General Newbie Flight

[SCUBAdevine]

I'm not very new to sims, but new to WOV. I've been playing IL2 for years and that supposedly has a very good flight model. I can fly fine in IL2, but in WOV, when I try to fly the F4, it seems like whenever I move the stick it just stalls out and doesn't move. I know the F4 wasn't a turning fighter, but it seems like it doesn't turn at ALL. I'm being gentle with the stick... trying to keep my speed up... I dont know! ARGH!!! It's got to be something I'm doing wrong... i know it isn't the game, because if it was none of you would be playing it! Any general flight tips would help. THANKS!!

[Guest Saganuay82]

What are your settings for flight model? What is your sliders at for your joystick?

[+Fubar512]

SCUBAdevine,

 

You're using the default non-third party SF/WoV F-4? If so, then it sounds to me like:

 

A) You're flying well below it's corner speed (about 400-450 knots IAS). That's a real NO-NO in any Phantom variant.

 

B) You're trying to perform a hard break with a load of bombs or drop tanks, and a full "bag" of fuel. Remember, the F-4 can easily carry a heavier bomb load than a B-17...but it cannot do so and be expected to maneuver to any degree.

 

If you want to feel what the F-4 was really all about, try the B-model with Streakeagle's data.ini, and engage a few MiG-21s. You'll gain an appreciation as to what it took to fly that beast in real life, afterwords :)

[SCUBAdevine]

What are your settings for flight model? What is your sliders at for your joystick?

Well, I was using the "hard" flight model. I was finding that if I was pulling back on the stick, I couldn't roll at the same time. Also felt that I'd stall very easily. I switched the flight model to normal and it seems a lot better... But now, I feel like less of a man. :)

 

I'm not sure what you mean by where my sliders are at, but I have an X52. So if you're familiar with that, maybe you could tell me where they should be.

 

SCUBAdevine,

 

You're using the default non-third party SF/WoV F-4? If so, then it sounds to me like:

 

A) You're flying well below it's corner speed (about 400-450 knots IAS). That's a real NO-NO in any Phantom variant.

 

B) You're trying to perform a hard break with a load of bombs or drop tanks, and a full "bag" of fuel. Remember, the F-4 can easily carry a heavier bomb load than a B-17...but it cannot do so and be expected to maneuver to any degree.

 

If you want to feel what the F-4 was really all about, try the B-model with Streakeagle's data.ini, and engage a few MiG-21s. You'll gain an appreciation as to what it took to fly that beast in real life, afterwords :)

 

 

Where can I get Streakeagles data.ini? and when i do, what do i do with it?

[+Fubar512]

Place the F-4B_DATA.ini file in your Objects/Aircraft/F-4B folder, and then try the F-4B on hard settings. This was verified as being accurate by comparison against published data, and also, by a real-life F-4B driver.

 

F-4B DATA INI FILE

[SCUBAdevine]

Place the F-4B_DATA.ini file in your Objects/Aircraft/F-4B folder, and then try the F-4B on hard settings. This was verified as being accurate by comparison against published data, and also, by a real-life F-4B driver.

 

F-4B DATA INI FILE

i'll try it, thanks!

[robert]

hi fubar512,my f-4b disappeared from the list of planes in game selection,could you help me restore the plane?

[Guest Saganuay82]

If the F-4B disappeared then have a look at the folder name, the data.ini and the ini to make sure that all the names match. That could be it.

 

New sigblock for you to fix the F-15 image.

[+Fubar512]

hi fubar512,my f-4b disappeared from the list of planes in game selection,could you help me restore the plane?

 

Open the F-4B folder (in the Objects/Aircraft/F-4B folder) and make sure that it contains a file named "F-4B.ini". If it's there, open it with notepad, and make sure that it contains the following data:

 

AircraftFullName=F-4B Phantom II

AircraftDataFile=F-4B_data.ini

CockpitDataFile=F-4B_cockpit.ini

HangarScreen=F-4B_hangar.bmp

LoadoutImage=F-4B_loadout.bmp

LoadoutFile=F-4B_loadout.ini

AvionicsDLL=Avionics60.dll

AvionicsDataFilename=F-4B_avionics.ini

 

[LOD001]

Filename=F-4B.lod

Distance=100

 

[LOD002]

Filename=F-4b_lod002.lod

Distance=250

 

[LOD003]

Filename=F-4b_lod003.lod

Distance=500

 

[LOD004]

Filename=F-4b_lod004.lod

Distance=1000

 

[LOD005]

Filename=F-4b_lod005.lod

Distance=8000

 

[shadow]

CastShadow=TRUE

ShadowLOD=F-4b_shadow.shd

ShadowType=1

ShadowCastDist=10000

MaxVisibleDistance=400

 

[DamageTexture]

DamagedPostFix=_holes.tga

DestroyedPostFix=_shredded.tga

 

[TextureSet001]

Directory=USNGrey1

Name=USN Grey

Nation=USN

Squadron=VF84

Specular=0.300000

Glossiness=0.750000

Reflection=0.000000

 

[TextureSet002]

Directory=USMCGrey1

Name=USMC Grey

Nation=USMC

Squadron=VMFA531

Specular=0.300000

Glossiness=0.750000

Reflection=0.000000

[robert]

it was really weird,this part was missing:

AircraftFullName=F-4B Phantom II

AircraftDataFile=F-4B_data.ini

CockpitDataFile=F-4B_cockpit.ini

HangarScreen=F-4B_hangar.bmp

LoadoutImage=F-4B_loadout.bmp

LoadoutFile=F-4B_loadout.ini

AvionicsDLL=Avionics60.dll

AvionicsDataFilename=F-4B_avionics.ini

 

and when i added this lines to the f-4b.ini and saved it,there was no problem.

but once again at list planes still the plane was missing.

i returned back to the f-4b.ini and the lines i added was gone.

