A bunch of Flight Models

[+peter01 2]

Well, tweaked some, and added a few.

 

No longer doing FokkerEIIILate since EIII pit updated. Have deleted previous download, and provided a new one with 6 FMs.

 

Available in downloads section. http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?autom...amp;showcat=213

 

Fokker EIII - Tweaked, modded to fit with Bort's new cockpit

Fokker EIV - Substantially redone. A bit of number crunching worked wonders

Fokker BII, DII, DIII and DIIIL (late with Ailerons) - Several new FMs

 

A few points:

 

Written for Hard FM (hard everything actually). But flew Normal Mode all last night, they seem good, climb a bit strong (like most), but as AI are very good (well behaved), oddly enough better than maybe Hard FM. Perhaps all are.....

 

Tested against N11 mainly, seems to fit in terms of capability and consistency.

 

All take off fine.

 

All the aircraft are different in major or minor ways - capabilities improve with later models.

 

Tried to build according to real specs - dimensions power performance etc, tho info on some planes is scarce so had to guess.

 

Increased roll a tad more than planned a few weeks ago - I found the AI finds it hard to fight unless this is the case. Basically gives up.

 

The new Eindecker FMs are far better as AI, and spins/stalls reduced considerably as well, but will happen now and then, as do other things of course. The others seem good/realistic, but obviously not world beaters or very competitive against N11. Hoping for Bristol Scout, Morane etc, but later Fokkers are early 1917 as well.

 

Damage modelling modified somewhat on the new FMs.

 

Of course you will need Bortda's original models form here: http://www.ebort2.co.uk/FE.html and his most up to date E3 version, done early March.

 

If any issues or questions let me know.

 

Thanks again to Bortda for permission to do alternative FMs.

Edited March 13, 2007 by peter01

[Bandy 3]

Thanks Peter, I'll download and give them a try. Sounds like you're really pleased tho...

It is much appreciated that your post describes your approach to FM.

Have you maintained the armour Bortdafarm placed in his planes ini's? I suppose I can look myself and edit as appropriate...

RE: climb rates, yes, I noticed that as well that those monoplanes were pretty strong in that dept.

[+sinbad 27]

Thanks. This really is helpful.

 

The link doesn't work just yet though, perhaps still waiting for CA screening.

[Gr.Viper 131]

U-huh.. And I can't see it either. Perhaps Fates made new category and forgot to make it less restricted for approval.

[+Fates 63]

fixed my error. They are now approved and you should see the ModOption now Gr.Viper

[+peter01 2]

I had problems uploading initially as well.... but seems sorted out.

 

No armour in these versions.

 

"Sounds like you're really pleased tho... "

 

Yes, I am, very much. My Eindecker problems with AI completely fixed with these mods, and are really well behaved opponents now.

 

The Fokker B and D series are completely new FMs, and are a delight to fly (and look at of course), even if I say so myself. The AI worked well straight away, so could concentrate on the player FM experience more, without all the AI testing - thankfully, was driving me nuts, the eindeckers were a tough start!

 

Am enjoying the challenge myself against DH2s and N11's with these planes, takes a different type of flying approach, and haven't really been as challenged since initial release. Also dodging the AI's attack and bullets in a fighter is a new experience for me - after a few dogfights say in DIII against N11 you appreciate the marked improvement in the AI in aggressiveness and shooting in the latest FE patch.

 

Perhaps the whole game/AI was developed for less capable planes/FMs, slower roll/climb etc, and handles it better..........the initial release FMs weren't easy.

 

Hope you have fun with them....

Edited March 13, 2007 by peter01

[SRT 0]

Peter01 - These old German planes now have half a chance. Way to go, and thanks. A bunch of fun, especially with your 1916 campaign. I love it when the Salmonds dogfight with an EIV --- way cool.

[+peter01 2]

An update. Modified download available at CA download section. http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?autom...amp;showcat=213 Pack includes E3, E4, D3, D3L. May redo the D2 and B2 at some later date, tho unlikely, would really take a lot of time.

