Problems with certain air to air missiles....

[SkyStrike 15]

Hi,

I seem to be having a lot of problems regarding air-to-air missiles in Wings Over Europe:

 

Even after downloading the latest weapons pack even the latest 'Fire & Forget' missiles seem to miss their targets quite often altough the target is locked and a shoot cue appears on the HUD...

 

Besides some AAM's seem to detonate immediately after launch and blow up my plane to smithereens

 

The most shocking part is that even the 'all aspect' heat seeking missiles like the AIM-9M Sidewinder, & later models and even the Rafael Python 3 & 4 seem to be very easily decieved by flares launched by their targets, which don't seem to make any evasive maneuvers... they just fly level and launch a couple of flares & Presto! they evade the missile...

 

Is there any way i can solve these problems?

 

Thanks...

[Murphy'S 15]

The most shocking part is that even the 'all aspect' heat seeking missiles like the AIM-9M Sidewinder, & later models and even the Rafael Python 3 & 4 seem to be very easily decieved by flares launched by their targets, which don't seem to make any evasive maneuvers... they just fly level and launch a couple of flares & Presto! they evade the missile...

 

Is there any way i can solve these problems?

 

Thanks...

 

i always tought that these missils were overmodeled in this game.

 

but i agree with tha fact that the targeted planes make no evasive movement

[tank03 1]

Hi,

I seem to be having a lot of problems regarding air-to-air missiles in Wings Over Europe:

 

Even after downloading the latest weapons pack even the latest 'Fire & Forget' missiles seem to miss their targets quite often altough the target is locked and a shoot cue appears on the HUD...

 

Besides some AAM's seem to detonate immediately after launch and blow up my plane to smithereens

 

The most shocking part is that even the 'all aspect' heat seeking missiles like the AIM-9M Sidewinder, & later models and even the Rafael Python 3 & 4 seem to be very easily decieved by flares launched by their targets, which don't seem to make any evasive maneuvers... they just fly level and launch a couple of flares & Presto! they evade the missile...

 

Is there any way i can solve these problems?

 

Thanks...

 

Well, that's the purpose of the flares. What are your game settings in terms of weapon efffectiveness and A/I ability?

 

If the weapon is blowing up your own plane then I think something somewhere is amiss. The early A2A missiles were notoriously undependable, missing more often than not. But I've never encountered an issue where my own weapon was donwing my own plane. I'd use the Weapon Editor that came with the weapon pack and check out the setting of the weapon in question, maybe something got screwed up along the way. You can also use the editor to change the parameters for the various ordinance as well (lock on chance, range, FOV, ECM resistence, etc).

 

I'm sure some of the more knowledgable guys here will have some specific advice that could address your problem directly. Good luck.

Edited October 17, 2007 by tank03

[SkyStrike 15]

i always tought that these missils were overmodeled in this game.

 

but i agree with tha fact that the targeted planes make no evasive movement

 

Yeah.. but in many cases the missiles miss targets which do nothing more than fly straight & level and only launch countermeasures and besides,the latest Pythons & Sidewinders ane supposed to be the best 'all aspect' heat seeking missiles ever built...

 

Is there any way to fix this?

 

Thanks

[SkyStrike 15]

Well, that's the purpose of the flares. What are your game settings in terms of weapon efffectiveness and A/I ability?

 

If the weapon is blowing up your own plane then I think something somewhere is amiss. The early A2A missiles were notoriously undependable, missing more often than not. But I've never encountered an issue where my own weapon was donwing my own plane. I'd use the Weapon Editor that came with the weapon pack and check out the setting of the weapon in question, maybe something got screwed up along the way. You can also use the editor to change the parameters for the various ordinance as well (lock on chance, range, FOV, ECM resistence, etc).

 

I'm sure some of the more knowledgable guys here will have some specific advice that could address your problem directly. Good luck.

 

Thanks for your reply, My weapon effectiveness is set to full ('Easy' in the game) and the AI is set to 'Hard'.. but as i said earlier all they do is fly straight & level. I agree with you that early models of the Sidewinder were notoriously inaccurate, but the latest heat seekers like the new Sidewinders & Pythons have a high degree of resistance to countermeasures as you may already know.....

[JediMaster 451]

I think there is a known issue with CM effectiveness being too high, for chaff anyway, against any radar missiles no matter the type. Not so much flares, but perhaps a bit there as well.

 

With the explosions, maybe if you set your weapons down towards hard that wouldn't happen. I'm not sure what variable that affects, but if it's warhead size/blast radius it could explain why a missile detonating near you is taking you out. I admit I've never had my own take me down, but I've also never had it on full/easy.

[SayethWhaaaa 245]

Even after downloading the latest weapons pack even the latest 'Fire & Forget' missiles seem to miss their targets quite often altough the target is locked and a shoot cue appears on the HUD...

 

Yeah, I got screwed with that when I first installed the weaps pack years ago, but the thing I learned is that there aren't any 'fire and forget' sticks in the weaps pack. Some are much more effective than others (ie, the Aim-9x will crap on the Aim-9B) but if you're flying against aircraft equipped with Chaff/Flares, fact is that your missile has only a percentage chance of a hit, as opposed to fighting AI who don't have any cms.

