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bortdafarm

AI MOD version 3 beta..

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AN AI MOD FOR FIRST EAGLES...

SINGLE PLAYER ONLY..

 

PLACE ALL THE FILES (OTHER THAN THIS READ ME)

 

INTO THE OBJECTS FOLDER..

 

 

thoughts...

 

reduces slightly the effectiveness of the flak..

increases the fluidity and variety of the AI tactics and maneverability

and tends to result in a higher survival and much higher kill ratio for your squadron mates...

AI versus AI combat becomes more satisfying to observe with greater effort on the part of the AI

to stay one step ahead..(with occasional exceptions)

all aircraft are slightly less likely to explode..and can take fractional more damage before a "kill"

intended to give slightly better over-all gameplay during a campaign..

 

Bortdafarm

 

version 3

 

-------------------------------

 

 

this is by far the best result so far regarding AI pilot survival AND a much increased AI kill rate / fire accuracy etc...

 

hope this is not an inappropiate use of the forum but as long as that's ok with the mods (pm me if it's not and i'll edit the post)

 

cheers all just thought i'd share the fun

 

and to compliment the above mod

 

CAMPAIGN AI PILOT SKILL AND EXPERIENCE MOD FOR FIRST EAGLES..

 

THIS WILL GIVE ALL AI PILOTS OF ALL FIGHTER SQUADRONS (INCLUDING THE PLAYERS AI SQUADRON MATES)

FAR HIGHER SKILL AND EXPERIENCE RATINGS (VIEW THEM ON THE CAMPAIGN ROSTER SCREEN)

THIS BUMPS UP THEIR ABILITIES TO MAKE THEM MORE USEFULL ALLIES AND OPPONENTS..

 

install to the flight folder

 

bortdafarm

AIMODv3.zip

FEexpermodv1.zip

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Thanks for the AI "tweeks", will be re-installing 1st Eagles this coming week-end

with all the new mods and give it a test run. :good:

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Yeah, Thanks for your efforts Bortdafarm, your mods are pushing the sim to new levels of realism, well done mate!

 

Couple of things though...I noticed, in order to make enemy planes harder to shoot down, you've set their armour levels to 'STEEL'. It now seems inordinately hard to bring the blighters down!

 

Is there some middle ground between 'WOOD' and 'STEEL', maybe by reducing the 'thickness' to a lower number than 25 maybe?

 

The other thing that is slightly confusing me (not hard to do I admit!) is in your AIMOD readme, you say put all the files in the OBJECTS folder...I thought the plane DATA INI's have to go in the relevant plane folder, no?

 

Thanks again.

 

Bucky.

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Yeah, Thanks for your efforts Bortdafarm, your mods are pushing the sim to new levels of realism, well done mate!

 

Couple of things though...I noticed, in order to make enemy planes harder to shoot down, you've set their armour levels to 'STEEL'. It now seems inordinately hard to bring the blighters down!

 

Is there some middle ground between 'WOOD' and 'STEEL', maybe by reducing the 'thickness' to a lower number than 25 maybe?

 

The other thing that is slightly confusing me (not hard to do I admit!) is in your AIMOD readme, you say put all the files in the OBJECTS folder...I thought the plane DATA INI's have to go in the relevant plane folder, no?

 

Thanks again.

 

Bucky.

thanks guys!

yes i kinda thought the data ins for the aircraft went into the aircraft individual folder..but i figured that as the original was stored in the cat and the cat was just in the object folder...i dunno seems to work ok (i'll try and double check on that just to be sure)

 

you could reduce the armour thickness to see if you can get things balanced out....what i suggest tho at least at first is to use the way the sim models precise locations for the damage areas...you can bring dow a plane with one shot if you hit just behind the pilot ..fuel tank goes up..or hit the nose area and the engine stops..(i really like the way this is so well modelled!)

 

as an extra thing Tex Murphy :good: (over at the third wire forum) has just told me how to get the bombs working in the campaign so i'll add that to the experience mod (goes in the same file) and post that here as well..

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OK, just did a bit more testing and I think I can safely say the plane DATA INI's go in the relevant plane folders, and not 'OBJECTS'.

 

Also, Armour set to 'STEEL' is too tough...In a DVII I got within 10-12 feet of a Spad and heard the bullets ricochet off it like it was a tank! No bullet holes either, so, keeping all of your other settings in the DATA INI's, I set all the 'Armour' back to wood.

