WW2: Invasion of Japan?

[Wrench 9,477]

Thank MK! Since Russo provided us with a FANTASTIC template, makes skinning a breeze. Also, if you look at my "What If..." Korean N, all the decal positions are already plotted out

 

Would there be any interest in the Lake Biwa seaplane base??? Since we have Pakso's Rex (and the skin for the squadron there), the Rufe and my FakeJake....and of course Gepard's Invisible Airfield ™

 

Only ask as I added the lake last night to the map.

 

wrench

kevin stein

[Fatman 3]

July 22, 2009

 

Found more information that might be helpful on WW2: Invasion Of Japan

 

The following "special weapons" were established on southern Kyushu.

• Kamikazes -- 2,100 army planes and 2,700 navy planes.
  
• Yokosuka MXY-7 OKHA - suicide missile carried by a bomber.
  
• Mini-subs, each with 2 torpedoes, 500 were building.
  
• Fleet submarines -- arm the 57 remaining that had been dedicated to resupply of outposts.
  
• Kaiten - suicide torpedoes with a 20 mile range.
  
• Shinyo - suicide motorboats. The army had 1-man, 17 foot motorboats. The navy had 2-man, 22 foot boats.
  
• The largest surviving warships were destroyers that were prepared for suicidal attack on the invasion convoys.
  
• On the land, human mines in which soldiers had explosives strapped to their bodies and were to crawl under a tank. Other explosives were packed with a suction cup to be attached to the side of a tank. And shaped charges on a long pole were to be detonated on the side of a tank.
  
• Paratroopers were to attack Okinawa to disrupt flight operations during the invasion period.
  

Fatman

[MKSheppard 4]

Found a map of Iwo Jima, at the end of WWII in an Osprey on VLR Fighter operations:

 

 

I think they were adding EVEN MORE runways and hardstands when the war ran out in August '45.

[MKSheppard 4]

Organization of USAAF Groups

 

NOTE: All groups operate with 50% reserves; thus a B-29 Bomb Group (VH), with 28 UE would actually have 42 aircraft. To get this, multiply each group total by 1.5

 

Very Very Heavy Bombardment Group (Original Plan): 3 Squadrons, each with 6 aircraft for a total of 18 B-36s

Very Very Heavy Bombardment Group (Late 1948 Plan): 3 Squadrons, each with 10 aircraft for a total of 30 B-36s

 

Very Heavy Bombardment Group (1943): 4 squadrons, each with 7 aircraft for a total of 28. (2 crews per UE aircraft)

Very Heavy Bombardment Group (1944): 3 squadrons, each with 10 aircraft for a total of 30. (1.7 crews per UE aircraft)

 

Heavy Bombardment Group: 4 Squadrons, each with 12 aircraft for a total of 48.

 

Medium Bombardment Group: 4 Squadrons, each with 13 aircraft plus HQ element of 5 planes for a total of 57.

 

Light Bombardment Group: 4 Squadrons, each with 13 aircraft plus HQ element of 5 planes for a total of 57.

 

Fighter Group: 3 squadrons, each with 25 aircraft for a total of 75.

 

Troop Carrier Group: 4 Squadrons, each with 13 planes, for a total of 52.

Edited July 23, 2009 by MKSheppard

[MKSheppard 4]

Locations, and lengths of USAAF/USN/USMC fields on Okiwana in 1945:

 

 

Wrench, when i google "Ie Shima" and "airfield" in Google images to try and find overhead views of the damn place in 1945; I keep getting your webpage with skins for P-51s etc flying from it.

[MKSheppard 4]

Thank MK! Since Russo provided us with a FANTASTIC template, makes skinning a breeze.

 

Can you send me the "P-47N-15 Thunderbolt"?

 

All I have is the version which has a billion 1024x1024 BMPs, instead of the 2048x2048 template, and I can't find the P-47N-15 anywhere

[Wrench 9,477]

I got the template from here, IIRC....if you can't find it here, I'll upload my copy

 

--------

Great maps!

Unfortunately, Iwo ain't on this one ....

 

Also, in regards to Okinawa, there is no possible way (well, actually, there IS, but...) to add all those airfields. Don't forget the screwed-up scaling issues with ALL 3W terrains, even those at 100% scale (and I'm pretty sure Ok is 63%)

 

However, having said that.....

there IS enough room at Ie Shima for 2 runway3s or a runway3 and runway2...they should juuuuuussst fit in the 4 tile G-AB1s.

