This whole claims thing is weird...check this out.

[Aussie Pilot 0]

I have been flying my Pup in the Campaign and put in 5 claim forms from 7 missions.

 

Mission 1, claimed 4, pending = 40. Eventually confirmed...thankyou.

 

Mission 2, claimed 1, pending = 40, rejected.

 

Mission 3, claimed 1, pending = 72, rejected.

 

Mission 4, claimed 8, (in 2 parts) It was a scramble, plenty to shoot and plenty off time, no worries.

 

Part 1 of claimed 8, pending = 66, Confirmed...thankyou.

Part 2 of claimed 8, pending = 66 (again), rejected. How weird is that. Same fight over our base, same witness for both claims on the one sheet.

 

So again I ask, how does the "pending" work? As you can see, my highest one, 72 was rejected and my lowest one, 40 was confirmed. Then we have the weird one that has the same pending 66 on the same claim log but with one rejected and one confirmed.

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with the claims process, I would just like to understand how it is supposed to work so as to make my claims more effective.

 

As for the 8 kills in one mission, (for those who are wondering ), it was a scramble against Alb D111(160). They came in 3 waves and i was easy on the trigger and watched my speed not to stall to low. I was almost in their cockpit before shooting them. I am on 130 realism, version 1.28, trackir, forcefeedback stick and rudder pedals. Also i have a 22" monitor. I think personally all this helps when in slow and low combat. I also have my pilots licence in real life and was taught a lot about stick and rudder control.

So it is acheivable, you just got to think about what your doing...treat it real

[+Winder 32]

I have been flying my Pup in the Campaign and put in 5 claim forms from 7 missions.

 

Mission 1, claimed 4, pending = 40. Eventually confirmed...thankyou.

 

Mission 2, claimed 1, pending = 40, rejected.

 

Mission 3, claimed 1, pending = 72, rejected.

 

Mission 4, claimed 8, (in 2 parts) It was a scramble, plenty to shoot and plenty off time, no worries.

 

Part 1 of claimed 8, pending = 66, Confirmed...thankyou.

Part 2 of claimed 8, pending = 66 (again), rejected. How weird is that. Same fight over our base, same witness for both claims on the one sheet.

 

So again I ask, how does the "pending" work? As you can see, my highest one, 72 was rejected and my lowest one, 40 was confirmed. Then we have the weird one that has the same pending 66 on the same claim log but with one rejected and one confirmed.

Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with the claims process, I would just like to understand how it is supposed to work so as to make my claims more effective.

 

As for the 8 kills in one mission, (for those who are wondering ), it was a scramble against Alb D111(160). They came in 3 waves and i was easy on the trigger and watched my speed not to stall to low. I was almost in their cockpit before shooting them. I am on 130 realism, version 1.28, trackir, forcefeedback stick and rudder pedals. Also i have a 22" monitor. I think personally all this helps when in slow and low combat. I also have my pilots licence in real life and was taught a lot about stick and rudder control.

So it is acheivable, you just got to think about what your doing...treat it real

 

I will be changing the way claims are handled in the near future - but at the moment R&R....

 

WM

[+Polovski 460]

The number doesn't mean you get a claim for sure AP. If you have a low chance of a claim and it comes off, and then a good chance and it doesn't, so what? That's why it's a "chance". Nothing is guaranteed.

 

What happens if a good claim was also claimed by a ground gunner? Many variables...

[Guest British_eh]

OK, so I'm daft, but I can write a good story.

 

Unfortunately my claims are mostly rejected as being erroneous. File the squad members name, and rank. Then below add the craft quantity, and a two line description of when, where in relation to the nearest aerodrome, the time, and height, and note the crafts actual crash into the ground. If I shoot down three craft, is it one claim and just change the number, or three separate entries? Is that where I'm mucking it up? If you have several witness's how do you log it? I have seen several reports on the Forums, but the format seems different than how we actually log the event.

 

Any help would be appreciated.

 

Ta,

 

British_eh

[+Polovski 460]

Yes you must be British_eh, if it says erroneous then something you entered is not valid. Do not TYPE in the number, use the pull own.

 

Do NOT put the rank in the witness, it does say so.

