fully up to speed.

 

I did some skins a long while ago and recall that there is a way to tie specific decals to a given skin. I'll try reconstruct how I did that, but I think it is relatively simple. A named mod or addition tot the decal set and a conforming mod to the decal ini.

Edited November 8, 2007 by sinbad

[+TexMurphy]

Yes and no.

 

I didnt get a template. I will make a template. Untill then when just trying stuff out to see how I will make the generic skins Im using a lame quick and dirty template.

 

The lame quick and dirty is from making the black Jasta7 white. This works a little bit but not as well as having a template with good planelines in separate layers.

 

I will post a template when I have it done. If you want to make one and beat me to it then Id love to use yours.. ;)

 

Tex

[+peter01]

I didnt get a template. I will make a template.

Tex

 

A template for the Pfalz would be great if possible. This plane had some interesting colours...might then even be inclined to have a go myself at a paint job.

[+sinbad]

[quoteIf you want to make one and beat me to it then Id love to use yours.. ;)

 

Tex

 

 

I have no idea how to build a template. I'm still learning how to use one!

[+TexMurphy]

no worries.. Ill post mine when its done..

[+sinbad]

Thanks. Meanwhile, to deal with the national insignia question. I believe you can insert a specific TGA file in each skin set. That TGA file can be numbered any way you wish. Usual is INSIGNIA005, INSIGNIA006 etc. but it matters not. The point is you can either copy one from the insignia set or make your own with the correct national insignia for each skin. As in any other mod the TK generic will simply not be referenced for that skin as the local image takes priority. I do not believe this has any effect on other skins even if they appear in the same flight and mission. Of course you can use a number 705, 706. You then make a decal ini [named "Decals" to specify the code number, size and location. The skins for Borts aircraft such as the Halb DII are good examples.

 

If I am correct (and I often manage not to be) there may be no need to choose between 1916-1917 Maltese crosses and the straight line crosses in 1918.

[Barkhorn1x]

If I am correct (and I often manage not to be) there may be no need to choose between 1916-1917 Maltese crosses and the straight line crosses in 1918.

 

Taking your reasoning a step farther - an enterprising skinner*** - could also make those "interim" crosses used in March/April - made by repainting the Maltese crosses by squaring them off.

 

**hats off to them as I tried once - pathetic results.

[+sinbad]

Yes, it is true that editing TGA files is a bit tricky, in this case however we already have the 16-17 Maltese crosses as well as the straight line 1918 style. It is simple to recode with whatever label to get the correct result -- or so it seems to moi.