 

i opened the extract utility and took the f-4b.ini from there and copied the file over the problematic folder,the problem was solved.

 

anyway thanks alot for the aim to solve the problem and Saganuay82 thanks alot to you for the marvelous signature,your'e a sure talent.

[Guest Saganuay82]

Thanks for the comment. What does it say on the nose?

[robert]

Thanks for the comment. What does it say on the nose?

commando=קומנדו

every fighter jet in the idf gets a different name as you notice,there are some interesting names on those f-15's squadrons. ;)

[Guest Saganuay82]

Cool thanks

[+Fubar512]

i opened the extract utility and took the f-4b.ini from there and copied the file over the problematic folder,the problem was solved.

 

anyway thanks alot for the aim to solve the problem and Saganuay82 thanks alot to you for the marvelous signature,your'e a sure talent.

 

Robert, you are a real trip, my friend. I suspect that someday soon, you'll be the one solving all our SF issues

 

BTW, I've disovered the problem with the SA-3 Static launchers, and I'm working on a solution.

[+streakeagle]

Well, I was using the "hard" flight model. I was finding that if I was pulling back on the stick, I couldn't roll at the same time. Also felt that I'd stall very easily. I switched the flight model to normal and it seems a lot better... But now, I feel like less of a man. :)

 

I'm not sure what you mean by where my sliders are at, but I have an X52. So if you're familiar with that, maybe you could tell me where they should be.

Where can I get Streakeagles data.ini? and when i do, what do i do with it?

 

At high AoA, the F-4 requires use of rudder to roll. This is correct behaviour. In reality, any attempt to use ailerons to roll at high AoA would result in a departure, frequently unrecoverable. If you think the stock FM is hard, then you will find my FM almost impossible. The stock FM is much more forgiving and permits considerably better turn performance. The key to flying on "Hard" settings with stock FMs is to listen for the wind noise and watch for vibration that indicates the onset of a stall. If you keep your AoA (angle of attack) at or below this stall point, you will maneuver just fine. At higher AoA, your wing doesn't produce any more lift, but becomes a speedbrake, then as the speed bleeds, so does your lift.

 

With my F-4B FM, the stall starts at much lower AoA and you must go deep into the buffet to get max performance per documented F-4 performance. But once you cross a certain angle, it behaves just like the stock FM: no more lift and huge speedbrake. With my flight model, you can tell you have reached the max performance AoA by looking at the AoA indicator. If the needle is in the white area you are doing fine. If the needle goes much past that area, you are probably approaching departure/speedbrake limits.

 

Good luck with learning the F-4. If you think it is difficult to fly in a dogfight, try the F-104 or F-105 ;)

[robert]

Robert, you are a real trip, my friend. I suspect that someday soon, you'll be the one solving all our SF issues

 

BTW, I've disovered the problem with the SA-3 Static launchers, and I'm working on a solution.

you know how it is someone have to do the hard work

who knows maybe one day i'll post a new plane?

anyway i'm looking forward to see at last those naughty sa-3's on their launchers.i'm sure it will be very soon if your'e responsible to solve this problem.

anyway thanks again for your help and goodluck on the new weaponpack.

[SCUBAdevine]

At high AoA, the F-4 requires use of rudder to roll. This is correct behaviour. In reality, any attempt to use ailerons to roll at high AoA would result in a departure, frequently unrecoverable. If you think the stock FM is hard, then you will find my FM almost impossible. The stock FM is much more forgiving and permits considerably better turn performance. The key to flying on "Hard" settings with stock FMs is to listen for the wind noise and watch for vibration that indicates the onset of a stall. If you keep your AoA (angle of attack) at or below this stall point, you will maneuver just fine. At higher AoA, your wing doesn't produce any more lift, but becomes a speedbrake, then as the speed bleeds, so does your lift.

 

With my F-4B FM, the stall starts at much lower AoA and you must go deep into the buffet to get max performance per documented F-4 performance. But once you cross a certain angle, it behaves just like the stock FM: no more lift and huge speedbrake. With my flight model, you can tell you have reached the max performance AoA by looking at the AoA indicator. If the needle is in the white area you are doing fine. If the needle goes much past that area, you are probably approaching departure/speedbrake limits.

 

Good luck with learning the F-4. If you think it is difficult to fly in a dogfight, try the F-104 or F-105 ;)

How come I don't have the F-104? Shouldn't that have come with the game?

[+BUFF]

How come I don't have the F-104? Shouldn't that have come with the game?

WOV does not include the Third Wire F-104G (too late a model for the few F-104s that served in Vietnam).

It's in SF P1 & as a downloadable addon for SF Gold.

 

There are earlier models available as 3rd party addons.