[Olham 164]

British_Eh, the rank is NOT to be mentioned.

You could mention, were you hit the plane, and what exactly happened to it.

When the plane type was the same, I fill in just one line, and click 3 at the beginning.

 

Aussie Pilot: I believe, that the claim gets less chances, the further away your witnesses were at the moment of the kill.

You may get a good looking pending number, as the program finds lots of data, that it also collected.

But in the end, it seems to be decisive, how near or far your witnesses were.

 

Anyone here got a very good pending, but rejected claim, from a fight, were he/she was alone?

That would clear it.

[Aussie Pilot 0]

The number doesn't mean you get a claim for sure AP. If you have a low chance of a claim and it comes off, and then a good chance and it doesn't, so what? That's why it's a "chance". Nothing is guaranteed.

 

What happens if a good claim was also claimed by a ground gunner? Many variables...

 

Cheers Pol/Winder, i appreciate you reading my nagging about this but you can see there are several of us just trying to figure out how it works.

 

So basically it looks like it's a roll of the dice as to whether your claim gets confirmed or rejected no matter how good your write up is and the pending score that goes with it.

Edited March 14, 2009 by Aussie Pilot

[Aussie Pilot 0]

Aussie Pilot: I believe, that the claim gets less chances, the further away your witnesses were at the moment of the kill.

You may get a good looking pending number, as the program finds lots of data, that it also collected.

But in the end, it seems to be decisive, how near or far your witnesses were.

 

Anyone here got a very good pending, but rejected claim, from a fight, were he/she was alone?

That would clear it.

 

Quite possibly Olham, that would make sence. I did however shoot my last two planes down off my witnesses six, but being in a group of 8 claim i'm not sure how the game see's it. They were in the second group of 4 i shot down and logged on the one sheet and they got rejected and the witness was right there cause i was saving his bacon.

[Waldemar Kurtz 1]

yeah, I don't get the claims thing at all.

 

I shot down 5 Fokker E.III within 3 miles of my own aerodrome (Hesidigneul) in plain sight of both wingmen who were alive the whole time. I included the time I shot them down (within a minute in every instance) and direction (N/NW of Hesdigneul). I didn't include ranges because that doesn't seem to make any difference.

 

initially I mentioned both wingmen by name, not including ranks--but then I figured maybe listing one wingmen was a deal-breaker. so I kept it down to one wingie.

 

I put in the claims and they said that they would be rejected as erroneous--so I altered the records to be sure. thing is, I also kept track of the Z-readings and even put down the almost exact longitude and lattitude of where my victims fell and it didn't like THAT either.

 

then I tried adding the aircraft type and squadron in the report "attacked Jasta 11 Fokker E.III" and so on...

 

I've tried out 5 or 6 different variations and they're always rejected categorically. they won't even show up in my pilot log book unless I go back and tweak the general settings to "bypass claims"--after which it will tell me that my claims were erroneous.

 

what's bizarre is that I saw "Fokker E.III destroyed" or "you destroyed a Fokker E.III" at least two or three times in that sortie during game play.

 

so, um, is there some special method towards writing claims out properly?

 

ironically, I've been flying a German Fokker career and I've got an AI wingie who's scored three victories in three missions (one of which was confirmed in less than a day). I can't complain because he's saved my skin twice over in less than a week... but I'm not used to shooting down 5 enemy planes within walking distance of my aerodrome and having all my claims categorically rejected based on word usage.

[griphos 0]

Hey W_K,

 

Check out these threads over at SOH with some clues about filing successful claims:

 

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?t=11908

 

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?t=11658

 

You'll see that there is a list of things that is helpful to include in order to increase your pending score. I've never gotten 100, as some have, but I get in the 80s now by writing a few sentences like:"Engaged enemy a/c flight at 4000 feet southwest of Lille (or Emerichicourt airfield or whatever) at around 4:00 pm. After chasing two EA from Jasta 18 to the deck, I fired about 100 rounds into one with drab green markings and watched him spin into the ground." Sometimes I get a bit more rhetorical (okay, lots of times) but this seems to be good enough.

