Racing sims discussion?

[Revvin 1]

I've seen Fates mention his G25 Wheel and rFactor, does anyone else play racing sims? maybe there could be a racing sims forum to discuss them? The racign sim genre has been blessed with a few good titles in the past few years including GT Legends, GTR2, Live For Speed, RACE, rFactor and netKar Pro. At the moment I have all those sims installed and a few months ago I bought a Logitech G25 which replaced my trusty Logitech MOMO Force wheel. I also play Forza Motorsport 2 on my Xbox 360 and I'm considering the MS wireless 360 wheel as Logitech say the G25 will never be compatible with the 360 - worst luck. Some links to the sims mentioned above if anyone has any interest in picking up a racing sim:

 

GT Legends - 60's and 70's era GT cars (protected by Starforce for those concerned with that copy protection)

GTR2 - 2003 and 2004 season FIA GT class cars

Live For Speed - Online racing sim, fantasy cars and tracks based on real world cars, lots of fun online

RACE - WTCC (World Touring Car Championship) season 2006 racing sim

rFactor - The Strike Fighters of the racing sim world, fantasy cars and tracks but built for mod making

netKar Pro - Fantasy cars and tracks, still maturing but looks great, very realistic handling with clickable cockpits

 

Demo's of those games can be found on their respective sites above

 

This is the latest wheel from Logitech - the 'G25' it features a three pedal set with a leather wheel and a H-pattern shifter which can be switched to operate as a sequential shifter. Generally I play rFactor the most out of all of those sims as I said above its like the Strike Fighters of the racing sim world because it has hundreds of mods available from tracks, to cars to whole racing series created by a large mod community. By far the best (IMO) web-site to find those mods is rFactor Central.

Edited July 14, 2007 by Revvin

[Dagger 21]

I race Nascar 2003 season.running the superspeedway.net mod and a COT mod. even like the trucks.I just use a generic wheel,maybe some day a G25 wheel for me.heres my cars and my truck.

[Revvin 1]

Nice work on those cars Dagger, I played Nascar 2003 but never played it seriously in a league. A few people I do know who have raced GPL and Nascar 2003 think very highly of the GP'79 mod and TPSCC's Stock car mod for rFactor, ISI added new content for stock car rules and physics in a patch some time ago.

[Dagger 21]

been giving that one some thought.but I am having way to much fun with this one.we had 20 people working a draft at Daytona for over 30 laps,then"The BIG ONE"hit..it was ulgy but fun.and the worst part was it was actually an AI car that started it.

[FOTF 0]

I used to be a very active member of the race sim modding community for EA's F1 series. Now I just race and paint cars for GTR2 and GTL

[Revvin 1]

rFactor's online code is the best I've tried in a sim so far though its great modding potential is also a downfall as it can be sometimes difficult to keep up with mods and that can cause mismatch errors when trying to play online though if you play with a group often you know what files you need. I have always enjoyed the GTR series since its mod days in EA's F1 sims but although its got a nice set of cars and tracks that is also starting to get well modded. A good thing in some ways but like rFactor it can be difficult to make sure you have the right versions. There is something to be said for the more closed file system used by Live For Speed and RACE, at least when I go online with those I know I have everything I need to be compatible with the host server.

[eraser_tr 29]

I drive GT Legends and GTR2...I plan on getting rFactor sometime soon. The only thing about rFactor is all the mods are in race series and teams. I'd like to just download cars, street and race versions like planes for SF.

 

I'm in a tough spot with tastes. I love the exotic street cars you find in the more arcade games like Need for Speed, but I have a strong preference towards realism and modability (and I really refuse to touch a gamepad and console for that matter)

 

Live for Speed looks interesting, but I still suck too much to play online and not have any aides

[FOTF 0]

Here is some of my GTR2 cars....

 

[Revvin 1]

Nice work Paul! I'm not that gifted when it comes to painting cars though I have made a few personal skins for LFS but nothing even close to the level of detail of those cars you painted.

 

Eraser> Its a shame you won't touch consoles as it sounds like Forza Motorsport 2 would be just the thing for you. Its not arcadey and holds up well against the PC sims out there. There are 300 cars modelled which are mainly production models you can tune up with a few car classes covering racing spec cars. With the street cars you can buy aftermarket add-ons for the engine, brakes, ignition systems and many other parts to improve performance and handling.

[eraser_tr 29]

Well modding is a deciding factor for my purchase of a game, so that automatically disqualifies them....and I'm ethically opposed to taking brilliant PC series and making them on consoles and porting them back to their home platform in a lame castrated form( see rainbow six or halo)

 

Would rFactor support non lapped tracks? ie drag racing or roads? I know you can do circuits that are decorated like roads. Another of my unrealistically huge mod ideas was doing a simulation need for speed mod, the cars and tracks from the series, but with realism that would satisfy rivet counters.

 

I also see the G25 has dropped in price. Maybe by this christmas it'll be affordable for me.

[Revvin 1]

Would rFactor support non lapped tracks? ie drag racing or roads? I know you can do circuits that are decorated like roads. Another of my unrealistically huge mod ideas was doing a simulation need for speed mod, the cars and tracks from the series, but with realism that would satisfy rivet counters.