Yongtan 'zone' also can fit 2 runway3s; I just hate combining 2 target areas that close together ... it only create problems when trying to add new terrain objects, but otherwise only looks 'off'.

Kadena is right now set as a Runway1, medium airfield. I can swap it for a Runway4 (the large 2-crossing runway airfield) by twisting it around a bit facing-wise to force it to fit. This would be benifical to SuperFort operations, as well as B-35 and B-36s (in a 'What If...' scenario)

Other than looking a bit strange, it all doable ... and will probably get done that way.

 

Then there's the carrier stations ... not to forget TF 57 (??), the BPF forces. TF54, the gunfire support group has been added, courtesy of Hinch and his battlewagons he made for my Pearl Harbor map (yes, IronDuke has been modded into USS TEXAS)

I even have a complete map of the radar picket DD locations surrounding Okinawa, and still have to plot them on the map and put Grinch's FLETCHER's there.

 

of course, the movements.ini goes to hell, as there's still 'active' IJA forces on the northern half of the island, with several GroundAttack routes to Kadena, Yongta and Naha. Then again, NEW GA routes would need to be built for the 3 landing beaches on Kyushu. (I have a map around here somewhere's of the proposed assault sites -- in fact, it's on my 'generic' WW2 loading screen!)

It should also be noted, that Operation Coronet not be possible, as this map don't go far enough 'up' Honshu to the Kanto Plain and Yokahama/Tokyo districts.

 

As it stands right now, the ENTIRE terrain will probably be uploaded, as I've made too many changes and added too many things that dummy me forgot to keep track of, but I can easily replace the terrain mod I did before with THIS one. That just means that everyone will have to d/l all 60-odd megs again.

 

but, progress in being made

 

wrench

kevin stein

[MKSheppard 4]

Here's what the USN wanted as "official" for it's Naval Aviation units in 1945:

 

"Naval Airplane Program for 37,735 Planes." found in the Naval Historical Center Files:

 

CVB: 48 Fighter, 36 Scout Bomber, 37 Torpedo Bomber

CV: 36 Fighter, 36 Scout Bomber, 19 Torpedo Bomber

CVL: 24 Fighter, 9 Torpedo Bomber

CVE: 18 Fighter, 12 Torpedo Bomber

[MKSheppard 4]

Wrench, what are the limitations for a ThirdWire Game Terrain Map dimensionally?

[MKSheppard 4]

Figures, after I post the above "official" program, I find this in "F6F" by Barrett Tillman:

 

Despite such problems, when Task Force 38 departed Ulithi on 11 December, the F6F buildup was well underway. At least five Essex-class carriers now operated 70-plane fighter squadrons: VF-3 in TG-38.1; VF-7, VF-11, and VF-20 in TG-38.2; and VF-80 in TG-38.3. Additionally, Air Group Four had been reunited aboard the Essex in TG-38.3 and had operated at least 64 fighters since mid-October. The usual composition of the enlarged fighter squadrons was 69 F6F-5s, including four photo birds, plus four night fighters for a total of 73.

[Wrench 9,477]

Wrench, what are the limitations for a ThirdWire Game Terrain Map dimensionally?

 

you mean in square km covered? or the generic x by y deminisons? From what I've seen, looking at Lexx's 6million meter map, there dosen't seem to be an upper limit. My Central Pacific, irrc, was 1000x1000 km, the Hawaii was 500x500.

 

What distance the Ok map has, I'm not sure - meaning I've never given it any thought! One could create a simple single mission with 2 waypoints, starting at an edge (excluding the 80km Wall Zone), and measuring the distance to the other side. Since they're square, it could be figured out from there.

 

====

For WW2:46, we'd be missing the early model Midway class (CVBs) as I don't think we have that kind, only the angled deck version. I can look around and double check. There's a 'passable' CVE and CVL in my Central Pacific terrain - both mods of Hinch's ships, via Kukulino's mods of said (MAC and Zuhio). As it stands now, the carrier stations are all around Okinaway, but they are very easily moved to new locations. Also, we can include Gepards Patent Pending Invisible Airfield ™ for use in single missions, like he did for Midway and I for CenPac. It's up to you all what you want -- the drawback of using those is game-generated singles will place 'inappropriate' (read: AAF) aircraft there as a base. (btw: it's used at Lake Biwa)

 

So, I guess I need some feedback/suggestions from our Campaign Guru, Baltika.