 

If the advisor tells you "Fokker E.III destroyed" I'm not sure that means you shot him down. "You destroyed a Fokker E.III" certainly does. But the only reason I've ever had claims rejected outright was when I claimed a kill the sim didn't think belonged to me. When that happens, I cancel the claim and drop the number I'm claiming and it goes through fine then.

Edited March 14, 2009 by griphos

[+Polovski 460]

It does not matter if YOU see you killed something in the game. That's the whole point. It's like real life. You come back you claim. The more likely the information is and more realistic with more evidence then you will more likely get it. However it is still NOT guaranteed.

 

Also crashing close to your field does NOT mean you have more chance. Someone else pilot/MG gunner whatever, may rightly or wrongly have also claimed it? The Dog may eat your claim, a bomb may drop; on the guy on the bicycle taking it to HQ whatever.

 

Think, war, and loosen up ;)

 

As we said before we record lots of in flight game data but do not use lots of it yet. Phase 4 maybe if we ever get there.

 

If it bugs you simply change it in workshops.

 

Do NOT type numbers in for the craft, or do not type in the name either... use the PULL DOWN MENU, or it will say erroneous.

Or if you claim for 2 when you only got 1 (AI may have took a claim) it will say erroneous. It's a clue something you are doing isn't right.

[Olham 164]

Pol: Phase 4 maybe if we ever get there.

 

There, there, Pol - hope I don't trace a tone of disappointment? Why shouldn't you get there some day?

But let's have this for quite some time now.

I had been really upset earlier on today. Nothing went my way.

 

First flight: the wingman, I had called for help, "helped" me out with so much ammo into MY target, that it became HIS claim

(Hey! That's not what I called you for, mate! You were supposed to shoot the planes OFF MY TAIL - not off my nose!)

 

Second flight: after having shot down two SPAD XIII within short time, I collided with god-knows-whoom!

 

Third flight: I did all my very best; led my flight away from 6 Nupes, to get into a better position. Attacked from there.

Helped my wingman twice. But as soon, as I had dense own worries, them wingies were damn lost; didn't see anyone, after having

finished off my FOURTH Nupe! And you guess it already: right - claims were called "erraneus"! I changed the words, I wiped the last

plane out again - still: "erraneus"! Got nothing.

 

Now, calmed down, I see, I still haven't done all the right things. Otherwise I would have brought at least one of my wings back home.

This sim can really teach me a lot of the things I should be doing the right way.

Great! I'll try again tomorrow...

Edited March 14, 2009 by Olham

[Waldemar Kurtz 1]

I looked over some of those claims and I didn't think the game would accomodate a claim report that large! I kept things ridiculously short because I figured the game wouldn't like the more complicated combat reports I used to do for Red Baron 3d. (which was just for fun). heck, in those games I'd actually look at historical maps and include river and forest names just for the fun of it. perhaps I should be going "all out" in my attempts to describe the event?

 

of course, knowing that if I make a claim for something that was scored by ground fire (even if I shot at it) helps in a big way. I didn't think that if even one of my claims was off that it would disregard all of them.

[Todt Von Oben 0]

In five separate flights, I put in five separate claims. Didn't know what to say when they asked for a witness. The only other guy there was my wingman, so I put "Wingman".

 

The only one that got confirmed was the one where I ran out of ammo and chopped off the EA's tail with my prop; and i imagine those who pulled me out of the wreck and sent me to the hospital for 24 days confirmed that one.

 

So...where do you get the name for your witness?

 

Thanks!

 

TvO

[Todt Von Oben 0]

V. Kurtz said: looked over some of those claims and I didn't think the game would accomodate a claim report that large! I kept things ridiculously short because I figured the game wouldn't like the more complicated combat reports I used to do for Red Baron 3d. (which was just for fun).

 

I flew many campaigns in RB3D and afterwards the mission description simply told me what happened. I never even saw a claim form. Where is that, exactly?

 

(I'd like to load my old game and see if the claim form keeps me from losing a kill to someone else.)

 

Prost!

 

TvO

 

P.S. Oh wait. I get it. You just used to make your own reports for fun, not as part of the game. I shoulda known. I used to keep a log book and write realistic-sounding accounts of the events. Great fun!

 

As for the question...nevermind.

