Nesher 628 Posted November 4, 2003 just see the Israeli side although I personaly know that most Americans support us..... http://www.terror-victims.israel.net/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nesher 628 Posted November 5, 2003 (edited) any comments? someone saw it? Edited November 5, 2003 by Nesher Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dutchy 0 Posted November 5, 2003 I saw the site. I thought I get to see a name list and numbers of victims. But I saw only a map and text. In Europe was a poll who was the most dangerous country in the world for the peace. Guess who won......................................no not Iran or Iraq. It was Israël. Salute Dutchy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seawolf 0 Posted November 5, 2003 (edited) Nesher, I saw it and thought it was pretty good, but refrained from getting involved in a political thread. Dutchy, the little anti-american comment was out of line. I'm sure that poll was fair and unbiased. <_< Edited November 5, 2003 by Seawolf Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+pcpilot 181 Posted November 5, 2003 Uhm, I think Id give Dutchy the benefit of the doubt. What he said was about Israel not US. Dutchy has said many supportive things about the US in the past. Id also say that even if his opinion changed of us, that is his right. Ill listen to opinions even if I dont agree with them. And stating that there was a poll in Europe without adding any further personal opinions is just a statement of fact, not an attack. The poll he mentions actually occured and came out the way he said. I dont agree with that poll but if that is what most europeans feel than thats their opinion. Personally I think Israel has a right to defend itself, though sometimes it seems they are overly aggresive. But if we were there instaed of Israelm, how would we behave? Probably the same. My opinion... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snapple2993 0 Posted November 5, 2003 I still dont recall the PLO attacking a US Navy ship.......... but Isreal did............. dont want their best buddies snoopin around when they start attacking other countries. Its simple, we get inundated with the isreali point of view in America, and rarely hear the Palestinian POV without getting some sort of anti Palestinian commentary from an Isreali guest or some wacko ultra-rightist talkshow host. All points are moot in this conflict........ you get enough money from us to sort out the problems. There is mass discrimination against Palestinians in Isreal... to the point (I read this after I read your thread, as I was looking to balance out the thread), that if a Palestinian adds on to their home without permit (which it is impossible for them to get), then the Isreali government doesnt just fine them, or demand a removal of that new section of housing.... no that would be civil, and rational... instead they bulldoze the whole damn house down. I believe in the article, something like 30-40 homes in Jerusalem, were ran into the ground at the time that article had been written. But you know my thoughts on the situation... a DMZ from the Med, to Jordan, Syria, Beriut, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt. There is no possible explanation for letting the bloodshed in that tiny corner of the world affect the rest of the globe in the way that it has. Neither side has proven to be just, neither side is civil, and thats why neither deserve autonomy. The whole of the middle east ran much smoother when the Ottomans were in control, and to a certain extent when the Brits controled it. Ofcourse with the exception of a few revolts against those powers... but those revolts only affected those powers, and not the rest of the world. In short, its two little babies that have stopped throwing sand at eachother, and have grown up, and started throwing grenades (various heavy ordinance for the Isreali's)... It's time the two babies got a parent. If you cant behave, then you need to be smacked around by someone bigger, so that you learn your place. Back to our news coverage of your little BIG dispute. If a club in Tel Aviv gets hit by a bomb, and kills a dozen Isreali's its called terrorism. When the IDF shells, rockets, and bombs a residential area, its called "just" retribution.... I call it all terrorism. Unlike what the news tells you, terror has nothing to do with the manner in which the act is carried out, it only has to do with who it is carried out against. If its against any form of organized and armed foe then it is warfare. When it is against civilians, then it is terrorism. Saddam Hussein rocketed Kurds, IDF rockets Palestinians, how are they different? They arent, unless you live in America, or in Isreal, in which case the Iraqi AF is a bunch of terrorists, and the IDF are protecting their freedom. I put all acts of violence by an organized group against unarmed civilians, in the group of terrorism. That includes our terror bombings of Germany in WWII, the 2 atomic bombs, all of our recent events, Soviet oppressions in Eastern Europe, China's acts of evil, etc. etc. etc. (dont get me wrong governments do what they have to do, but enough with the constant protectoin of Isreal). I shead the same amount of tears for Palestinians as I do Isreali's..... I might actually shead one, if you sicko's grow up and act civil. This issue should've been settled long ago, but neither side can get passed their zealotous points of view. I get enough one sided pseudo-compassionate