F-14B with ThirdWire FM

[Caesar 305]

Good Evening, ALCON,

 

While reading the ThirdWire facebook page, I noticed a few people requesting an F-14B/D by ThirdWire. I doubt this is going to happen soon, if at all, however it got me to thinking, how would the ThirdWire flight model fare given F110-GE-400 engines? Rather than do a simple .ini edit, I wanted to see it on a proper model with a proper F-14B cockpit, loadout, etc. So, what I did was translated as much of the TW F-14's data.ini for the aerodynamic surfaces into a copy of the TMF F-14A+_87. Because all the parts do not directly translate (the TMF version has more definition for its flaps, spoilers, wings) I did my best to use everything that I could and found it actually handles fairly similarly to the TW Tomcat, but with the huge GE engines that give it better energy as they do in real life.

 

The point of posting this? I'd like to share the results of my test with the community and check for feedback. As it stands, there are still some issues. The Stabilators loose a lot of authority at the low 500's of KIAS, and then rebuild later. The roll rate is atrocious without unlocking the spoilers (nowhere near the real-world 180-200+ deg/sec rate they could get. Spectre had increased the effectiveness of the TMF stabs which fixed this issue for the most part, but using the "vanilla" stabs, the same problem arose) so those have been unlocked at above .9M. The flaps and slats are the same as the TMF F-14 because of the extra definitions that I haven't worked out yet - they work well as they are with the TW FM to be frank. I have not been able to check this against the charts as of yet.

 

Original sources for the FM are ThirdWire, Column5 and Spectre8750. This was based on the TMF F-14A+_87 from the Super Pack with both April 2012 avionics and FM updates (though the FM will be replaced, the other updates might affect gameplay). To install, copy your F-14A+_87 folder and re-name F-14B_Trans (for "Translation"). Drop the contents of F-14B_Trans.7z into the folder (will be an F-14B_Trans.ini and F-14BTrans_Data.ini). This concept was tested at May 2012 patch levels.

 

Positives? Negatives? Death threats? Well, maybe not that. I'd like to hear it.

 

F-14B_Trans.7z

[+eburger68 201]

Caesar:

 

The same configuration (3Wflight model on the F-14A+) is available in the ODS for SF2 mod as an optional install. See the \Optional folder included in the first package.

 

I think it works just fine. In fact, I prefer the the 3W flight model on the A as well as the A+/B.

 

Eric Howes

[+EricJ 4,199]

Much better, I'd suggest adding this to the Super Pack, first time in the Tomcat and felt like I was flying it like I've seen it.

[Caesar 305]

Caesar:

 

The same configuration (3Wflight model on the F-14A+) is available in the ODS for SF2 mod as an optional install. See the \Optional folder included in the first package.

 

I think it works just fine. In fact, I prefer the the 3W flight model on the A as well as the A+/B.

 

Eric Howes

 

Huh, didn't know that, actually!

 

EDIT: Will download and check out.

 

EDIT 2: Checked out, doesn't seem to fully agree with the Super Pack (that is, some of the loadouts are changed and whatnot) so I am going to keep at tweaking this FM for potential release specifically for the SP. Thank you for bringing it to my attention though! Will check more on the stabs and departure characteristics in the near future...

Edited June 26, 2012 by Caesar

[+eburger68 201]

Caesar:

 

You wrote:

 

EDIT 2: Checked out, doesn't seem to fully agree with the Super Pack (that is, some of the loadouts are changed and whatnot)

 

Yes, I reordered the weapon stations to put the AIM-54s first. Result: the AI pilots expend those first instead of the AIM-7s, which means you generally don't see AI pilots wasting AIM-54s at ranges under 20 nm.

 

You'll also notice that I didn't use the TMF data on the control surfaces. I set them up to use the ThirdWire data exclusively.

 

Eric Howes

[Caesar 305]

Result: the AI pilots expend those first instead of the AIM-7s, which means you generally don't see AI pilots wasting AIM-54s at ranges under 20 nm.

 

You'll also notice that I didn't use the TMF data on the control surfaces. I set them up to use the ThirdWire data exclusively.

 

 

I never ran into that issue before; normally if I have my AI F-14's using AIM-54's they'll ripple fire them at long range before switching to Sparrow. When did that start surfacing?

 

I did notice you did a complete translation of the TW data; so I guess I should rename this test one as a "hybrid." The only surfaces I kept from the TMF Combined FM are the Flaps, Slats and Spoilers, and the aircraft handles similarly, slightly better roll rate, closer to the 180 deg/sec at cruise speed limited by Roll SAS without as much nose drop at slow speeds. Rudders, stabs, wings, fuselage, nose, etc. are from the TW bird.

 

While tweaking I've been checking the charts and the F-14 never dips to a point where it can't reach/exceed its 6.5g limit in the high 4-low 500's KIAS like the TW bird (even at light weight, I've noticed with my beta FM using TW control surfaces it will drop to about 5.2 max g, which puts a real wrench in sustaining a 7g turn against an opponent!) Will keep experimenting with this.

 

EDIT: Adjusted two values per stab in the CL0 Mach table to increase the stabs effectiveness at the affected region of flight; adds about 1.2g of authority at the "bottom" of that region, so you will be able to maintain at least a 7g pull in this region of the flight envelope.) The aircraft feels otherwise identical, it just doesn't droop below 6g at 5,000 feet with maximum available deflection at around .87-.92M. Check out if you'd like.

 

F-14B_Trans.7z

Edited June 27, 2012 by Caesar

[Romflyer 25]

Hello Ceasar

 

A few days back there was a thread about the HSI in the new Vipers http://combatace.com/topic/73262-new-vipers/ through the conversation about that topic it came up that the TMF F-14 had a similar issue with it`s HSD.......Just wondering if you had any thoughts on this? or if you wouldnt mind looking into it.

 

 

Cheers

Romflyer

[+HomeFries 29]

Not to completely pile on here, but I'm just passing this on so all changes are made by the same source.

 

While researching stuff for the EA-6B, I saw that the ALQ-126B in the Tomcats use the line "DualMode=1". Per Fubar512, the correct entry should be "JammerType=Dual_Mode_Jammer" instead of "Deceptive_Jammer", and the DualMode=1 can be removed.

[Caesar 305]

HomeFries,

 

Copy that, will start coordinating with the SP team to make that general update for F-14A/B/D.

 

Romflyer,

 

Yes, I did see that; I think the pit will wind up being updated, but IIRC that required a .max file update. Last I knew, the .max file has been sent to one of the cockpit gurus, so the update is a WIP. If it can be done with an .ini edit, it would be easy for me to do.

 

Thanks for the feedback, folks!

[+SupGen 79]

Yeah Caesar, Ravenclaw's got the Tomcat pit Max files, he said he could fix it, but it might take some time.(Two weeks?)

[Caesar 305]

OK, gang, here's a general update. This is the still-beta version of the FM applied to all F-14's (A/B/D). Also includes changes to the jammers (dual mode). If you'd like to test, back up your data.ini's and copy over with the beta. Cockpit fix is not part of this (like what was stated, 2 weeks!)

 

June 2012 Update.7z