Eyeballing incoming missiles

[Gel214th 0]

Is there a way to lock your view to an incoming missile?

The RWR doesn't exactly seem to alert you of incoming IR missile launches, and I'm not sure if it works at all for SAMs.

 

Actually...the rapid beeping just seems to indicate that somethign has locked onto you and may have fired.

[tank03 1]

Is there a way to lock your view to an incoming missile?

The RWR doesn't exactly seem to alert you of incoming IR missile launches, and I'm not sure if it works at all for SAMs.

 

Actually...the rapid beeping just seems to indicate that somethign has locked onto you and may have fired.

 

I don't know about locking a view onto a missile, but there is a great speech mod that has the radio caller ID to whom the missile is targeted. In a muti-plane flight the radio chatter and constant SAM alerts was distracting, especially when most of them weren't heading my way. With this mod I only pay attention when I hear my number called out. It's really been useful:

 

http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?autom...p;showfile=3836

[Gel214th 0]

I don't know about locking a view onto a missile, but there is a great speech mod that has the radio caller ID to whom the missile is targeted.

 

Hmm, thanks a lot. I'll have to try this out. I suppose at least if I know a missile is coming toward me, that I can then start looking around frantically to find out where it is.

I'm still accustomed in Sims to the RWRs giving a bit more information as to when a missle is launched and approaching your aircraft though.

[Fubar512 1,350]

AFAIK, no RWR is capable of indicating an IR missile in flight. How could it? IR is passive. In real life, there is some capabilty to indicate a missile launch (flash detection), but it would not show anything once the missile has burned out its booster and gone into a ballistic mode.

 

It seems as if the issue here is lack of familiarity with the system. The RWR indicates that an emitter has achieved targetting lock on your aircraft. The position of the RADAR emitter should provide one with a general idea of a missile's bearing, as the emitter is a point source. Also, Active Homing missiles (Phoenix, AMRAAM, some R-27 variants, and the R-77) will show up on the display as point sources when they go active.

 

Perhaps someone with real life experience (Typhoid or Ezlead) will chime in and settle this.

[Gel214th 0]

AFAIK, no RWR is capable of indicating an IR missile in flight. How could it? IR is passive. In real life, there is some capabilty to indicate a missile launch (flash detection), but it would not show anything once the missile has burned out its booster and gone into a ballistic mode.

 

It seems as if the issue here is lack of familiarity with the system. The RWR indicates that an emitter has achieved targetting lock on your aircraft. The position of the RADAR emitter should provide one with a general idea of a missile's bearing, as the emitter is a point source. Also, Active Homing missiles (Phoenix, AMRAAM, some R-27 variants, and the R-77) will show up on the display as point sources when they go active.

 

Perhaps someone with real life experience (Typhoid or Ezlead) will chime in and settle this.

I understand all that, and how the RWR works.

 

Supposedly a few of the newer aircraft's array of sensors, the Eurofighter and the F22 I believe, are able to detect the possible presence and launch of a missile at your aircraft,Whether IR or otherwise. It might not know what kind it is, but it can tell you that one is in the air and probably heading to your aircraft. The Eurofighter's DASS system is based on this and systems capable of detecting IR launches were officially produced around 1997.

 

I think many simulations allow this nod to the player to compensate for the fact that you're playing on the computer without full 3D vision, and that you're unable to very quickly turn and look around as you would in the true aircraft to spot missile trails etc. (Even with TrackIR).

 

Here's some more info:

Although the goal of any fighter pilot is to remove an enemy before they have fired there will of course be occasions when this is not the case. To enable tracking of such missile launches the DASS incorporates three Missile Approach Warners (MAW), one each in the port and starboard wing roots (near the cockpit) and one in the rear fuselage (near the tail). The units are derived from the Plessey PVS2000 MAW which utilises an active, pulse-doppler radar for detection. Since the units are active they are able to detect not only radar guided ordnance but also passive weapons such as infra red guided short range missiles. To increase the effectiveness of the system the MAW is also directly linked to the flare launchers allowing an instantaneous response to a local launch.

 

Two possible upgrades to the MAW system have been discussed as part of on-going DASS improvements for inclusion on either Tranche-2 or more likely Tranche-3. The first of these is a UV based system. These were discounted for the initial install of DASS because GEC-Marconi thought the technology immature at the time. A UV system detects the characteristic emmisions from the missile plume. The advantage is it can be highly discriminating against counter measures. However since it is reliant on detecting the plume of the missiles engine its primarily useful only during the burn phase.

 

PIMAWS © BGT The second and more likely potential replacement, announced by Germany's Bodenseewerk Geratechnik (BGT) in June 2001, is termed PIMAWS, or Passive Infra-red Missile Approach Warning System. PIMAWS began development in 1997 as an advanced technology demonstrator jointly funded by the German Ministry of Defence and BGT, the project is due to complete in 2003. The system is intended for installation as Line-Replaceable Units in both of the wing-tip pods achieving full spherical coverage. The detector portion of the system is a step-stare infra-red sensor operating in the 3-5µm frequency range allowing for both air to air and surface to air missile detection up to the post-burn-out phase. All the resulting data is fed into a custom designed image processing system utilising a Systolic Array Processor and DSP. Over 64 targets can be tracked simultaneously and through a built-in threat library they can also be determined. All the resulting data can be fed via a STANAG-1553B databus to the rest of the avionics, here one unit acts as the master the other the slave. This should allow the information to be fused with the other AIS sources. Although ground tests have been carried out and flight tests are scheduled for October 2001 no decisions have been reached by EADS or the partner nations as to whether PIMAWS will be integrated into Eurofighter.

