Rolling Thunder '65

[Viper6]

I've been flying F-4C/D Rolling Thunder With Satan's Angels starting in 65-66 it is now 4-67. Was tasked a Strike Mission into the north and guess what? There were SA-2's waiting for us! I was very surprised and shocked to here SAM calls We made it back but we saw other flights going down in flames. Has any one else experienced this? I was surprised because up til then missions into the north were met with just AAA.

[Joe Hallenbeck]

Yep be carefull there will be more SA-2s than You could imagine :oD Brother's help from USSR!

[MigBuster]

Havnt played Rolling thunder for a while - the SAMs should come in from 65 though I think - cant remember without checking - and they are only the SA-2C version at first

[Viper6]

At the beginning of Rolling Thunder only thing we faced was AAA even up north but as of the spring of 67 it is SAM city up north and the numbers keep growing! and to top it all off, the F-4C/D models don't have RWR so I'm guessing as to where the SAM's are comming from

[+Jug]

At the beginning of Rolling Thunder only thing we faced was AAA even up north but as of the spring of 67 it is SAM city up north and the numbers keep growing! and to top it all off, the F-4C/D models don't have RWR so I'm guessing as to where the SAM's are comming from

I just put ECM and decoy dispensers on my Phantoms. It's cheating, but I can live with that because, according to what I have read, the real missions up north did not encounter the volume of SAMs that the game throws at you. They cost money and the NVA's source (USSR) was not a bottomless pit. They were very carefull and insisted on very tight launch parameters for their actual shots. That is also why they were pretty effective, given the technology of the day and feared by the aviators, who we all know are absolutely fearless.

[Viper6]

I tried that as well but the upgrades don't show up in WOV or WOE they show up in SFgold and i followed the same steps Jug what steps did you do to get the upgrades to show in WOV?

Edited March 11, 2009 by Viper6

[MigBuster]

At the beginning of Rolling Thunder only thing we faced was AAA even up north but as of the spring of 67 it is SAM city up north and the numbers keep growing! and to top it all off, the F-4C/D models don't have RWR so I'm guessing as to where the SAM's are comming from

 

Last time I played the stock RT 1965 they came in from 1965 - in the real thing the first F-4C was lost to an SA-2 on 24th July 1965 pretty sure that had no RWR either.

 

Having a tracKIR i used to listen for the SAM calls and spot the inbound direction - the early SAMs are easy to avoid if you keep it in your front 180 and change altitude by a few thousand ft - this is without any ECM/RWR/ countermeasures

 

To help pressing R when a SAM call is made will target the Site - you can then use F4 to give the direction of it.

 

One thing I used to do was put back the SA-2F start date to 1968 because they were death rays even with ECM - although I think these have been toned down in later patches

[Viper6]

My WOV is patched to the latest and I do use the R key to get direction and a lot of the times the SAM's are at my 5,6,7 and 8 o'clock. I'm waisting gas turning to keep them in front and in sight. I was thinking about trying again to mod the stock F-4's but I'll just live with what I got. Thanks for letting me vent

[MigBuster]

1 way If your back is turned is - get down low - put on your ground radar on and avoid any white dots till you hit freindly territory

[Viper6]

You know it! Now the really hard part starts: Linebacker I and II

[+Jug]

I tried that as well but the upgrades don't show up in WOV or WOE they show up in SFgold and i followed the same steps Jug what steps did you do to get the upgrades to show in WOV?

Attached is my Phantom addon file. It explains how to do this for the B, C, D, and E models.

Phantom_Addons.txt

[Viper6]

That is what i did to the stock F-4E in WoV and WoE and once in game the changes don't show

[+Jug]

That is what i did to the stock F-4E in WoV and WoE and once in game the changes don't show

Remember that you have to add the objects and then add the references to the object:

 

[FUSELAGE]

SystemNumber[012]=ECM

 

 

[ECM}

xxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxx

xxxxxxxxxxxxx

xxxxxx

 

 

 

 

Gotta have both or it won't show up. Also, ensure the numbering for the SystemNumber item is sequential.