 

I also see the G25 has dropped in price. Maybe by this christmas it'll be affordable for me.

 

Yes there are a few tracks made to look like roads though they all seem to be extremely large circuits, there are a few production car mods out there, they can be found here. The mod scene is a potential minefield, I don't know how the F1 mods have slipped under Bernie Ecclestone's radar but glad they have so to cover some of the production car manufacturers might be possible if you can avoid the gaze of the corporate lawyers.

 

IMO the G25 is the best off the shelf wheel money can buy. I thought my old MOMO Force was good but this is on another level and well worth the price, even better if you can get it cheaper now.

[eraser_tr 29]

The same could be said about lawyers for Aerospace companies, but that doesn't stop the Mirage factory

 

Ultimately adding a car to a game 3rd party falls under fair use so long as the maker isn't making a profit.

[Revvin 1]

Hmm I'm not so sure about that, the owners of the A1GP series stopped a free mod as did the British Touring Car Championship. I think the racing sim genre gets hammered more as traditionally racing series have licensed themselves where as the aerospace companies have never enforced it apart from Northrop Grumman with Pacific Fighters. Car makers have a product to sell to the general public so they have an image to protect so they want tight control over anything that bears their name.

[eraser_tr 29]

Eh thats because the mod makers got scared and don't fight it, and thats what they bet on. Like a crooked mechanic getting away with phoney charges because people don't question the bill.

[Revvin 1]

I think its a different culture in the racing sim mod scene because they know historically you have had to seek a license because they have a product very relevant to the general public and need to protect that products image. I'm not saying the aircraft companies don't have an image to product butthey don't sell to a fickle general public so are likely to be less inclined to shut down a mod. I don't think its a question of fighting, you have to respect the IP owners decison if you ask for permission.

 

Getting a little side tracked here though, have you tried the Live For Speed demo? that has cars whose performance is closer to real production cars although they also have racing variants of those cars too. I was a little worried about jumping into an online server but did so and as long as you don't cause huge wrecks the community online is friendly enough. It did'nt take me long to win a few races and a lot of the fast drivers will happily share their setups which is another good feature LFS has - the ability to send someone your setup while online, I can't remember if GTR2 allows that?

[gopher66ca 0]

I actually have rFactor and Live for Speed both. Each decidedly quirky in their own way, on the whole, not terribly impressed, particularly with on line play although LFS in particular has great frame rates still online. Depends whom you drive with I suppose and how serious you are about it.

 

I still use Nascar Racing 2003 (not online) and enjoy that still, the biggie right now is still (you will roll your eyes, ...) formula 1 challenge 99-02 with the prototype C mod up to I think 1.4 or 1.41 now, can't remember. This one gives me everything I want and the mod is available now in one roughly 700 mb download . I still think this one is the best thing going.

 

gopher66ca

[FOTF 0]

Nice work Paul! I'm not that gifted when it comes to painting cars though I have made a few personal skins for LFS but nothing even close to the level of detail of those cars you painted.

 

Thanks Revvin. I paint just about everything, but Porsches always seem to come out the best.

 

I served as team lead on the Porsche Supercup mod for F1C, so I have been doing Porsches since I started modding

[FOTF 0]

I've seen Fates mention his G25 Wheel and rFactor, does anyone else play racing sims? maybe there could be a racing sims forum to discuss them? The racign sim genre has been blessed with a few good titles in the past few years including GT Legends, GTR2, Live For Speed, RACE, rFactor and netKar Pro. At the moment I have all those sims installed and a few months ago I bought a Logitech G25 which replaced my trusty Logitech MOMO Force wheel. I also play Forza Motorsport 2 on my Xbox 360 and I'm considering the MS wireless 360 wheel as Logitech say the G25 will never be compatible with the 360 - worst luck. Some links to the sims mentioned above if anyone has any interest in picking up a racing sim:

 

GT Legends - 60's and 70's era GT cars (protected by Starforce for those concerned with that copy protection)

GTR2 - 2003 and 2004 season FIA GT class cars

Live For Speed - Online racing sim, fantasy cars and tracks based on real world cars, lots of fun online

RACE - WTCC (World Touring Car Championship) season 2006 racing sim

rFactor - The Strike Fighters of the racing sim world, fantasy cars and tracks but built for mod making

netKar Pro - Fantasy cars and tracks, still maturing but looks great, very realistic handling with clickable cockpits

 

Demo's of those games can be found on their respective sites above

 

This is the latest wheel from Logitech - the 'G25' it features a three pedal set with a leather wheel and a H-pattern shifter which can be switched to operate as a sequential shifter. Generally I play rFactor the most out of all of those sims as I said above its like the Strike Fighters of the racing sim world because it has hundreds of mods available from tracks, to cars to whole racing series created by a large mod community. By far the best (IMO) web-site to find those mods is rFactor Central.

 

Something to add to your list of stuff worth checking out.....Simbin just released a Caterham 7 expansion via steam. Also, looks like RACE 2007 will include both Formula cars (FBMW) and sports cars, and of course the touring cars...they are saying over 300 cars in 9 classes on 32 tracks...sounds awesome

[JediMaster 451]

I might get RACE 2007 then. I skipped 2006 because people I knew told me it didn't really offer much that was different from GTR2 or rFactor.