 

Hope this helps some with your testing Bortdafarm.

 

Bucky.

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Guest IndioBlack
...you can bring dow a plane with one shot if you hit just behind the pilot ..fuel tank goes up..or hit the nose area and the engine stops..(i really like the way this is so well modelled!)

 

 

I like the way the engine stops too. It happened to me when I sat in front of an Se5 testing out the new Albatros cockpit. He sprayed a few bullets my way and then suddenly the prop froze.

 

But, out of curiosity here, what is actually happening when the prop freezes ? Has the gearing been damaged so it won't turn, has it seized up, or what ? The Engine sounds are still running, so from the cockpit viewpoint, it's all a bit spooky.

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here's a link to the third wire thread (re Jokers new campaign) where Tex gives the fix for the bombs

 

LINK TO TEX MURPHYS BOMB FIX INFO

 

i've allso added my version of it here as an attachment...i've added the fix to all the aircraft but i may have not have got it spot on ...let me know if you see any aircraft dropping bombs..(if you notice)

 

 

cheers guys!

Bucky customise it to your heart's content..that's half the fun of a sim like this :good:

thanks for the feed back keep it coming..

 

Indio i think the egnine is supposed to have siezed but perhaps the engine noise sometimes doesn't catch on..

FEexpermodv2.zip

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OK, just did a bit more testing and I think I can safely say the plane DATA INI's go in the relevant plane folders, and not 'OBJECTS'.

 

Also, Armour set to 'STEEL' is too tough...In a DVII I got within 10-12 feet of a Spad and heard the bullets ricochet off it like it was a tank! No bullet holes either, so, keeping all of your other settings in the DATA INI's, I set all the 'Armour' back to wood.

 

Hope this helps some with your testing Bortdafarm.

 

Bucky.

 

 

well i have to say your right..i tried the aircraft data inis in the individual aircraft folders and yes same result as you...reducing the armour thickness to around 8 or so has the balance about right..BUT as you say the sound isn't right...AND the same result should be obtainable by using much thicker wood armour..giving the correct sound....with any luck...any huw many thanks for the heads up..fairly critical oops on my part that one...still the other files seem to be in the correct place??

 

there's something fishy going on tho here...as SOME of the alterations to the aircraft data inis in the object folder DID have an effect.....i wonder if there's more to this than meets the eye..

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well i have to say your right..i tried the aircraft data inis in the individual aircraft folders and yes same result as you...reducing the armour thickness to around 8 or so has the balance about right..BUT as you say the sound isn't right...AND the same result should be obtainable by using much thicker wood armour..giving the correct sound....with any luck...any huw many thanks for the heads up..fairly critical oops on my part that one...still the other files seem to be in the correct place??

 

there's something fishy going on tho here...as SOME of the alterations to the aircraft data inis in the object folder DID have an effect.....i wonder if there's more to this than meets the eye..

 

 

Bort,

Great Job!!! I'd agree with the armor plating be a tad strong on the ai planes but other then that... Superb

Job!

 

Cranked up the game after installing your mod. For the first time in a week of playing the sim I had an enemy plane on my tail actually shooting at me and following me through manuevers. I really like what you did with this. buck.

 

Bort,

Great Job!!! I'd agree with the armor plating be a tad strong on the ai planes but other then that... Superb

Job!

 

Cranked up the game after installing your mod. For the first time in a week of playing the sim I had an enemy plane on my tail actually shooting at me and following me through manuevers. I really like what you did with this. buck.

 

 

Ummm... how does one go about changing the armor rating? Sorry, Newb Here.

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Bort,

Great Job!!! I'd agree with the armor plating be a tad strong on the ai planes but other then that... Superb

Job!

 

Cranked up the game after installing your mod. For the first time in a week of playing the sim I had an enemy plane on my tail actually shooting at me and following me through manuevers. I really like what you did with this. buck.

Ummm... how does one go about changing the armor rating? Sorry, Newb Here.

:good:

 

Cheers Buckner!

 

cheered me up a bit!!

 

i've attached an updated version to this post with a new corrected readme and installation instructions and reduced armour for the aircraft..

