Wolfram Von Richtoffen

[UK_Widowmaker 571]

I never realised it was Manfred's Cousin, Wolfram..whom Manfred was flying to rescue on that Fateful day that he caught a packet!

What a Bummer!...talk about 'Keeping it in the Family!'

[Slartibartfast 153]

Good point but for family some of the rules do get thrown out the window I suppose...

[OvS 8]

I never realised it was Manfred's Cousin, Wolfram..whom Manfred was flying to rescue on that Fateful day that he caught a packet!

What a Bummer!...talk about 'Keeping it in the Family!'

 

 

Yes, his little cousin. Shame. Wolfie was not nearly the pilot that Lothar or Manny was, but still, he was a Richthofen none-the-less and shared the family desire to fly.

 

Unless the books have changed, there really wasn't too much information about him for WWI, other than he was MvR's 4th Cousin, came into the war in early 1918, served with Jasta 11, and had anywhere from 3 - 8 kills.

 

He continued into WWII as a Field Marshall for the Luftwaffe, and died at the end of 1944 from complications dervived from a possible Brain tumor.

 

OvS

Edited November 16, 2009 by OvS

[Slartibartfast 153]

Thats information that I didn't realise all I knew was that Lothar died at the wheel of an airliner that suffered engine failure in the 1920's...

[UK_Widowmaker 571]

Yes, sadly I cant find any info on his Aircraft Insignia..would be nice to have him in the fold

[OvS 8]

Thats information that I didn't realise all I knew was that Lothar died at the wheel of an airliner that suffered engine failure in the 1920's...

 

Lothar was flying an LVG C.IV at the time. It was converted to carry passengers on short hauls. It's engine failed on take-off, the most critical time, stalled and he died... as well as a famous German movie Director. An actress was on board as well, but she lived.

 

Imagine what the Luftwaffe would have looked like if Lothar lived...

 

OvS

[JFM 18]

I say that about Manfred, too. The outcome of WWII wouldn't have been different, but (IM speculative O) likely the toll would have been much higher with MvR at the helm than HG.

[Olham 164]

Then let's all be glad it came as it came. It was all bad enough.

[UK_Widowmaker 571]

Then let's all be glad it came as it came. It was all bad enough.

 

Amen to that!

[Olham 164]

A last addition: the name was "von Richthofen" - for the cousin too.

[DerMo 0]

I never realised it was Manfred's Cousin, Wolfram..whom Manfred was flying to rescue on that Fateful day that he caught a packet!

What a Bummer!...talk about 'Keeping it in the Family!'

 

 

Oh please.....u have to keep in mind that on that certain day Wolfram had the order to stay away from trouble in case they would encounter enemy aircraft.Manfred always instructed his Newbies that way (and it always proved to be the right choice..)and Wolfram has just been transfered into Jasta11..Otherwise he would be easy prey for the enemy on that day..

Imagine you are new in jasta11,almost new to aviation,U are a newbie flying with the best,u got order to stay out of trouble but at the same time strugglin with your Fokker Dr1,trying to follow the Red Baron while avoiding getting caught at all costs in a big furball against the RAF,trying to stay alive and trying to have your eyes everywhere.....WhaT WOULD U DO??

I think this discussion is just not fair...

Edited November 16, 2009 by DerMo

[OvS 8]

Then let's all be glad it came as it came. It was all bad enough.

 

 

Olham, although the use of many of the weapons and tactics the Germans used in WWII were not for the benefit of the world at that time... but to this day, the world has the German scientists to thank for many of the things we take for granted every day.

 

Without them, NASA would not have made it off the ground, let alone into space. Without the Germans, we would have been flying props well into the 60's, pushing the Jet Age back to the 70's.... yes I am aware of the British Gloster Metor... but the engine design was not axial, and certainly was no match for the He 162, Ho229 and Me262.

 

Germans rock and so do you!!

 

OvS

[Olham 164]

Thanks, OvS.

[UK_Widowmaker 571]

Oh please.....u have to keep in mind that on that certain day Wolfram had the order to stay away from trouble in case they would encounter enemy aircraft.Manfred always instructed his Newbies that way (and it always proved to be the right choice..)and Wolfram has just been transfered into Jasta11..Otherwise he would be easy prey for the enemy on that day..

Imagine you are new in jasta11,almost new to aviation,U are a newbie flying with the best,u got order to stay out of trouble but at the same time strugglin with your Fokker Dr1,trying to follow the Red Baron while avoiding getting caught at all costs in a big furball against the RAF,trying to stay alive and trying to have your eyes everywhere.....WhaT WOULD U DO??

I think this discussion is just not fair...

 

Erm..I wasn't having a pop at either of them, perhaps you have mis-read what I wrote?..I was just stating a fact

[OvS 8]

Erm..I wasn't having a pop at either of them, perhaps you have mis-read what I wrote?..I was just stating a fact

 

I read what you wrote and understood it as you wrote it. You're 100% correct. The Germans, although they schooled their pilots as well, also believed in developing their pilots, as was MvR's rule.