 

===

Subnote:

does anyone know if the ActiveYear= in the 06 levels will accept the ActiveDate= line??? If so, the I can leave the airfields as they are, and "add" the extra ones as they can be 'constructed' and have a specific start date.

Meaning:

 

Kadena (as runway1 version)

 

ActiveDate= 01/01/1939

InactiveDate=08/31/1945

 

Kadena New (as Runway4 version)

 

ActiveDate=09/01/1945

InactiveDate=12/31/2050

 

(damn, but them CBs work fast!! )

 

and....

 

Ie Shima West (as is now, runway3)

ActiveDate=01/01/1939

 

 

Ie Shima East (new, additional runway-whatever-)

ActiveDate=09/01/1945

 

so, until the island is 'secured', there's only the preexisting airfields. If the active date DOSEN'T work, then they can simply be changed to ActiveYear=1946, which means putting off the Invasion until 1946 (wasn't that the plan anyway???)

 

more experimentation will be required on my part....

 

Thoughts???

 

wrench

kevin stein

 

ps: I'll try to have some screenies today, as I seem to have fixed my issue, by doing a full system restore. I feel much better now, reallly I do!!!

[Wrench 9,477]

well, didn't take long to figure out the answer to my question is NO.

 

However, the start DATE works, just not the InactiveDate=

 

as shown in the 1st screenie....both runway sets (1 & 4) exist on Sept 1st, 1945, while ONLY the runway 1 (no screenie) shows on Aug 31st. One of the advantages of the "Targets Placement.msn" I wrote about in the KB. Easy to change dates you fly on!

 

So, the question of when has been answered ... 1946. It looks like full years only, with no month/day. DAMN!!!

 

the other screenies are:

looking at Naha

BB gunfire support group (Texas is at the center, ok, Iron Duke )

 

you'll note the 'forests' dotting the region (same as Japan). I'll get some pics of Japan up later, as I've changed a LOT of the city building to something a bit more Asian looking (read: vCity*)

 

wrench

kevin stein

[Fatman 3]

July 23, 2009

 

Below is the following aircraft which can be added to WW 2: Invasion Of Japan.

 

USA

 

A-26 Invader

B-25 Mitchell

B-26 Marauder

F4F Wildcat

F4U Corsair

F6F Hellcat

P-38 Lighting

P-39 Aircobra

P-40 Warhawk

P-47N Thunderbolt

P-51 Mustang

P-61 Black Widow

PB4Y-1 B-24D

SBD Dauntless

TBF Avenger

 

RAF

 

Avro Lancaster ( NO 83 Squadron RAF )

Hawker Hurricane

Hawker Seafury

Hawker Sea Hurricane

Hawker Typhoon

 

 

Fatman

Edited July 23, 2009 by Fatman

[Wrench 9,477]

Edited comments by me....

 

July 23, 2009

 

Below is the following aircraft which can be added to WW 2: Invasion Of Japan.

 

USA

 

A-26 Invader

B-25 Mitchell

B-26 Marauder <--does not exist

F4F Wildcat Probably FM-2s from CVE, in CAS roles

F4U Corsair

F6F Hellcat

P-38 Lighting

P-39 Aircobra Possibly no longer in use by 1944 in main theatres; never heard of it being used past the New Guina ops. More likely replaced with P-38/P-47/P-51

P-40 Warhawk <--relagated to 2ndry theatres by 1944

P-47N Thunderbolt

P-51 Mustang

P-61 Black Widow <-- does not exist

PB4Y-1 B-24D

SBD Dauntless replaced by SB2C for front line duties after Marianas Campaign

TBF Avenger

 

RAF

 

Avro Lancaster ( NO 83 Squadron RAF )

Hawker Hurricane <-- not in RAF usage, NorWesPak in 1945.

Hawker Seafury <--not until 1947. I know, cause I have an F.10 ready to upload

Hawker Sea Hurricane <--Not in BPF in 1945. Replaced with Seafire/Corsair Mk.IV

Hawker Typhoon I question it's RAF usage, due to lack of range from OK to Home Islands

 

 

Fatman

 

Some fact checking might be in order ... I'd like to see definitave links saying yea or nay on some of these, especially the Airacobra and Warhawk, which were VERY outmoded in 1942, let alone 1945. Were they still in use? Sure, but not it Primary Offensive theatres (not counting P-39s in Russia -that's another can of worms). The DEFINATELY didn't have the legs to stretch from Okinawa to the Home Islands. Ground support roles had already been taken over by Jugs and Lightnings and Mustangs, to say nothing of the USN aircraft

 

The BPF forces contained Seafires, Corsairs, Tarpon/Avengers, possibly some Fireflys.