Edited March 12, 2009 by Jug

[Viper6]

Yes, I did all those things and nada. here is the funny part, it works just fine on all other aircraft in all the TW sims Except stock planes in WoV and WoE here is the entries as it reads for all the F-4's

 

SystemName[019]=ECM

SystemName[020]=DecoyDispenser

 

[ECM]

SystemType=ECM_JAMMER

JammerType=DECEPTIVE_JAMMER

JammerStrength=300.0

MinExtentPosition= -0.23, 1.60, 0.74

MaxExtentPosition= 0.23, 2.99, 1.15

 

[DecoyDispenser]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition=0.0,0.0,-1.0

EjectVelocity=0.0,0.0,-1.0

NumFlare=60

NumChaff=300

MinExtentPosition= -0.23, 1.60, 0.74

MaxExtentPosition= 0.23, 2.99, 1.15

[+Crusader]

system names numbering must be in sequence, e.g. :

 

SystemName[018]=porkchop <---------- #18

SystemName[019]=ECM <---------------# 19

 

if it is interrupted, all stuff after the break in sequence wont be recognized, e.g. :

 

SystemName[016]=porkchop <---------- #16

SystemName[019]=ECM <---------------# 19

 

 

 

check for that if you copy & paste your new entries , re-number your new entries to match the sequence

[Viper6]

I did make sure that they are numbered correctly. I can't figured this out for the life of me

[Joe Hallenbeck]

Hey try to keep as low as possible. If You arriving from Thailand try to hide at Thud's ridge! They didn't see Ya until late. I prefer NAVY but cheats isn't needed for avoidance. Keep SAM in sight and make wild maneuvers and he lost You. SAMs aren't Archers ;o)

[Viper6]

I have no problem getting to the target area it was just a surprise to be met with SAM's in Rolling Thunder and if you noticed flying low will get you zapped by all manner of radar guided guns and once you get to the target area and pull up You WILL be met with a crazy amount of SAM launches lol

[+331Killerbee]

First SAM's...SA-2's fired in Vietnam at U.S. Aircraft.... 25th July 1965.

 

Here's a neat Article on it....

 

http://www.americanprofile.com/veterans/article/25838.html

 

Not only was the EF-10B used, But one would be hard pressed to find Information on the Pods being used. They were ALQ-31's and ALE-2A's.......

 

 

Semper Fi!

 

331KillerBee

Edited April 1, 2009 by 331Killerbee

[Viper6]

Copy that! Well I do know that the ECM pods don't do much to help and the C's and D's don't have RWR so it's all bad lol!

[+331Killerbee]

Yep, You're right.....

 

Here's an ALQ-31....

 

 

And here's an ALE-2A on the Outboard and a ALQ-31 on the Middle Station on the Wing closest to You on an EA-6A....

 

 

331KillerBee

Edited April 1, 2009 by 331Killerbee

[Lt. James Cater]

Copy that! Well I do know that the ECM pods don't do much to help and the C's and D's don't have RWR so it's all bad lol!

How i missed this thread i'll never know and i can't resist adding my 2 bits.

 

As noted above the first SAMs were firing in 65 with 66 being the worst year for US losses overall. I'm currently flying an A-6 in Rolling Thunder and have yet to hear a launch warning even though i've been up in RP6 about 10 times or so and it's August 1965. I'm enjoying it while i can knowing that the easy times are soon to end.

 

As for ECM pods i have a different view. From my experience it's made a noticible difference in coping with SAMs. From what i've seen, it' lessens the Fan Songs' tracking distance and so enables some gaps in certain areas where multiple site envelopes overlap.

 

If you do have a RHAW equipped plane you can watch the scope and make a reasonable guess on what kind of radar is looking at you judging from where it's bearing is at the current moment. If you don't have RHAW you'll learn soon enough where SAM sites are and with experience, will be able to judge how close you can get before they launch at you.