BS thrown at me at school everyday, crap like "No Blood for Oil", and save the F*CKING WHALES. I dont want to see it here on Biohaz anymore. Yes, I used to post about politics, and I used to honestly care about some issues, but my vote doesnt count, and my views will be discarded as easily and as quickly as yours. I will stop soon. But do keep in mind what I said about me shedding tears for your people. Your country has cost us thousands of American lives, and into the hundreds of billions in American dollars, and you have given us nothing in return, other than "We are the only real democracy in the Middle East", put some Muslims, and Christians in your Parliament, and then you can say that you have a real democracy.... your parliament looks as balanced as any Southern State House after the American Civil War. You act like you are giving a fair shot for your minorities, but you have become very creative in your oppression... Just like this country did until about 30 yrs ago. Thats all, Saffell Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dutchy 0 Posted November 5, 2003 PCPilot your right about mine opion of the USA. I was it in the past, I'm now and in the future I'm also behind the USA. Mine opion is not changed. Most people that I know are behind the USA politics and what they do in Afganistan and Iraq. Now why I think why most European civilians find Israël dangerous. Simple question with a simple answer. Our politics in Europe are stand behind Israël. Civilians see tv and read papers. Every week (some each day) we see or read about Israël. Negative in the news with bombblasts and shootings. Thinking about that country in the Middle East surrounded by Arabian countries and near by Europe is the danger right on the corner. We are afraid that one day a terrorist comes in our country, because our politicians stand behind Israël. Is that strange??? I don't think so. Salute Dutchy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nesher 628 Posted November 5, 2003 (edited) snapple2993 first time I read this kinda text (a very long one) some of it i really understood 1. when you compare the IDF to an orginised Terrorist group you are wrong ! and in a few month I'll join IDF as well as other 18-19 years old in my country 2. Yes we are democratic country ! and Yes we have Arabs in our Parlament and funny as that, they are against the country that they work for, they Support killing Israeli people 3. like america gives money to other countries, they should give us too... we actually need it like most countries in the world 4. we don't defened ourselfs behind women and children like they do so when they die, yes we are sorry, but it's not out fault !! 5. some of the houses that get bulldozed are being used to shoot at our Soldiers 6. "I shead the same amount of tears for Palestinians as I do Isreali's..... I might actually shead one, if you sicko's grow up and act civil. This issue should've been settled long ago, but neither side can get passed their zealotous points of view." sorry, but it doesn't sounds like it... Dutchy 1. somewhere in the site are the names and dates of the people murdered in Terrorist acts 2. and about that stupid poll, when they will come live here than let them say whatever they want, I live here and I know I'm safer than most people in the world people die all over the world, the only difference that some die becuase they are Israelis/Jewish and that happens in other places in the world not only in Israel!! just remember 1 thing, I don't care if this thread will be locked I didn't switch it to a political discuttion I was only asked to show this site to other people beside Israelis we all want that everyone will see our side too Edited November 5, 2003 by Nesher Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seawolf 0 Posted November 6, 2003 My apologies Dutchy. I misunderstood :( Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
snapple2993 0 Posted November 6, 2003 You cannot post a topic that has political concern, and not expect it to turn political. We will never agree on this issue, and I will leave it at that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dutchy 0 Posted November 6, 2003 I hope everybody knew that the (stupid) poll is not mine meaning about Israël or USA. And I leave it by this. Salute Dutchy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dutchy 0 Posted November 6, 2003 Nesher, I showed the site at a colleague of mine. He found it intresting. He visit your country (Israël) a couple times for friends and remembers places what been bombed (sorry for the language). He told me to thanks for a site like this. Salute Dutchy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nesher 628 Posted November 7, 2003 I hope everybody knew that the (stupid) poll is not mine meaning about Israël or USA. And I leave it by this. Nesher, I showed the site at a colleague of mine. He found it intresting. He visit your country (Israël) a couple times for friends and remembers places what been bombed (sorry for the language). He told me to thanks for a site like this. Salute Dutchy Dutchy 1. I know that the poll isn't yours.... but I still think its stupid and as I said before, it has no meaning if the people that voted in it weren't here... 2. I hope that the next time your colleague will come to Israel (and all the people that visited our small country) he won't need to remember places that got bombed 3. thank him too Salute Nesher Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