 

or if you fancy a bash ..right click on the aircraft data.ini ..select open (or open with) choose notepad from the list and scroll down to the

 

[AircraftData]

EmptyMass=694.5

EmptyInertia=1512.9,1224.3,2709.4

ReferenceArea=24.77

ReferenceSpan=8.13

ReferenceChord=1.52

CGPosition=0.00,0.00,0.00

OnGroundPitchAngle=12.5

HasArmor=TRUE

DefaultArmorType=STEEL

DefaultArmorThickness=0.5

etc etc

 

this is the entry you need to edit...(i believe it's in milimetres thickness)

 

UPDATED further reduction in armour

AIMODv4.zip

Edited by bortdafarm

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One thing about steel, it doesn't burn. After installing these mod's the only damage that I could do to other planes most of the time was to kill their engines. Then they would make a deadstick landing. I was able to shoot down a total of around 10 planes and of those I was only able to shoot off more than tiny pieces of the enemy plane (at the most) in every case except one when I was able to shoot off both right wings. There was absolutely no smoke or flames in any case whatsoever. And the "topper" was that out of the approx. 10 planes that I got I only received credit for 3 (the rest were parked in various farmer's fields around the countryside). Please don't take this as a complaint or criticism in any way. I appreciate all the time and effort to make F.E. a better sim. Keep up the good work.

 

CB

 

p.s. I went into the "ini" files and changed the steel armor to wood (but haven't flown since then).

Edited by Curious

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One thing about steel, it doesn't burn. After installing these mod's the only damage that I could do to other planes most of the time was to kill their engines. Then they would make a deadstick landing. I was able to shoot down a total of around 10 planes and of those I was only able to shoot off more than tiny pieces of the enemy plane (at the most) in every case except one when I was able to shoot off both right wings. There was absolutely no smoke or flames in any case whatsoever. And the "topper" was that out of the approx. 10 planes that I got I only received credit for 3 (the rest were parked in various farmer's fields around the countryside). Please don't take this as a complaint or criticism in any way. I appreciate all the time and effort to make F.E. a better sim. Keep up the good work.

 

CB

 

p.s. I went into the "ini" files and changed the steel armor to wood (but haven't flown since then).

ok no worries...i'm still trying various different approachs to the problem... the real catch 22 here is that what works well for the player nearly allways makes life doubly difficult for the AI...so you squadron mates get no kills at all...or going the other way they get shot down far too often for them to become a serious part of the gameplay... that's kinda my intention ..to try to make the AI pilots as effective as i possibly can whilst not getting too far out side the box..mainly it's the gunnery that seems to be the problem..

the armour is a littl bit confusing i must admit....i had some VERY inconsistent resluts has me slightly baffled..

 

thanks for the feed back :good:

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Sir bortdafarm,

 

You're doing good work, but you've introduced so many variables now that it's difficult to sort out the stuff that works from that which doesn't.

 

For instance: I'd very much like to modify the files needed to improve AI performance, but when I downloaded your fix, it included changes to a lot of other variables as well (this was a few days ago). In addition, the fix you mentioned for tightening up formations hadn't been done in the files I looked at.

 

Here's a suggestion: Back in the old EAW days (when dinosaurs roamed the Earth, etc., etc.) I did some weapons testing. I found that the old scientific method works best -- introduce a single variable at a time and test it enough to draw reliable conclusions.

 

In my case I tested each change a minimum of five times using a mission scenario which I could repeat without a problem and which adequately tested the scenario.

 

This is difficult and -- do I have to say it? -- booooorrrrring. But it's the only way to sort out effective mods.

 

For what it's worth, if you need help in testing, develop a mission which will adequately test the variable, then ask for help. I'll help. Now that my Christmas shopping is done, I should have some time.

 

Hah! That was a joke, guys. :D

 

Jim

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post-21318-1166543925_thumb.jpgpost-21318-1166543898_thumb.jpg

 

Hi Guys,

 

Wanted to take a minute and share a couple of pics from a recent campaign mission. Three things happened that should give us hope that this mod is helping IMHO.

 

1. I actually had a two seater get on my tail and fire at me, twice no less... Holding the AI planes in utter contempt I was very surprised, but oddly very glad, when this happened. It forced me to break off my attack and perform evasive manuevers.

 

2. The damage was modified, WOOD and a setting of 8, I don't know what the default is but I encountered a Kraut plane with a smoke trail (yes the black smoke trail mod is installed.) I had never seen this before and wanted to share a picture of it.