Edited March 15, 2009 by Todt Von Oben

[Guest British_eh]

Thanks guys. I see that time is expressed as AM/PM, no rank, not comma's separating witnesses, so.......that's all a good start.

 

Ta,

 

British_eh

[griphos 0]

TVO, the names of your wingmen are listed on the board in the briefing room, but if you'll turn labels on for a sec, you'll see their names listed above their planes. I used to just put "Wingman." Those all got denied.

[Rooster89 0]

Im glad to see that little R&R at the bottom of your post, Winder. Un-tape your eyeballs and get some good rest. Hopefully no one drives over to your house, banging on the door yelling "Theres a database error! Theres a database error!" (there cant be any now!) lol. Seriously though, hope you get alot of very well deserved rest. That goes for all you devs.

 

-Rooster

Edited March 15, 2009 by Rooster89

[Todt Von Oben 0]

TVO, the names of your wingmen are listed on the board in the briefing room, but if you'll turn labels on for a sec, you'll see their names listed above their planes. I used to just put "Wingman." Those all got denied.

 

Thank you for your patience, Griphos. I'm going there now to check it out.

 

I can see I really must familiarize myself with the manual before doing anything else.

 

Prost!

 

TvO

[Rickitycrate 10]

Thanks to the information in this thread and others I can report my first 100 pending rating.

As observer in an FE2B downed an Alb. DIII. not yet confirmed haven't lived long enough.... yet.

[Todt Von Oben 0]

I noticed that, after flying QC, the game automatically provides a form to file a claim and reminds me to do so. I was expecting the same in Campaign, but hit a snag.

 

I just started a campaign with Jasta 11 flying a DR-1. Wingman's name was Willy Gund. I chased a Spad XIII and downed him. Not far from our aerodrome, and I flew over the wreck a couple times to make sure my wingman saw it. Then I paused the game to write down the coordinates of the crash. Had all the claims info ready to go.

 

I flew the rest of the mission until there were no more goals to accomplish. After I landed, I shut down the engine and waited a while for the other guys to land. Then I hit ESC to exit the campaign. Then I went to the mission report, and there were my hits and I sure enough downed a Spad XIII serial number 1F7A.

 

But at no time did I ever see anything directing me to a place where I could file a claim. So there was no claim filed, and no credit for the kill.

 

Kind of reminds me of that scene from The Blue Max...

 

Schtakel: "But it was a KILL!"

 

Adjutant: "Then you have the deep satisfaction of knowing you have served the Fatherland."

:yes:

 

Anyway, did I miss something? Where's the Claims form?

 

Where does one go to file a claim after scoring a kill in Campaign?

 

Prost!

 

TvO

Edited March 15, 2009 by Todt Von Oben

[Bullethead 12]

Then I hit ESC to exit the campaign. Then I went to the mission report, and there were my hits and I sure enough downed a Spad XIII serial number 1F7A. But at no time did I ever see anything directing me to a place where I could file a claim. So there was no claim filed, and no credit for the kill.

 

Exiting the campaign is probably what hosed you. You should just "end flight", the top option on the list when the hit ESC.

 

When I do that, the debrief screen comes up and will say "congrats" on your claims(s)" somewhere amongst saying who didn't make it back and how many claims your squaddies got. After you close that screen, the claim form comes up for you to fill in. Once you get that done, you can either watch the replay or go back to the main campaign window.

 

---------------- New Subject ------------------------

 

Personally, I just don't see how so many folks get so wrapped up by whether their claims are accepted or rejected. It's very simple. You ONLY get the claim form to fill in at all if you actually did shoot something down. So that's your confirmation right there. As TvO said above, "you have the deep satisfaction of having "served the fatherland", regardless of whether the claim ends up being accepted or rejected. And then you have the replay that tells you how many planes you actually shot down if it's more than 1. So YOU as a player ALWAYS know your true score, regardless what the pencil-pushers say.

 

And if you don't like this, remember, there IS now an option where you can either skip the whole claim for thingy completely or make it where practically everything is awarded. If you don't like how the game handles your claims on the hard setting, try an easier one. We won't think any less of you, because, as mentioned above, you really did shoot the bugger down whether HQ agrees or not.