 

Don't forget, too, the imposed limitations for DAT aircraft; and those that COULD be used in this theatre, would need reskinning. And I have NO plans for doing that.

 

---

back to the airfield issue...

 

well, the ActiveYear/InactiveYear DON't work either......

so it looks like you all will be stuck with a non-historic Runway4 for Kadena. That is, after I get finished hexediting the lods and bmps and tga to match a new naming convention (due to the fact I want it CONCRETE, and not dirt)

 

wrench

kevin stein

[+gregoryp 1]

I think these could be added to a 1946 list

 

F8F

F2G-2

FR-1

 

P-80A

P-82 <---- I know, a reach

[jomni 6]

Which is the recommended base sim for this mod?

[MKSheppard 4]

P-82 <---- I know, a reach

 

Actually not as much of a reach as you think:

 

P-82/F-82: Conceived late 1943; 4 prototypes ordered 7 January 1944, first flight 15 April 1945 of XP-82.

 

500 P-82B Production models ordered; 20 delivered by V-J Day. Remaining 480 planes cancelled.

 

It's very well possible that the P-82B would become available in Fighter Group Strength by the winter of 1945.

 

Other interesting possibilities are the P-84 Thunderjet. The USAAF ordered 400 of them in March 1945; but the end of the war saw this order cancelled, and the program placed "on hold" as priorities were re-evaluated. Despite this, the XP-84 first flew in December 1945.

[Wrench 9,477]

Agreed on the Twin Must. It's a small matter to just reuse my SWOTL P-82 skins (after all, wouldn't some of these squadrons be transfered over???) Saves time & decal creation, too

Yes, I AM that lazy!!!

 

Early production Thunderjets also already exist, with the un-framed canopy. Somewhere's here at CA ...

 

Now, a Super Corsair .... hmmmm ..... that'd be REAL nice, harkening back to AOTP:46. Unfortunately, we'd need a new 3d model, with the bubble canopy and such.

Already have the Tigercat and Bearcat.

 

jomni: WoE, 06 patch level ONLY!!!! (my install of choice) Although, since I tend to include all items necesscary for the terrain, it'll work just fine in SF/SFG or WoV (in fact, it uses WoV tiles, thanks to Edward, hence the relative ease with which I can add the trees)

 

Wrench

kevin stein

[MKSheppard 4]

Wrench, have you thought about this kind of map? It's about 3,500 km each side; and gives you a fairly good stretch of area to fight in.

 

 

It allows many possible things; for example, US Army Missile sites in South Korea can launch JB-2 Loons (V-1s) at Japan; B-29s can take off from the Marianas, it covers all of Okiwana; and even the phillipines and taiwan, allowing for some additional missions, like for example; you could use this map and file to create a short 7-10 day campaign just for the USN dealing with the reduction of Formosa as a Japanese Air base, in preparation for OLYMPIC.

[MKSheppard 4]

Here are the campaign select screens for AOTP:1946

 

- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -

 

USN

 

Prelude to Olympic

SEP. 1, '45

 

The fast carriers will attack Japan and spend the next two months pounding the invasion areas so the GIs don't get Massacred. Our main targets will be air-fields and fortifications on Kyushu. Enemy opposition will be intense.

 

Drive on the Sendai Line

Nov 1, '45

 

The ground troops will be going ashore November 1. Once they establish a beachhead, they will drive inland and capture Miyazaki and Sendai. The fighting will be over rough terrain and in bad weather, so it will not be a piece of cake. The GIs will depend on us for close air support.

 

Operation Coronet

Mar 1, '46

 

With Kyushu secured, the high command is proceeding with the invasion of Honshu. The losses will be heavy, so we must support the guys on the beach. After a beachhead has been captured, we're going to drive on Tokyo and Yokohama.

 

- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -

 

USAAF

 

Olympic Warm-up

SEP. 1, '45

 

The USAAF squadrons on Okinawa will fly support far the troops about to go ashore on Kyushu. Our job is to bomb anything of military value approaching the beachheads. We will also be flying patrols in order to intercept and destroy whatever air resistance you encounter.