 

Which meant the lesser experienced pilot stayed clear of the fight for a few sorties to see how it was done by the aces. Once more comfortable, they engaged. Now I know this was also practiced by other countries, but seeing the Germans had a lesser crop to pick from, they had to value each pilot a lot higher.

 

So OJT was a very useful tool when you had aces like Berthold, MvR, EvS, Gotthard, Lowenhardt, Kissenberth, etc... leading your Jastas and teaching your men. Notice I omitted Fat Bastard (Göring)... I really hate him.

 

OvS

[DerMo 0]

Oh,sorry Widowmaker,my school english is just too bad.What i read was´Wolfram failed to rescue Manfred on that fateful day,what a bummer(Niete?)´

Guess i have to go back to lesson. Really Sorry again.Greetings

 

 

[UK_Widowmaker 571]

No Problem at all DerMo.

 

As I have said many times, I have great respect that German's take the time to learn English..when us Brits are too Lazy to learn German

[Olham 164]

Sometimes lazyness can produce the easy good things.

So you lazy bums created a language with only few sillabels words.

Also you just use "the" instead of "der, die or das".

That makes English really easy to learn and a world language IMHO.

 

Ringo Starr was a lazy drummer, as he said about himself. Only played the really

necessary beats and bashes. And isn't it great? I love his drumming.

[OvS 8]

Sometimes lazyness can produce the easy good things.

So you lazy bums created a language with only few sillabels words.

Also you just use "the" instead of "der, die or das".

That makes English really easy to learn and a world language IMHO.

 

Ringo Starr was a lazy drummer, as he said about himself. Only played the really

necessary beats and bashes. And isn't it great? I love his drumming.

 

 

Really? You think learning English is easier than others? Ive had people tell me it's harder based on exactly what you said... and also, we tend to say things in the wrong order in a sentence when it's converted... plus we have words that sound the same, spelled different but have tons of meanings... or worse, spelled the same and have tons of different meanings.

 

OvS

[themightysrc 5]

To be honest, OVS, I know or have known dozens of non-native speakers of English, and invariably they say or said that English is quite easy to learn as it's not inflected and the gender element is more or less absent, whilst the number of cases is minimal compared to many other languages (think Latin for an extreme example!).

 

It's probably a reason (aside from a wee thing like the British Empire making it the language of government for about 1/3 of the world's population) why it's quite as popular as it is. Chuck in the global role of America and its influence, plus the mutabillity of the language (le weekend, anyone?) and you quickly understand why it's more or less universal as a language.

 

Now if you want a difficult language to learn, try Greek: that's a complete bastard to read, write and speak, although it's immensely satisfying once you get the hang of it.

Edited November 17, 2009 by themightysrc

[Stiffy 1]

A last addition: the name was "von Richthofen" - for the cousin too.

 

 

Thats right, they both held the title of Freiherr (litterally Freeman/freelord). I've met quite a few people in England under the misconception that Freiherr was manfreds middle name lol

[Olham 164]

OvS, English is nothing complicated compared to German.

A friend of mine is American, and now speaks German very well.

But what should I answer him on his questions about gender?

 

Where English only has "the", we have "der" (male), "die" (female), and "das" (things).

Now he says: why is it "der Mond" (the moon), die Sonne (the sun), and "das Kind" (the child) ?

Are children things? Why is the moon male, but not the sun?

Or "der Tisch" (the table), but "das Sofa" (the sofa)?

What should I answer him?

[UK_Widowmaker 571]

OvS, English is nothing complicated compared to German.

A friend of mine is American, and now speaks German very well.

But what should I answer him on his questions about gender?

 

Where English only has "the", we have "der" (male), "die" (female), and "das" (things).

Now he says: why is it "der Mond" (the moon), die Sonne (the sun), and "das Kind" (the child) ?

Are children things? Why is the moon male, but not the sun?

Or "der Tisch" (the table), but "das Sofa" (the sofa)?

What should I answer him?

 

Good job Mr H got his ass kicked then

[Olham 164]

Mr H ? (Didn't get this one) ? Do you mean A. H. ? (But he was an Austrian).

Edited November 18, 2009 by Olham

[IV/JG1_Kaiser 0]

Herr Oldham,

 

if I remember my school German correctly; der die das become den der das if nominative. So a natural Krumpet, when learning German finds things that little bit more confusing because nominative and dative cases don't really have any impact on "the" in English.

 

With reference to the world being poorer for the loss of Der Rittmeister, I guess the same could be observed for a generation from all nations post WW1.

 

I am Australian, and I find myself wondering what shape my then young nation might have taken if the best,brightest and most honourable of that (WW1) generation had not have been butchered.

 

I am of the opinion that armed conflict is an abomination on humanity, but until such time as we can get politicians to fight the wars instead of our strongest and best, we are condemned to repeat our collected histories.

 

Please God no more Austrian Corporals!!

Edited November 18, 2009 by IV/JG1_Kaiser