 

I myself approach the whole claims thing from the role-player perspective, as a good line dog. I fill it in as authentically and as truthfully as I can, and try to forget about it. I know I killed the bugger and his final agonies will no doubt haunt my nightmares for the rest of my (probably very short) life. No pencil-pushing REMF pogues are going to take that away from me (although sometimes I wish they could). I'm probably going to die tomorrow anyway, so will never know whether my claims get accepted or not, so how can I really care about them? Thus, from my role-playing POV, the claim form is just the last obstacle before I can start the more enjoyable decompression process with booze and women .

 

If I could change something about the claim system, it would be that you ALWAYS have the option of filling in the form, whether you really killed anything or not, AND that you never got the "this will automatically be rejected" message. IOW, I want the ability to lie to the pogues.

 

This would be for role-playing purposes. Knowing I'm probably going to die soon and the pencil-pushing REMF pogues will survive the war is a source of irritation, so I'd like to make life as difficult for them as possible. I want to stuff their in-boxes with bogus crap that some staff officer with a fixation on paperwork through-put will insist that his clerks work on 24/7 until they get to the bottom of the pile. I want them to waste their time on wild goose-chases, and I want to inject so much bogus intel into the system that ultimately Trenchard will announce that the Germans have run out of airplanes in early 1917

 

You know, Viet Nam-style "bodycount math". The OFF version would be like 1 horse + 2 arms + 1 leg = 4 Albatri shot down. I want the REMFs trying to sort that out years after I'm dead and gone

[Guest British_eh]

OK, so no Rank, Claim two planes, no comma's, no semicolon in the times, still, Erroneous Claim??

 

So, next time to fly I will have to deviate from DiD, and try Easy claims as it just isn't working. Haven't had one claim be accepted yet??

 

Regards,

 

British_eh

[Aussie Pilot 0]

OK, so no Rank, Claim two planes, no comma's, no semicolon in the times, still, Erroneous Claim??

 

So, next time to fly I will have to deviate from DiD, and try Easy claims as it just isn't working. Haven't had one claim be accepted yet??

 

Regards,

 

British_eh

 

Why don't you fill one out and then take a screen shot and show us to get some idea's...just a thought.

[Todt Von Oben 0]

Bullethead said: Exiting the campaign is probably what hosed you. You should just "end flight", the top option on the list when the hit ESC.

 

That's what I do, bro. Lately the claims forms have been coming up right on schedule, just as you describe. I'm guessing on the times when it didn't come up, somebody else put more lead into the target than I did; so they got the kill. Used to happen in Red Baron. Apparently, the game takes things into consideration that I might not be aware of.

 

Bullethead said: Personally, I just don't see how so many folks get so wrapped up by whether their claims are accepted or rejected. It's very simple. You ONLY get the claim form to fill in at all if you actually did shoot something down. So that's your confirmation right there. As TvO said above, "you have the deep satisfaction of having "served the fatherland", regardless of whether the claim ends up being accepted or rejected. And then you have the replay that tells you how many planes you actually shot down if it's more than 1. So YOU as a player ALWAYS know your true score, regardless what the pencil-pushers say.

I'll cosign that. It's kind of nice to rack up a score, if you're working toward a medal in this game. But as MvR said (words to the effect) "It doesn't matter if you get credit for it. What matters is that he goes down."

 

Right now I'm still waiting for six witnessed claims (where the game said I shot the plane down) to be confirmed. But it's no biggy. The story is written in the claims for me to reminisce over, anyway. I know I scored and lived to fight another day.

 

BUT...the fact that I'm still waiting for witnessed and game-acknowledged kills to be confirmed has me wondering if I'm writing the claims wrong. I'm writing a monologue describing the flight and the fight. I pause the game, check the map, and get the coordinates where the guy went in. I write all that down. Witness are my flight members. Doesn't seem to be working, though.

 

Or does it just take a long time for the claims to be confirmed by the Remington Raiders in the rear with the gear?

 

Some of you guys who regularly lodge successful claims: how do you write them down? What info? What format?

 

Perspiring minds want to know...

 

Prost!

 

TvO

Edited March 16, 2009 by Todt Von Oben