 

As I am keen on 1916, of course I wanted to get some of these working properly for myself and others, which it wasn't in last version, as I found out with AI as I relaxed in a campaign to enjoy the fruits of my labour. Theres a limitation, and I've spent many hours tweaking and tuning (and a bit of fudging) and testing to get something working ......I've been flying with this lot a couple of days now, and they will do for me - pretty good to fly, passable AI.... makes a 1916 campaign far more enjoyable, either side.

 

Here's a rundown on the FMs and the changes:

 

Flying. This is definitely the best part, and in this update particularly. They are all somewhat different in characteristics, and I've made them all more consistent with other people's FMs, ie, easier to fly, with lower stall speeds and problems. They are fun to fly, if you just try one, suggest the Fokker EIII.

 

Performance. More competitive - with a bit of skill or practise, player will mostly beat period opponents. Still not over modelled IMO, just more comparable with other FMs.

 

AI vs AI seems fine.

 

Player vs these AI. Hmmm. It took a great deal of effort but - nearly eliminated all stalls/spins, bouncing on ground during dogfights and reduced excessive slowdowns in speed. BUT, the AI will give up after some minutes (if not shot down), still evades, but acts as if the pilots having engine problems. I've set the D3s to "Rare" so they do not appear as often when you fly allied in missions/campaigns, it can become a bit of a turkey shoot. But variety is good.

 

Takeoff. Fine - however you will start to move without prop spinning for a few secs if you view in external mode.

 

I'm probably done with these unless real issues emerge or major upgrades are done by Bort in the future.

 

As always, feedback welcome, Cheers.

Edited March 20, 2007 by peter01

[Bandy 3]

Peter,

I haven't tried these latest FMs yet, BUT don't let yourself get sucked in too far, you may never come back

 

I did upload Bort's revisions, and your FMs last weekend, but the AI EIII's that showed up didn't have texture maps in place... I had a look in the INI's and all seemed well there, so I'm at a loss.

 

Now, I haven't troubleshot this problem yet (haven't had the time), but if memory serves I think I transferred some of the original EIII skins into the new AC folder (Bort had made some colour variations that weren't included in the new download) so I'm hoping that is the problem. From what I saw on his website, he has tweaked some of the models which may have resulted in a different UV Map and skin incompatibility with earlier versions (????)

 

Has anyone else had skin problems?

 

HOWEVER, even before I uploaded the revised AC and FMs, I had an AI EIII "targeted" in a mission (Vogesen terrain) but on an airfield at 0 mph. I thought how interesting and different for a change! I'll nail him as he takes off!!! But when I got closer, all it showed up as was the red targeting square--there was no aircraft at all, yet my Target HUD said EIII. So something weird IS going on now, but they worked fine before... I'll delete and reinstall all those AC in case there is a corrupt file.

[Firecage 1]

Hey Pete thanks for the efforts on getting these planes ot be a bit more capable in the sim. If your done with the tweaking I will DL the newest FM sets and try them out this week as I can. I just released the newest plane fest campaign but If it works well I will do a new release of the fest with the Fokkers in there. Not sure just how I want to include them yet but there are a few options I can think of.

 

I haven't got the newer of borts planes to test but I can do the EIII and the EVI. I tried to drop by Borts site and leave a msg in the blog but my msg's dont show up... I think I know why but.... if I can I will see if im allowed to DL the other planes he has or not.

 

Again thanks for fixing these up for us.

Edited March 20, 2007 by Firecage

[+peter01 2]

Hi B Bandy RFC,

 

I used a previous version when developing and testing, but then downloaded all of Bort's updates last night, and doesn't seem like a problem. The data.inis/flight model is fine.

 

You stated "I transferred some of the original EIII skins into the new AC folder". Bort I think has added new LOD files and this could be a reason. I have found best not to mix and match new skins and models with the old - I just deleted all the old stuff and reinstalled the new, tho I personally liked the original D3 skin.

 

Hope this helps.

[+peter01 2]

Hi Firecage,

 

Yes, done with tweaking. They are more capable, players could fly say in 1916 in an E3 or others and not only survive but do well.

 

Apologies about difficulties, to everyone actually, but these have proved to be elusive nuts to crack. I had them ready a week ago but just wanted to be reasonably sure by playing lots of missions and campaigns with them so I knew what the issues would be, if any, before anyone d/l'd again.

