Impressions of Logitech G940 Force Effects

[GregSM 0]

Hi All,

 

 

Here are my impressions of the Logitech G940, mostly with respect to shortfalls in force-feedback:

 

1. Excessive delay in the application of control surface force. That is, any degree of aileron or elevator deflection is accomplished without any force resistance whatsoever. Forces engage only after a second or so of the deflection being complete. The faster the deflection, the greater the distraction. Thump. Moreover, when deflections are rapidly and repeatedly reversed, it's possible for the forces to become seemingly confused, or incoherent, pulling suddenly this way or that, presumably in frantic effort to transmit the backlog of input data. Thump, thump-thump...... thump (huh?). Elevator force is the same.

 

2. Excessive force-feedback dead-zone. In and of itself, this isn't especially troublesome (at least to me), but together with the lag and the suddenness in the onset of force, the stick cannot be slightly deflected around the centre without forces, again, snapping suddenly and sometimes incoherently in and out. So, again, thump, thump-thump...... thump. This I find certainly troublesome.

 

3. Airspeed sufficient to negate aileron effectiveness cancels rather than maximizes force; when you would expect the stick to become locked due to extreme airspeed, it instead goes suddenly limp.

 

4. Want of discernible force accumulation or dampening. Due largely, I suspect, to the lag in transmission of control surface forces, the force effects neither build nor diminish with any subtly. Rather, they are effectively either fully on or fully off. (And this is precisely true of the stick-shake force applied when nearing stall speeds.)

 

5. Under certain conditions, the stick appears to be too limited in simultaneously transmitting discrete forces. For instance, with spring centering engaged (there being no actual spring, the force motors are hereby additionally tasked), the gun-shake force is cancelled when the stick is deflected fully to any of the four corners.

 

As such, I find the G940's force-feedback effects to be generally incoherent and distracting, and I've concluded that disabling them altogether is the lone viable option.

 

Despite this, the build quality of each of the three units appear initially to be excellent, about equal to CH stuff. The stick's X and Y axes are very, very accurate. The buttons, hats, switches and rotaries of both the stick and throttle are all well-positioned, respond positively and generally feel like quality. The rudders, too, respond positively and are very accurate, as well as smooth. The profiling software is intuitive and feature rich.

 

Ultimately, I prefer the G940 above the equivalent Saitek and CH offerings I've used in the past. But the force feedback is a considerable disappointment which I can't imagine being reversed by driver updates alone, particularly in context with an older engine like CFS III.

 

I hope this is useful to someone.

 

 

Cheers,

 

 

Greg S

Edited December 18, 2009 by GregSM

[markl 1]

Thanks for the review.

Have you had any over heating problems? There have been reports that some of the sticks are haveing problems getting too hot and potentially burning out.

 

Cheers MarkL

[appraiserfl 0]

I love my G940 it is freaking awesome, so much better than my old CH fighterstick setup. With that said, are you basing your review solely off of Over Flanders Fields? Because I can tell you the FFF implementation with OFF is pretty weak, however, it absolutely amazing with IL2-1946!

 

Even though it is lacking with OFF, it still brings me in for greater immersion due to the excellent gun shaking effects and the stall warning effects. But is the G940 realistic with OFF? Not really, but that is not the G940s fault it is OFFs ancient CFS3 base that is the culprit.

 

Anyway, what are you looking for? With how indepth your descriptions are I would say it looks like you were expecting a military grade application, which are available is you wanna spend fifty thousand dollars versus the $300 for this excellent HOTAS setup.

[GregSM 0]

Uncleal:

 

Good advice, thanks. Unfortunately, using DX button assignments exclusively doesn't alleviate any of the anomalies I've described above.

 

Marcl,

 

I've read too of over-heating issues, and so I have watched for it. So far, I've not experienced trouble. Mind, I've yet to fly any marathon sessions, but have left the gear plugged in for hours on end without any degree of heat buildup.

 

Appraiserfl,

 

Perhaps I could have been more clear: yes, I refer only to OFF. (I agree that G940 forces are much better in IL2.)

 

Not being any kind of pilot, I can hardly expect military-grade performance – wouldn't know it. I do expect MS FFB II-grade performance, at least. This, I do know, but I'm unsure if I have got it with the G940.

 

And for me, as presumably for others, the Logitech set is closer to $ 500.

 

 

Cheers,

 

 

Greg S

[appraiserfl 0]

Well in further testament to the g940 setup, go on ebay and look for em... there are none used for sale! But thar be a plenty of CH products on there.

[GregSM 0]

Hi All,

 

 

I posted the same message on the Logitech forums. It received the following response from a G940 team member:

 

“Thanks for the specific feedback on OFF. Our developer relations team will be in touch with the developer shortly. Many of these things can be sorted out, as they are specific to the game's force programming.

 

Mark Starrett

Global Product Marketing Manager

Logitech”

 

I don't know to what degree, if at all, OBD can access this area of code but it would be great if it were possible to improve the force implementation.

 

 

Note to Marcl,

 

 

I've now used the G940 for several marathon sessions without any heat trouble. The joystick base warms only very slightly. It's barely noticeable. Perhaps those reporting severe heating have gotten dodgy units.

 

 

Cheers,

 

 

Greg S

[appraiserfl 0]

Thanks for your work there Greg! That would be awesome if they improved implementation!!!

[Winston DoRight 3]

I'm interested in getting one of these G940 systems and was wondering what additional axis are available other than <left-right> <up-down> <throttle> <rudder>. I see some wheels on the throttle, are these analog axis or digital programmable?

[GregSM 0]

Appraiserfl,

 

 

Yeah, I really hope so too. But, actually, it won't kill me if this isn't doable. I'm beginning to agree with you that the force effects, while a lot less than perfect, are still an enhancement to the this sim. Perhaps I just needed a little more time to acclimatize. And I've never regretted buying this setup because I really do think it's quality stuff even without the force-feedback.

 

 

Winston DoRight,

 

 

There are five axes controlled by rotaries, three on the base of the stick and two more on the throttle handles. Additionally, one of the stick's hat switches acts like a self-centering mouse, rather than a conventional four-way or eight-way switch (sorry, I don't know the correct terminology). This is useful, for example, for view panning. And, of course, the throttle is split into two further independent axes.

 

All axes – even the stick's X and Y and the rudders' toe brakes - can be either analogue or digital. In the latter case there's facility to program “bands” of varied width throughout the period of travel. (I hope that makes sense!) A simple example would be to program two bands onto a rotary, one which fires the “g” key (lower landing gear) when the rotary is spun downwards, and the other to fire CTRL+g (raise landing gear) when the rotary is spun upwards. So, to raise or lower the landing gear, you would just need to push the rotary in the appropriate direction somewhere beyond its centre position. (Deadzones are adjustable.)

 

So there's plenty of sliders and rotaries to control fuel mixture, flaps, propeller pitch - or whatever you like.

 

 

Cheers,

 

 

Greg S

Edited December 22, 2009 by GregSM

[Winston DoRight 3]

Thanks Greg. That's exactly what I needed to know.

[GregSM 0]

Regretfully, I feel obliged to offer this nasty little addendum to my review:

 

After using the G940 for a few months, several of the pots have begun spiking such to render both toe brakes, rudders, and one of the throttles essentially useless.

 

Poor show, Logitech. But, oh well, there's still CH Products.

 

 

Cheers,

 

 

Greg