 

Bloody Kyushu

NOV. 2, '45

 

The invasion of Kyushu is scheduled for November 1. We're expecting heavy losses and fanatic resistance. Our job is to sweep the skies of enemy planes. We also must support the GIs whenever possible with ground attack sorties

 

The Last Invasion: Coronet

MAR. 1, '46

 

The invasion of Honshu has been delayed several weeks by weather. That will give us an extra few days to wear dawn the Japanese defenders. We will pound the beaches, the airfields, and the supply bases around Tokyo. Once the troops are ashore we will block aerial attacks on the beachhead.

 

- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -

 

IJN

 

Carnage off Kyushu

OCT. 1, '45

 

In the ensuing weeks, a Yankee invasion of Kyushu is expected. The Air Forces will try and stop the attackers at the water's edge by destroying their carrier support, and their assault ships. Our Special Attack Corps will devastate the enemy invasion fleet, and we will achieve a decisive victory!

 

Containing the Beachhead

NOV. 2, '45

 

The Americans have established a beachhead on Kyushu. The next few weeks will be decisive. We must crush the invaders before they can gain more strength and push north towards Miyazaki. Our targets will be the transports and aircraft carriers lying off shore.

 

The Defense of the Kanto Plain

MAR 1, '46

 

The enemy will soon be landing near Tokyo Bay. We must stop their invasion at all costs. The capital of the Empire cannot be allowed to fall into American hands. As soon as the American fleet is spotted, we will throw our remaining aircraft at it in a massive kamikaze effort. Your job will be to make sure the special attack forces get through to their targets.

[jomni 6]

Good. I have the old school WOE (currently uninstalled).

 

I recently bought Il-2 1946 from Steam only to find out it won't run on my (cheap) laptop. So I guess Il-2 is restricted to my Desktop only.

 

So I'm looking forward to this mod for some 1946 action in my lappy.

Edited July 24, 2009 by jomni

[Wrench 9,477]

That would be a SUPERB map for this very scenairo!!

But I don't think those regions are on the same DEM, and my lack of (ability and) understanding on HOW to stitch 2 together, limits my creativity. Of course, if someone manages to do it, and create the HFD and TFD files, targetization is just a matter of research and time.

 

---

Rethinking the P-82 (and looking at my SWOTL version); methinks a few ini edits will recreate the standard 2-seat Long Range Day fighter. Said edits to the loadout and avionics inis will remove the radar pod, and the search/track radars, while leaving the audio RWR intact.

(of course, this would mean I'd also have to get off my ass and finally finish the 422nd NFS skin, and create the B model with the SCR270 AI radar.....nice all black skin, too!)

 

A few quick swipes in the template, and some new decals, and I could recreate another Natural Metal version. Just have to pick a squadron, find the markings....etc.

 

My T-Jet for SWOTL already has 56th FG markings; the question is, would the 8th AF, operating from Okinawa, still keep the Euro-style squadon codes and such??

 

wrench

kevin stein

[MKSheppard 4]

 

And the bitmap used for importation

 

Japan_46_Bitmap.zip

 

Settings were:

 

N45

E116 (upper corner of map)

 

4100 km size map.

2000 m tile resolution

500m height resolution

 

100% Map Scale

110% Height Scale

[+gregoryp 1]

 

And the bitmap used for importation

 

Japan_46_Bitmap.zip

 

Settings were:

 

N45

E116 (upper corner of map)

 

4100 km size map.

2000 m tile resolution

500m height resolution

 

100% Map Scale

110% Height Scale

 

You might want to expand slightly and include bomber bases in the Aleutian Islands. I think they were flying B-32 Dominators?

 

Also by 1946 wouldn't the Russians would be flying raids over Japan too. Or at least the Kuril Islands (Falcon 3 forever! ).

[MKSheppard 4]

I suppose it's possible to kick up the screen a little; so that we can have Hokkadio; as you know, Stalin was planning to invade the place after he'd taken Sakhalin...

 

OOH OOOH OOH. Wrenchie! We could modify this terrain set for the Japan War, between North Japan (Communsit) and South Japan (US), as well as for the Real World Korean War; allowing B-29s etc to be based in Japan, etc.

Edited July 24, 2009 by MKSheppard