 

Should have PM'd you on progress.....probably now means extra work - sorry, I really can sympathise with that......

 

Cheers

Edited March 20, 2007 by peter01

[Firecage 1]

Pete if I can't get the files from borts site is there a way I can get with you and DL them from you or your ftp site?

[+peter01 2]

I haven't got the newer of borts planes to test but I can do the EIII and the EVI. I tried to drop by Borts site and leave a msg in the blog but my msg's dont show up... I think I know why but.... if I can I will see if im allowed to DL the other planes he has or not.

 

Firecage, did you get my PM??

[Firecage 1]

Firecage, did you get my PM??

 

 

Yes, you should have the PM back. If any more info, just PM me, I try and get in at least once a day here. I did try to DL one of borts planes last nite and it worked so I can get to them looks like. I have to go lay down some tracks for a band tonight but I will try and get on late and see if I can get them all DL'd from Bort and see what I think on the planes vs the newer arrivals for the plane fest. Lots of new plane have entered the play field lately :)

 

I am hopeful that Ateam will release the Sop Tripe soon and maybe we can see it and a return of borts planes to the fest. Still need to get his direct permission to have them included in the plane fest to keep everyone happy. If your through here bort please drop a yea or nay here so I can have your direct permission.

 

Great work on the new FM's Pete

[+peter01 2]

New Update , yeah yeah..... but its quite major.

 

I cracked the AI issue, doing a Halb DII for myself, I hadn't been intending to do any more changes.

 

I've updated the pack with the changed FMs described below, at CA usual place - its a small download so just d/l'ing it for say Halb DII alone is easy.

 

New Halb DII FM. Somewhat slow climb, slow speed around 90mph, but easy to fly, light and very nimble. Tested against N17 and N11 mainly, you will have some great dogfights, AI or player. This Halb is a good match with the N17, even Pup. Given Bort will likely continue work on Halb, probably will need to update FMs in future on this one.

 

Eindeckers updated, same as previous version for player, except slightly improved rudder (done for player and to make AI a little more aggressive), but mods to FM vastly improve the AI .

 

Tested for Hard FM, but can say very confidently works just as well for Normal FM, player or AI.

 

No problems with takeoff. Eliminated non rotating prop problem at start of takeoff for these for my previous FMs (part of solving AI issue).

 

But main reason for the update is the AI. They are like all AI aircraft now. But some points, given they were a bit less than perfect in past,

 

Far far more aggressive, very good in evasion. The Halb DII esp with v. good maneouvarability.

Do not go to low altitude quickly at all anymore.

Very rarely spin/stall, less than most other planes.

Do not give up any more, no long how dogfight continues.

Sometimes land/takeoff during dogfight, but its reasonably rare. Followed them many times for 20 mins or more.

Sometimes crash dogfighting near ground, happens but very rare.

 

D3s require a bit of FM rework to make effective AI as Eindeckers and Halberstadt. Will do this, as want this for myself, maybe B2 and D2 as well, but no promises for now.

 

Lastly, for those that like tweaking these FMs are very very finely tuned (out of neccessity). Modding flight characteristics or the AI section will more than likely result in difficulties for the AI, so if you do this, keep that in mind. Exception is rudder of course.

 

Thanks again to Bort for his permission to do these FMs, including new Halb DII.

 

Comments welcome...........Cheers

Edited March 24, 2007 by peter01

[+sinbad 27]

Peter01

 

Very good!

 

FM tweaking is best done the same way as sculpture, one chip at a time.

 

Thanks for the continuing effort.

 

 

sinbad

[+Tailspin 3]

peter01...good job on the Halb. One small problem. The latest version seems to have the pilot sitting too far forward and too high up. I revised the pilot position in the data.ini to 0.0,-0.90,0.50. Works for me. Cockpit seat position is fine. FM feels good. I see you fixed the inertia values and got rid of the "ballooning". Now you can reverse your turns and when you push the stick forward it actually dives. Thx.

