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Dave

Official Lock On: Flaming Cliffs 3 Trailer

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Flanker has come a long way. I never had Flanker, but I have LOMAC/FC/FC2/FC3. Love the direction the game is going and pretty darn happy with where it is now, especially since my hardware can run it pretty well. Bring on the AFMs for the F-15C and Su-27! Provide AFM upgrades for all the FC3 aircraft and continue to refine/improve the missile AFMs, and FC3 will be near perfect for my purposes. Of course, I will be happier with DCS:F-15C and DCS:Su-27. My flying rotation is pretty steady between UH-1H, P-51D, and the FC3 F-15C. SF2 is getting almost no time right now. I need to take the time to map the Su-27 controls to my stick/throttle, then I will put it into the rotation. The upcoming AFM upgrade will probably motivate me to get it working sooner rather than later. Can't wait to try the F-15C and Su-27 at the edges of the envelope: high AoA at subsonic speeds. I would also like decently modeled taxi/takeoffs/landings.

Edited by streakeagle

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Flanker 1 was a long way from LOMAC. For one, it was the only one of their sims to model only a single airframe. F2 introduced the Su-33 and F2.5 the MiG-29K (which oddly has yet to return in any form).

 

F1 was one of the first Win95-native flight sims, and I think that hurt its adoption as there were a LOT of Luddite flight simmers that refused to give up DOS then. Honestly, Win98SE was the first really good consumer WinOS, so I don't blame them per se, but they missed it as a result.

I'd say the best thing about it was its feel of flight. It had what seemed an AFM in a time when no one else did. F3 was old and F4 had been delayed, and nothing else challenged it until 1998 I'd say.

 

Worst thing? Easy, the UI! :grin: Also, there were no comms in the pit, so the world felt a bit sterile, and it was HARD. Still, I liked it enough to buy F2 and that was really a LOMAC predecessor. Play F2 and LOMAC and you'll see the lineage.

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But I don't want to see the lineage... I want the end result. Unfortunately, DCS is far from complete and it will be quite some time before I really see the end results I really want. But the UH-1H, P-51D, and MiG-21bis are a great start. Mi-8, Fw 190D-9, and F-4 are good compliments for those three. Having several major DCS level variants of the F-4 and MiG-21 and the historically correct environments would be perfect.

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If you think we'll see DCS: F-4E and DCS: F-4J and DCS: F-4S, you're dreaming!

We will get one of those if we're lucky. Maybe we'll get a couple FC-level variants in a Vietnam-themed area.

 

But at the rate it takes to make these things, there's no way we'll see DCS level planes in the numbers and variety of an SF2 sim. A-4A, B, C, E, F, G, H, and numerous subvariants, even done to FC levels is pretty much not going to happen. Maybe we'll see one A-4 at some point. We've got the UH-1H, but I can guarantee you there's no UH-1S or Y or any other coming.

 

The market won't support it. To have more than one variant of a plane, there will need to be a big difference, and it will have to be very popular to boot like the F-15C and E.

 

ED has stated that FC titles have outsold the DCS ones by a significant amount. There's no way they're going to neglect the money market for lower-selling niche releases alone, and same with the 3rd party devs. Some may do one as a labor of love, but who's going to spend weeks and weeks making another F-4 that will sell 1/3 as many copies (because having one DCS F-4 will be "good enough")?

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I just got into DCS even if I purchased A-10C and Black Shark 1 on Steam like a year ago when they were on sale, and I must say the flying is very impressive so far. Only got DCS:W with the A-10C so far and the training has kept me busy. The MiG-21Bis is looking like my most likely next sale along with the stand alone F-15C and Su-27.

 

I am liking the fact that we get more Cold war era stuff, but the real money question is that who is going to make all the misc. AI planes needed to make realistic Cold War scenarios?

 

However, even if we get a player flyable F-4 and F-104 someday and we have the MiG-21, and Bezl (sp?) decides to make the MiG-23 and Su-22 (mentioned on the ED forums) who is going to make the non-flyable MiG-21F-13/PF/PFM/MF/SM etc, the A-4s, the F-100s, the older MiGs, the F-16As and so on?

Will...

1) the ED graphics team make all the AI flyables for free like the Fw190?

2) 3rd party devs make AI planes? And if so how will these be financed since they will need to be integrated to the free DCS:W?

3) modders make AI planes that get integrated for free into the free DCS:W?

4) there be "Era packs" that cost money that include AI flyables?

5) there be FC level packs of flyables modeled to lower standards that sale as a bundle?

 

And this is not even mentioning Korean war or WW2....

 

If DCS:W is going to be the combat sim to end all combat sims these q's will need answers. Nevertheless, I am happy to play DCS when I want to do modern air war.

 

Nevertheless, if there was a project, non-profit or profit, that stated that they want to make DCS: F-4E/F-8/Draken/Viggen I'd jump on that bandwagon. What DCS now needs is more devs. If you can accept a business model where talented people make aircraft for little or no profit as a spare time thing (kinda like modding) I think it will be for the betterment of all.

 

Sorry for the rant but this has actually occupied a rather large portion of my mind since discovering DCS..

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I don't think many of those questions have been publicly decided one way or another. My hope is many of the AI-only planes will be created by the modding community as free additions to give us more to fight with/against.

Right now, every non-flyable seems to be ED's AOR.

 

I can't imagine anyone paying for planes you can't fly, but they could be bundled in with flyables (as SF1/2 did it) to offset the cost of making them, and perhaps later on the work done on the 3d model and basic capabilities could be offset by making it into a flyable that could then be charged for.

So perhaps we'll see an AI P-47 and then a year or two later get it as a flyable (either DCS or FC level, or even in-between as some have claimed to be doing).

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