 

3. One of the AI Brit Wingmen got a kill and another fired his guns! Never seen that prior to the mod in over a week of playing. Screenshot enclosed.

 

Here is a thought about what Bortdafarm and others are doing with this mod and I will use my misfortunes as an example.

 

I've been simming WWI games since the initial Red Barron game came out. The AI pilots have never been a match for myself or others that I have simmed these games with. What ineviatably causes me to die after a handful of campaign missions is something that is very realistic. Over confidence and putting my plane into bad situations is usually my demise.

 

In this scenario that the screenshots are from, with the help of my newly aggressive wingman, we had cleared the skies of Hun aircraft with the exception of a lone German two seater. Early in the fray I had engaged this aircraft but broke off my attack after his rear gunner sent several rounds through my wing and showed no sign of giving me an easy kill. Feeling confident I could take this bugger down, I approached him very low from the 8 oclock side. I kept him above me until I got very close, popped up (around 75 yds perhaps?) and was instantaneously killed by the Red Baron of rear gunners. Very frustrating to see my SE-5 seperate into several flaming pieces.

 

Long story short, you are doing great work on this mod! It could be argured that Voss, the Red Baron, and several other great WWI aces had few equals in the air on the Western Front. Bad decisions (fatigue?), and overconfidence (placing themselves in bad situations (Voss, 7-1)) caused many a great ace to lose their lives. With what you are doing with this mod, I dare say you are creating a very similiar environment.

 

Keep up the good work and I'll also throw my hat in to help you test what you are doing.

 

Thank you for your hard work. :ok:

 

Buckner.

 

 

 

 

Woops, new to this forum, sorry If I screwed something up with how I posted pictures and such. Buck.

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Quote. Old Guy:

You're doing good work, but you've introduced so many variables now that it's difficult to sort out the stuff that works from that which doesn't.

 

 

Yeah, good shout Jim...I'm getting a little muddled by all the changes myself.

 

Apart from Bortdafarm's AI mod, I'm also using the Headshake mod by Warbirds, which I have to keep on adding to Bortdafarm's DATA INI's. Now I'm kinda dreading the first official patch being released 'cause it'll take me back to square one!

 

It seems the only way to keep on top of all the changes is to keep a diary!

 

Bucky.

Edited by Southside Bucky

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Keep a diary! Hah!

 

You mean like those two pages of scribbled notes I've got lying under my MSFF stick?

 

Seriously, notes ain't a bad idea. I've been considering doing mine up electronic format and keeping a copy in my Tools & Notes folder.

 

I've applied the Fokker gear mod, the DESTROYED to DISABLED mod in the aircraft files and downloaded the Zeppelin (though I haven't figured out how to get it in the game yet).

 

I'd probably pick and choose among bortdafarm's various mods, if I could figure out exactly what they were.

 

Hmm. I feel myself being slooowwwly drawn into this thing. It's -- it's sort of habit forming. But -- hey! -- I can give it up anytime I want.

 

Right, guys?

 

Right?

 

Um . . .

 

 

jim :)

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cheers guys :good:

thanks for the feed back :good:

 

what i suppose i'm doing here is brainstorming the thing...i am testing one change at a time then building up a collection of alterations ..then posting the results here...what has really thown me side ways tho is the placement of the individual sircraft data.inis into the aircraft folder rather than the root object folder....(i had assumed that because the object.cat was in the root object folder that that was where the se5a data ini etc needed to go...at the moment i am really considering not making any changes to the individual airaft data.inis at all and concentrating on the aircraftobject.ini gundata.ini and the wwicamp1_data.ini (for the boosted AI pilot stats...

 

if i can find the file that allows me to boost the AI pilots skill condition experience etc a little further (their experience can exceed 100 on the roster screen) then this i think will give the best results...i can't locate this stuff out side of the wwicamp1_data.ini and that is capped at 100 (AFAIK)

 

strange to say that the campaign it self allthough the sim is supposed to be a sim-lite (??) and the enemy aircraft can be extremely easy to shoot down in large numbers..surving for any length of time in the campaign is extremely difficult..

in fact the FE campaign has got to be one of the most difficult campaigns to complete i have tried! (without reflys etc) the sim is a bit of a contradiction...

 

the AI is certainly no worse than any other period sim and a lot better than some...