[+peter01 2]

peter01...good job on the Halb. One small problem. The latest version seems to have the pilot sitting too far forward and too high up. I revised the pilot position in the data.ini to 0.0,-0.90,0.50. Works for me. Cockpit seat position is fine. FM feels good. I see you fixed the inertia values and got rid of the "ballooning". Now you can reverse your turns and when you push the stick forward it actually dives. Thx.

 

Hi Tailspin, thanks, I got the pilot postion wrong there, looks funny, have updated zip. New Zip is dated 25th March, if you don't have this date folder then redownload, then copy new Halb data_ini to correct folder, or to correct manually just copy this section over old for Halb DII as per Tailspin's suggestion, plus extent positions:

 

[Pilot]

SystemType=PILOT_COCKPIT

PilotModelName=WWIpilot

PilotHeadNodeName=head

Position=0.0,-0.90,0.50

MinExtentPosition=-0.20,-1.20,-0.05

MaxExtentPosition= 0.20,-0.60, 0.51

 

Thanks for pointing this out, Tailspin, and comments.

Edited March 24, 2007 by peter01

[+peter01 2]

Finished. Sorta!!!

 

Updated download to include brand new Fokker B2, D2, D3 and D3L FMs. Work fine, player or AI. Even B2 as AI will give a good fight. All easier to fly and more capable then previous versions.

 

Definite upgrade path, Halb the most capable, B2 the least - can hardly wait for that superb looking Morane being done, for itself and against B2s and D2s as well as EIII should be a good fight!! Tried to base their capability on my view (plus research) of their chances versus Nieuports (thanks Tex, EmID and Monty).

 

Hope you like it, think I achieved what I wanted: more consistency in game play for the 1916 airwar, and to do something myself for the community, given I'm a skin, campaign and new plane junkie, downloading all the great work being done by others.

 

Note that if you have any funny issues with graphics/cockpits/guns/skins its likely you do not have Borts latest versions - I used the ones available on 25th March. Of course it could be me, so post here anyway, will try to help.

 

The sorta, is because Bort is very productively updating, and if cockpits change or major upgrades occur, I might incorporate changes . And of course, if any major issues or if I find minor improvements etc.

Edited March 26, 2007 by peter01

[+sinbad 27]

Thanks Peter- I try them later today.

 

You're right to seek to balance the FM's as I often adjust the aircraft mix in the loadout screen.

 

I must report that Sisyphus had it easy though. Bort just released the Martysyde G100 (you probably already know about the Halb DIII.

 

Cheers

 

sinbad

[Firecage 1]

Hey pete... not sure if you can take a look at this but Im getting a bunch of EIII and EVI that nose into the ground and do not crash or any damage at all to them. They just take right back off, and I mean like very direct noce to the ground. I know there is an issue with soft landings and all but this is beyond what Im getting on any other plane in the game. If you can take a look at the damage nodes and see if they can be made ot detect a bit more on ground collisions.

 

Thanks

Edited March 28, 2007 by Firecage

[+Flamer50 3]

Hey pete... not sure if you can take a look at this but Im getting a bunch of EIII and EVI that nose into the ground and do not crash or any damage at all to them. They just take right back off, and I mean like very direct noce to the ground. I know there is an issue with soft landings and all but this is beyond what Im getting on any other plane in the game. If you can take a look at the damage nodes and see if they can be made ot detect a bit more on ground collisions.

 

Thanks

 

Your not the only one. Same thing has been going on with my game(FEpatch2) and it isn't just the Fokkers,

it's been happening with the "stockers" as well as 3rd party aircraft. Don't know what the deal is with this,

have written it off as more AI idiocy for now.

[Bandy 3]

Your not the only one...

 

I have not experienced this at all post patch2, and I usually try to fly a mission or two from each of a handful of campaigns 1916-18 on a regular basis.

BUT I saw it before and mentioned it in a post sometime ago.

Some weird combination of mods? Ghost in the machine again??? I think it is just random events/chance, and I wouldn't try to chase them there ghosts in the FMs...

Keep watching, I prognosticate they'll go away... :yes:

 

Edited March 28, 2007 by B Bandy RFC

[+Tailspin 3]

I see it often with the EIII. I also concur that ground collision has been a been a problem with FE from the beginning.