MAKO69

What about the Greek Airforce, it seems to work for them a combination of new and pre-owned combat strike fighters to include the F-16,and these 2 which they started to receive back in the mid 70's F-4E, and A-7 not all these planes were new build for them. Turkey had new build F-4 and received ex-USAF and German Phantoms in the late 80s and early 90s with a large percentage still flying today with a good amount of F-4E 2020 Terminators which they predict will be flying at least to 2020 and beyond. Then there is the United States 1 example the A-10. The purpouse of this thread was to propose to the NZ Govt a costly way to get back into the strike fighter cockpit. Look back at my first entry. Now you can propose buying new It would be great, but it would be less expensive to get in and running with both new and used and swap out the older ones for newer right? The Buick was assembled in Delta Township, Michigan

Well no there not supposed to get shot at/blown up in combat according to popular beliefs. Soldiers join now as apposed to past wars, maybe they don't deserve medals or recognition for their volunteerism. I think not! A soldier is a soldier wheather they are at 5000 ft dropping bombs, 5 ft in the mud in a fortified fighting position or 500 miles away from the front in an A/C'd office pushing paperwork so the logistics can make it to those two soldiers on the line fighting. People who join now have more input in what they want their military careers to be than decades past. Some jobs in the military are a little more dangerous than others. Should the NCO office worker get a purple heart for a stapple through the finger during a time of war then? Like I said before I take nothing from this NCO that did her job and did it well, but look at the situation my problem is still with the people that got this pushed through.

As I said in an earlier entry, "the RNZAF could up the initial unit number by leasing 2nd hand F-16s in the begining to get the combat wing up and running, then swap out the lend/leased older falcons while the newer ones are being built/delivered." Thats what I was saying. The Italian Airforce did this while waiting for the Tyhpoon. You can't compare apples to oranges a car is nothing like an aircraft let alone a combat aircraft, don't go there because the US air arm as well as many others have proved many types/airframes remain viable for decades, even after the plane should have been retired. They have made the unlogical, logical. P.S. My main ride is an 02 Toyota PU that I purchased in late 01. As of right now I plan on getting 8-10 more years out of it. (I would feel comfortable buying my truck now used as my mechanic offers to buy it every time I'm in for an oil change). My other car is an American made 00. My wife has a 2012 Buick. (We shopped all makes for comparable vehicles. The US made Buick was the best option and it felt great buying American) More Americans buying used cars Avg age of american car 10.8 yrs

Jug I appreciate our vets, many thanks to our past, present, and future Veterans, I myself am prior service. I believe she did a great job as I stated before "Don't get me wrong, but what she did sounds like logistical nightmare. Someone had to do it though. A commendation medal, but a Bronze Star?" thats just stretching it a little. There are plenty other awards or commendations that could have been bestowed upon this NCO, hats off to her, great job. Its not this NCO I'm questioning, but upper echelon. Maybe they should have thought this one out better when there are soldiers in combat still dying, just as heroic? soldiers denied medals

They looked mean just parked on the tarmac. Looks good.

I think that the F-16 is a great option, however I am looking at it from the cost saving in the long run. 2-3 squads of F-16 C/D would be great true the support and spare parts are there. The initial cost of the TA/F-50 is very similar (Factory tech support only 1/4 a world away as to 1/2 a world away), but long term costs would most definitely be less expensive than the full size Falcon. I would suggest a proposal of 12 F-16C 4 F-16D for 75 Squadron a mix of new and lower timed pre-owned airframes. 10 F-50 4 T/A-50 for 2 squadron. 8 T/A-50 for 14 squadron.

Another Team Chinook operation

Right on dtmdragon Here are some of my thoughts streakeagle, The world is a crazy place and its only getting worse. There are evil people on this "MUD BALL" that want to hurt/destroy, for lack of a better term our "Western" way of life, which gives the US, UK, AU, NZ, and all other similar nations the right to choose what we see fit for ourselves and famlies. For a sovereign nation to rely in part or whole on another country for defense is ludacris and the NZ govt. should be ashamed of the spot they placed NZ in during these turbulent times. NZ's allies are under attack from terrorists it's only a matter of when, not if. It's paramount that a nation (NZ) have a defense force that is capable of a defensive 1st strike to protect it's intrests, resources, and most of all it's people/next generation. Typical politiciains close a blind eye cross their fingers and hope the sh!t does'nt hit the fan on their watch. Its not the big country (China would never do such a thing) threat NZ should not worry about it's the rouge terror threat. NZ is very isolated, I'm sure if somthing was to happen to them the UK and the rest of her colonies would come to help, however not until a lot of damage has been done. The United States are spread way to thin w/the USAF in the process of cost cutting it's force by 1/4 to 1/3. The US forces will come, but it might take longer than what the Kiwi's want to wait.

The TA/FA-50 is not subsonic, the TA-50 is a trainer/light strike, while the F-50 is a fully capable strike fighter platform. You can see the F-16s heritage in these planes.

Good proposal. Do you think the RNZAF could up the initial unit number by leasing 2nd hand F-16s in the begining to get the combat wing up and running, then swap out the lend/leased older falcons while the newer ones are being built/delivered. Why not supplement the F-16 Falcons with a trainer that has a strike/defensive capability like the hawk Mk 127 or the TA/FA-50?

You can never get enough 104 skins one of my childhood favs. "Hey Ridley!" "Yeah" "you got any Beemans?" "I might have me a stick" "Well loan me some, I'll pay you back later" "Fair enough" "I think I see a plane over her with my name on it" 'Now your talkin"

The Black Eagles demo team vid I posted. I think a squadron of F-16 and two or three T/FA-50 would be the perfect combination.

Don't get me wrong, but what she did sounds like logistical nightmare. Someone had to do it though. A commendation Medal but a Bronze Star. Here are the criteria for both. The Commendation Medal is a mid-level United States military decoration which is presented for sustained acts of heroism or meritorious service. For valorous actions in direct contact with an enemy force, but of a lesser degree than required for the award of the Bronze Star The Bronze Star Medal is a United States Armed Forces individual military decoration that may be awarded for bravery, acts of merit, or meritorious service. As a medal it is awarded for merit, and with the "V" for valor device it is awarded for heroism. Even under these criteria a stretch for both.

Those skyhawks have been out in the elements for a decade now and NZ Airforce officilas have already stated that those planes are unsalvagable.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JVcKDAS4WY&feature=related

Is it me or does that yoke look beat up.

Lower timed Legacy Hornets would be nice, but the F-16 option would be most cost effective and to maintain. A combination of Falcons and T,F/A-50s would be nice too.

Article

daddyairplanes, At $66.9 million US per plane thats over 800 millin US (981595200NZD) I'm afraid this option as it my be a great platform It's just to costly and the politicians will not like this plan. dtmdragon, I like what your saying The F-16C/D option looks good, however how many units would you propose. What about pre-owned strike fighters, a lot of fighters coming on the market now. Is there a trainer platform that can do both jobs? The RAAF has the Bae Hawk Mk 127 which is used for lead in training for the Hornet, but has a defense and strike capability.

A nice plane at 40 to 60 million US (48 to 72 NZD) per unit cost, can we afford it? Does it have to be a new plane. We would like to get more than 1.

That was legit I am sure that was done more than once.

C-5s would have been the way to go.

OMG this is so 70s who on CA hasn't seen this? It was cool, and you wonder if it may have been employed ever or was it just a cold war propaganda gimmick.