 

testing is extremely hard work..as i don't use any specifically designed mission to test i prefer to test "in the wild" as it were....in genuine campaign patrols...which makes it harder (and more time consuming) still to gauge and progress...i want to avoid the armour issue as much as possible allthough an expert on that side could really cook up something very special

 

here's the armour entrys from the tanks

 

Chassis

ModelNodeName=Chassis

EffectSize=1.0

MaxExtentPosition=1.40, 3.98, 2.53

MinExtentPosition=-1.40,-3.95, 0.00

HasArmor=TRUE

ArmorMaterial=STEEL

ArmorFRONT.Thickness=14

ArmorRIGHT.Thickness=12

ArmorLEFT.Thickness=12

ArmorREAR.Thickness=12

ArmorTOP.Thickness=8

ArmorBOTTOM.Thickness=6

 

 

had to remove the brackets to post it here

 

check the tank inis for the real thing

 

note that you can assign different thickness's to each side top and bottom....now this suggests that you could assign armour to the wings of an aircraft that only worked from the front and rear....meaning that it would be nearly impossible to cause damage to the wings from directly behind or in front of the aircraft BUT if you attacked from above or below the aircraft then the wings would have no protection at all...etc you see what i mean....same for the other parts of the aircraft

 

this sort of thing i reckon could give some interesting results in game one second an enemy is a tough as nails the nest as soft as putty --depending on which angle you attack it from..

 

i'll have a go myself but if you see any possibilities with this idea then please have a bash at it and post the results ..(and the files if your willing)

 

anyhuw it is confusing i'm getting a bit bedraggled myself...

 

what i suggest you do if your having trouble keeping track of the changes is to only install the

AIRCRAFTOBJECT.ini

GUNDATA.ini

and the

Feexperience mod (either version)

and leave the other files as stock

 

this gives some pretty reasonable performances from the AI

roleplay the roster board a little and send out those pilots who have high skill experience and CND (condition)

Edited by bortdafarm

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Hey have you considered this value "CannonFireAngle". Ive never changed it and your files have it to stock value as well.

 

Any idea what it does?

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Tex,

 

You raise a good point. But the setting you mention is only one example of the mystery inherent in such labels. Many are more than a little obscure. I realize that's inevitable, given the constraints of the English language and the demands of writing setting names. However, is there a reference, a kind of SF Rosetta Stone that one could use to determine exactly what a certain setting does?

 

Or would we be better off consulting the Oracle of Delphi?

 

Jim

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Well the value goes down the better the AI pilot and WoV has 1.0 for its ace pilot while FE has 2.0... Im gonna do some changes here...

 

Tex

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GunnerFireChance=100

GunnerFireTime=4.5

GunnerAimOffset=0.0050

 

the gunnerFiretime has me a bit confused as well!!

 

is it

a) the length of time it takes for the pilot to fire once he's got a bead on the target?

or

b) the length of time he will keep firing before he resets and trys again...

 

or summat else?

 

either way doesn't seem to make a hoot of differnce what you set it to...

 

and why is the gunneraimoffset different to the other ace novice veteran etc aim angles??

 

if the AI can be persuaded to fire a decent long burst on each occasion then they will get more kills...(regardless of wether in real life WW1 guns might have jammed when used in such a wanton fashion)

they can't be firing more than ten or fifteen bullets each time according to the stats at the debriefing screen and if only 30% hit then that's not going to do much short of a lucky pilot kill or fuel tank/engine hit...

 

get them to fire 30 or 40 bullets at a time and not only will they get more kills (even if they occasionaly run out of ammo) they will be more dangerous to the player aswell..

 

there are burst length data entrys for the rear gunners on the two seaters.. but these don't have any noticable effect (at first glance ) when applied to the fighters?

 

as another point reducing the pitch damper for the ai in the aircraftdata.inis does seem to give them a bit more abilty to line up their shots...but this is only a margiinal benifit as far as i can tell..

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More confusing information:

 

Before installing the AI and GunData mods, I had an AI Squadmember shoot down 3 Brit Planes in about 3 minutes.

 

After installing the Experience, AI, and GunData mods, during another campaign, I had a pilot with a skill of 93. I was floored. I started the 1st mission in the campaign, and he was shot down in first 90 seconds of the mission. I choose Refly, and he was AGAIN shot down in the first 90 seconds of the mission.

