How to fly the Mirage in WOI?

[Blond_Knight]

Im having some trouble during the Six day war campaign. Is the Mirage 3 an energy fighter, and not a turn fighter? Because it seems to bleed energy real fast in a turn.

[+JediMaster]

All delta winged fighters like the Mirages (excluding F1 of course), F-106, F-102, etc bleed energy in turns. It's a function of that huge wing acting like an airbrake when you pull high AOA. You must keep your speed up by limiting the number and duration of turns you make.

[+Johan217]

Im having some trouble during the Six day war campaign. Is the Mirage 3 an energy fighter, and not a turn fighter? Because it seems to bleed energy real fast in a turn.

Stay fast, i.e. 350 kts, more is even better. Use vertical turns rather than horizontal turns.

 

In reality, Israeli Mirage pilots flew low to maximize the advantage of the smoother behaviour of the airframe and better armament than the MiG-21s, but in the sim this is probably not a good idea ;)

[+Gr.Viper]

After dozens of stalls and slips in 6 day war I figured it out myself and started doing vertical turns and stopped pulling stick like crazy.

And if you got a ****load of MiGs on your tail don't try to make a nice big turn - hit the airbrakes, cut throttle, pull up. They usually miss their guns and don't have time for proper missile lock - then can't brake in time and slide right in your sights.

[+Johan217]

After dozens of stalls and slips in 6 day war I figured it out myself and started doing vertical turns and stopped pulling stick like crazy.

And if you got a ****load of MiGs on your tail don't try to make a nice big turn - hit the airbrakes, cut throttle, pull up. They usually miss their guns and don't have time for proper missile lock - then can't brake in time and slide right in your sights.

A tactic that appears to be historically accurate :)

The Israelis, on the other side, would in air combat use the large delta-wings of their Mirages as air breakes to execute very tight turns and point their aircraft at the opponent, followed by the use of the afterburner to accelerate back into the fight. Such turns were excellent measure against R-3S, but would usually also enable the Mirage to position behind the MiG. Besides, the theoretically dangerous use of the afterburner was not that much of a problem in a situation where enemy infra-red homing missiles were usually useless.

http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/article_263.shtml

 

According to the same article, the early MiG-21s did not have internal guns and the R-3S was very unreliable, especially at low altitudes. I don't know if this is actually modelled in the sim. In reality, the Egyptians began to use external gunpods after the Six Days War. Also, the AIM-9B was never used by Israel, and the first Sidewinders used were the AIM-9D when the Phantom entered service. This probably calls for some crafty ini editing...

[VapourLock]

Interesting little bit at the bottom of the 'Basic Principles' section of the article about Israel developing their own rails to carry AIM-9s on F-4's Sparrow stations - I'm sure someone posted a question about whether that was possible IRL just the other day..

Edited February 28, 2008 by VapourLock

[fougamagister]

Yes it's true that Mirage IIIs were not designed for dogfight, but for high altitude interception.

[+Johan217]

Yes it's true that Mirage IIIs were not designed for dogfight, but for high altitude interception.

All the more credit then to the Israeli pilots who flew these aircraft in a role it was not intended for, and were very successful at it too! Then again, the EAF pilots were also instructed at first to use their MiG-21 as high altitude interceptors. And while the IDF recieved the F-4, the Soviets could not deliver anything to counter it.

[lxsapper]

I think you will find this video very interesting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXFADxHNfK4...feature=related

 

See it from around 14m00s if you dont want to watch it all. But the Dogfight (they're Neshers and not Mirages but they are similar when it comes to fighting) I think all should see is arround 27m00s.

 

Very awsome piece of info at 19m45s.

 

See it all if you have the time and also Part1.

[gerald14]

All the more credit then to the Israeli pilots who flew these aircraft in a role it was not intended for, and were very successful at it too! Then again, the EAF pilots were also instructed at first to use their MiG-21 as high altitude interceptors. And while the IDF recieved the F-4, the Soviets could not deliver anything to counter it.

 

Not when the MIG-23MF & MS came into service in Syria after the war

F-4's had some trouble against those pups in air to air dogfight in June 11, 1982

and F-4's were shot down by AA-2 Atolls ( late models ).