I have both of those, plus GTL and of course the old reliable, GPL, installed right now.

I have F1C and NASCAR 2003 lying around, but not installed. I barely touch any but rFactor right now anyway.

[Revvin 1]

Something to add to your list of stuff worth checking out.....Simbin just released a Caterham 7 expansion via steam. Also, looks like RACE 2007 will include both Formula cars (FBMW) and sports cars, and of course the touring cars...they are saying over 300 cars in 9 classes on 32 tracks...sounds awesome

 

Yes it was released a few weeks ago for free on Steam for a limited time only and then as a paid add-on (but still only a few $ ) It doesn't seem clear whether RACE 2007 will use the ISI engine again or Simbin's own Lizard engine but the extra cars sounds great. Its a shame RACE is not more widely used, a lot of people were put off by the fact it uses Steam and that the files are encrypted making modding impossible but for me thats one of its strong points that I can go online and know I won't have any mismatches. If its mods I want then I have rFactor and GTR 2.

[Revvin 1]

I've just seen this thread at the Xbox forums about having an F1 game for the Xbox and someone has posted (how true this is) that ex members of the Sony Studio in Liverpool have been on the PS3 forums saying that Sony is not seeking to renew the license due to the cost and that EA is in the driving seat (if you can excuse the pun) to secure a new deal.

[+{FL}Hausser 0]

The FSOne 2006 - 2007 mod for RFactor has recieved some tremendous reviews from many in the sim racing community. It is actually the only F1 style mod I have driven, enjoiy and get a true sense of an F1 car from. I am a hardcore Rfactor fan and judge it to be one of the best out there. When RFactor 2 is released it will push it even further as the second version will feature changeable weather in addition to all the great features already in RFactor.

 

Take that into consideration as well as the fact that many of the upcoming mods. This includes the Le Mans and Extreme Sports Car mods have actual series drivers doing the testing for the mods. RFactor may very well be a leading force in Sim Racing. The biggest problem with RFactor is some of the half put together mods that are released. You do need to have a discerning eye for some of the mods.

Edited July 16, 2007 by {FL}Hausser

[Revvin 1]

The FSOne mod is excellent, I also found CTDP's F1 2005 mod very good. My favourite open wheeler mod is the Formula BMW mod, as Paul pointed out earlier in this thread Simbin will also create this racing series for RACE 2007 so it will be interesting to compare the two versions. Previously I also enjoyed the Euro F3 mod which was one of the earliest available for rFactor and set the benchmark for mods IMHO. As you pointed out mods vary in quality quite a lot which is why I use rFactor Central as a kind of benchmark, although a lot of good mods are not in that sites 'Hall of Fame' its a good starting point and you get an idea of which mod teams produce quality mods.

 

So how about a racing sim forum? would anyone else like a small spot to discuss them? Would the CombatAce mods consider it please?

[+Fates 63]

I've just seen this thread at the Xbox forums about having an F1 game for the Xbox and someone has posted (how true this is) that ex members of the Sony Studio in Liverpool have been on the PS3 forums saying that Sony is not seeking to renew the license due to the cost and that EA is in the driving seat (if you can excuse the pun) to secure a new deal.

LMAO. Ecclestein probably wanted $10 Million from Sony just to allow them to make it. He's brought the series back from it's decline in the last 20 years, but it will be sad to lose the US, England and France over "I WANT MORE MONEY" bickering.

 

 

I think its a different culture in the racing sim mod scene because they know historically you have had to seek a license because they have a product very relevant to the general public and need to protect that products image.

The only thing F1 can protect, IMHO, is their trademark, and even UK won't allow that. LOL. You can create a FANTASY series called Formula2 with identical cars, even the same sponsors on them (I don't think the sponsors will mind free advertising) and release it as a mod on the same tracks.....don't see any infringment there....F1 doesn't OWN the tracks..and F1 doesn't own the car manufactures....besides, all the mods are interpretation of design and not 100% accurate....such as bumps, angles, radius, etc..etc...etc.. If they want to release a game with their stamp on it...let them, but when a game like rFactor is released, I simply can't see them doing anything about it as long as you are not trying to use their F1 Logo to promote it's sale.

 

By far the best (IMO) web-site to find those mods is rFactor Central.

My biggest dissapointment with rFactorCentral is the lack of file hosting. It's an incredible site for that game, and the contributions and editors do an outstanding job.

 

So how about a racing sim forum? would anyone else like a small spot to discuss them? Would the CombatAce mods consider it please?

It is being talked about and considered. I've added a forum on Paul's FOTF section under Modding Community so he can share his work and mods.

[eraser_tr 29]

It wouldn't quite go with the name of the site, but what the hell. It'd also be great to centralize a download location for usually pretty scattered games.

 

With that in mind, I also play a space combat/strategy game, X3 Reunion that would fit in the scifi section. And would benefit from an organized downloading site. Currently to find a mod or even individual ships and scripts, you have no choice but to scroung through tons of forums for links people post.