 

As for aircraft flying in a straight line, well, if they're following a waypoint, they won't take evasive action. AFAIK it's a limit of the game engine. There's no way to curb the effectiveness of the chaff/flares, but one way to get around it is to specify how many are deployed at once. This way, your aircraft can keep the same number of flares, but only use them a small number of times. eg, say your Phantom can pack 48 chaff/flares, but it deploys 8 at a time. This way, it can only deploy cms 6 times in total and each time it does, it may be a little more effective than normal (might spoof 2, instead on 1 IRM) but in a furball it may use them a lot more and therefore run out quicker.

 

To be able to do this, just copy and past your cms from your ***data.ini (*** being the name of your plane) entries like so:

 

[Fuselage]

ModelNodeName=Fuselage

ShowFromCockpit=FALSE

HasAeroCoefficients=TRUE

CLa=0.1014

CD0=0.0059

Cmq=-0.3723

Cmad=0.0045

Cyb=-0.1014

CLaMachTableNumData=4

CLaMachTableDeltaX=0.40

CLaMachTableStartX=0.00

CLaMachTableData=1.000,1.000,1.000,0.782

CD0MachTableNumData=4

CD0MachTableDeltaX=0.40

CD0MachTableStartX=0.00

CD0MachTableData=1.600,1.000,0.918,37.689

CmqMachTableNumData=4

CmqMachTableDeltaX=0.40

CmqMachTableStartX=0.00

CmqMachTableData=1.000,1.000,1.000,23.468

MinExtentPosition= -0.82,-4.21,-0.74

MaxExtentPosition= 0.82, 3.86, 0.74

CollisionPoint[001]= 0.00,-4.06,-0.17

CollisionPoint[002]= 0.00,-0.96,-0.62

CollisionPoint[003]= 0.82, 3.50, 0.30

CollisionPoint[004]=-0.82, 3.50, 0.30

CollisionPoint[005]= 0.00,-4.41, 0.68

CollisionPoint[006]= 0.00, 2.96, 0.76

CollisionPoint[007]=-0.39,-4.00, 0.14

CollisionPoint[008]= 0.39, 4.00, 0.14

DamageRating=DESTROYED

SystemName[001]=Engine

SystemName[002]=CenterlineStation

SystemName[003]=FuselageFuelCell

SystemName[004]=LeftAirbrake

SystemName[005]=RightAirbrake

SystemName[006]=BottomRedLight

SystemName[007]=TopRedLight

SystemName[008]=Tailhook

SystemName[009]=LeftFlares <<--

SystemName[010]=RightFlares <<-- Make sure you have these subsystems in place first and in correct sequence

SystemName[011]=LeftChaffs <<--

SystemName[012]=RightChaffs <<--

SystemName[013]=ECM

 

 

Then in your ECM/CMs section, copy and paste the CMs

 

// ECM ---------------------------------------------------------

 

[LeftFlares]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition=-0.675,-2.21,0.592

EjectVelocity=--5.0,5.0,20.0 <<----------- Vary these numbers by one or two(or however much) at a time

NumFlare=40

NumChaff=40

MinExtentPosition=

MaxExtentPosition=

 

[RightFlares]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition=0.675,-2.21,0.592

EjectVelocity=5.0,-5.0,20.0

NumFlare=40

NumChaff=40

MinExtentPosition=

MaxExtentPosition=

 

[LeftChaffs]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition=-0.675,-1.161,0.592

EjectVelocity=-5.0,-5.0,20.0

NumFlare=40

NumChaff=40

MinExtentPosition=

MaxExtentPosition=

 

[RightChaffs]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition=0.675,-1.16,0.592

EjectVelocity=-5.0,5.0,20.0

NumFlare=40

NumChaff=40

MinExtentPosition=

MaxExtentPosition=

 

 

 

This way, I've been able to fight aircraft equipped with 40+ flares, but not with 40+ chances to spoof my missiles. The only major problem with this method is that you'd have to alter each aircraft individually.

[SayethWhaaaa 245]

With the explosions, maybe if you set your weapons down towards hard that wouldn't happen. I'm not sure what variable that affects, but if it's warhead size/blast radius it could explain why a missile detonating near you is taking you out.

 

I noticed that having edited missiles with reasonably large kill proximities (the distance your missile needs from its target before the warhead detonates) can be set off by your own aircraft. I had an R-73 variant do just that with a detonation proximity of 5m.

[Guifon 1]

I did this to resolve the problem with chaff/flares, just delete them from the aircraft, and play without chaff/flares.

[Fubar512 1,350]

Have you bothered to read the knowledge base? There is an entry there on this very subject.

 

I strongly urge all members not to respond to questions dealing with topics that are available on the knowledge base, simply point out where the solution to that particular issue can be found.

 

We did not take the time out of our lives to create, and update the knowledge base, simply for our own gratification.

[SkyStrike 15]

I did this to resolve the problem with chaff/flares, just delete them from the aircraft, and play without chaff/flares.

 

That would be rather un-sporting...However, i upgraded their guidance systems using the weapons editor & now they're reasonably accurate...,