 

The issue of course being, is this going to be 'Integrated' into the base Eurofighter, or will each individual nation have to decide whether they are going to outfit their Eurofighters with it at their own cost.

 

If the Eurofighter has access to this technology, then you know the Americans do as well and from my reading the F22 employs some sort of similar system. One can assume that they can be fitted to the JSF to provide another warning level as well.

 

AN/AAR-56, Missile Launch Detection System; manufactured by Lockheed Martin; used in F-22. AN/AAR-57, CMWS (Common Missile Warning System)

[Southernap 1]

SFP, WOV, and WOE are all set in times before the introduction of these more modern systems, remember these games were designed for aircraft introduced in the late 50's and early 60's. When all you really needed was an engine, wings, some gas and you could go turn and burn to your hearts delight. The introduction of IR missile warning systems (and missile launch warning systems in general) are pretty new and were introduce in the late-90's. Before that one had to depend on the RWR, your wingman, and the good ol'fashion Mk 1 eyeball.

 

The game engine itself, to my understanding, works as best it can with the RWR that you see in the F-4 and a few other aircraft. To introduce a more complex radar warning system would probably require a code tweak.

[MigBuster 2,861]

One of the effects packs gives the SAMS bettwer smoke trails so they are easier to see when they launch - this is most handy when you dont even have an RWR in your jet. Using a TrackIR you can see the things just like in real life and take action.

 

IR detection has been a massive problem - particularly against MANPADS im glad there is finally something to sort this out.

[Gel214th 0]

One of the effects packs gives the SAMS bettwer smoke trails so they are easier to see when they launch - this is most handy when you dont even have an RWR in your jet. Using a TrackIR you can see the things just like in real life and take action.

 

IR detection has been a massive problem - particularly against MANPADS im glad there is finally something to sort this out.

 

Hmm...I looked at the Object Downloads pages and didn't see an effects pack for the SAMs. One may also be useful for A2A missiles though *grin*

[Southernap 1]

Go to here, Deuces Strike Fighters Mods and there are new terrian tiles and various effect packages (such as smoky SAMs)

[Gel214th 0]

Th-Thank you....thank you very much...

[Gel214th 0]

Just to keep with the theme, I found some interesting leftovers in the Viewlist.ini file:

Hello,

 

I'm trying to modify the F9 Weapon view so that it shows enemy missiles which have been fired at you.

 

So I suppose it is a Weapon To Target view where you are the target, and the weapon was fired by an enemy.

 

I noticed in the viewlist.ini file the following:

 

[searchIncomingWeapon]ViewObjectGroupName=MissileGroup

ViewObjectStatusFlag=PLAYERTARGET

 

When I replaced values in the PlayerToWeapon view section though, it has no effect.

 

[View025]

ViewName=PlayerToWeaponView

ViewClassName=TacticalViewClass

UpdateAlways=FALSE

ViewGotoControl=GOTO_VIEW_PLAYER_TO_WEAPON

CycleNextControl=

CyclePrevControl=

ObjectFrom=SearchAircraft

ObjectTo=SearchIncomingWeapon

PositionOffsets=0.0,-40.0,8.0

AngleOffsets=0.0,0.0,0.0

 

Is there a different group beside MissileGroup which would contain the Enemy missiles?

 

Can anyone assist on how this view can be accomplished?

 

I posted on ThirdWire but so far no response to the post. It seems that the 'MissileGroup' group does not contain the missiles fired by either yourself or the enemy. So altering the target does nothing, you'll still only be dealing with your own missiles.

 

For example by removing target entirely you cannot cycle through your missile and your wingman's missiles in other words, although I feel you should be able to. At this point, I'm thinking that this was something that just wan't fully coded into the game, or perhaps there is some other Group such as EnemyMissileGroup or WingmanMissileGroup for example that isn't apparent in the files.

[Guest Saganuay82]

I don't think that it was possible. There are snippets of things that are hiding in the game that haven't been implemented yet.

[jtin 0]

Just release as much chaff and flares as you can and JINK!

 

The SAM trails should be in the weapons pack, or the effects pack, at Deuces' website.

 

You could do the same for missiles with the weapon editor, but I would try making the stock missile trail a little darker and lasting longer first.

[Bulldog 0]

Just downloaded the effects pack, for those who haven't, do it, you won't be disappointed. The dirty exhaust effect gets better frame rates on my PC, which surprised me. Now to see how this works on those nasty SAMs on Gephard's DRV terrain, as this comes as I am trying to finish just one campaign without being rear ended by one. If anything it makes you appreciate what the airmen went though over 'Nam.

Edited February 15, 2007 by Bulldog