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More confusing information:

 

Before installing the AI and GunData mods, I had an AI Squadmember shoot down 3 Brit Planes in about 3 minutes.

 

After installing the Experience, AI, and GunData mods, during another campaign, I had a pilot with a skill of 93. I was floored. I started the 1st mission in the campaign, and he was shot down in first 90 seconds of the mission. I choose Refly, and he was AGAIN shot down in the first 90 seconds of the mission.

i increased the experience rating for all the fighter squadrons..with an eye on making the AI harder for the player as well....not that really seemed to make them more difficult for the player to shoot down... :sorry:

 

tho you have give me an idea...what if i just increased the experience level for the players squadron??

then only your squadron mates would have decent skill levels etc..all the rest would be as stock...that on paper might work..tho it would involve having a different mod for each of the possible squadron choices....not impossible i'll experiment with that and see how it pans out good idea?

 

if you fancy trying it out just get the stock wwicamp1_data.ini and find the squadron you want to fly with

set theri experince level to 100 and bobs your uncle..

 

as a quick experiment here's RAF1 squadron set to max ..all other squadrons friendly and enemy are as stock..might work...should work....but will it??

RAF1squadmod.zip

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i am becoming slowly vaguely convinced that somehow any changes made to one aircraft or set of AI pilots actualy affects ALL the other aircraft and pilots in the game...the game compensates...

 

i've tried quite a few campaign patrols now using this ACE SE5A squadron...and they got anihalated every time with no kills at all...why??? because the campaign sent ten enemy fighters after each and every one of the player squadrons AI pilots.... :crazy: they were simply over whelmed..

 

allso one or two of the alterations to the fighter aircraft stats i've tried have resulted in the two seater aircraft not being able to get of the ground (beats me) or so it seemed...change em back and the two seaters are fine again...(with no changes made to the two seaters at all either way)

 

as an experiment i slightly "ubered" the SE5A and left all other aircraft as stock (including the drag issue on the Fokkers) and strangely i found that the Fokkers were able to catch the SE5A's and even overtake them even tho they were travelling at over 100 knts....

 

it's a puzzle kinda makes some sort of sense from a gameplay point of view but it makes modding this aspect a very limited balancing trick rather than anything straight forward..

 

i wonder if the game recognises the skill rating of the AI pilots in your squadron and assigns more fighters to attack them the higher their stats are.. so in the end raising their stats has in fact the opposite effect than that desired...as Major DB noticed...

more confusion

 

i do hope we can get something sorted with this...especailly from campaign gameplay point of view..because IMO as it is (at least in traditional terms) the campaign is virtualy impossible to complete..if you lose too many pilots AFAIK you lose the campaign (have i got that right??) replacements don't seem to arrive at a rate that allows you to carry on even if you succesfully complete every mission ( i have yet to recieve any replacments at all to be honest)

given the difficulty in keeping pilots alive especaily on the long haul patrols deep into enemy territory i am inclined to say that the campaign given the sim-lite tag is un-playable (in any normal sense of the word anyway)

leave the squad at home and ffly by your self is probably the best chance of completing the campaign which is not fantastic..

 

i'll see if i can wake up the replacement pilot/aircraft side of the campaign to ensure a steady flow right from the start..??

Edited by bortdafarm

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Guest IndioBlack
i do hope we can get something sorted with this...especailly from campaign gameplay point of view..because IMO as it is (at least in traditional terms) the campaign is virtualy impossible to complete..

 

Are you playing a normal campaign or a hard one ? Are you flying for the Germans or the British ?

 

I really can't understand you not being able to complete a campaign. I've already completed one in an Se5, and am currently on my second. I think we're winning because I've downed a lot of enemy aircraft, and the Germans don't send much opposition up anymore. For a change, my Primary Target in the last mission was actually a balloon.

 

I just fly the waypoints, attack anything that's not ours, and if I can't target anything, I look on the map and see if there's any German planes showing, and if there is, then I go after them.

What I do try and avoid is flak areas.

 

What I find odd about the campaign is that all I ever seem to be asked to do is go and fight enemy aircraft, apart from this once being asked to hit a balloon. I never get tasked with bombing tanks or airfields or anything a little different. It's just go kill planes, and that's really quite easy when they don't shoot back much. Fun though.

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