Computer Shopping

[Velvet 1]

Hi All,

 

It seems my old rig is dying a slow death, and I'm thinking about pulling the plug and getting a new machine. (Not being able to play OFF for the past couple of months is making the decision much easier).

 

Can those with blazing OFF performance provide some hardware suggestions? I'm aiming to be able to play OFF with a high fps at high detail and density levels.

 

Also, up to this point I've primarily bought DELL machines, but I feel there is probably better sources. Any suggestions? I'm in CT - USA.

 

Thanks All,

 

Velvet

[JohnGresham 0]

Hi All,

 

It seems my old rig is dying a slow death, and I'm thinking about pulling the plug and getting a new machine. (Not being able to play OFF for the past couple of months is making the decision much easier).

 

Can those with blazing OFF performance provide some hardware suggestions? I'm aiming to be able to play OFF with a high fps at high detail and density levels.

 

Also, up to this point I've primarily bought DELL machines, but I feel there is probably better sources. Any suggestions? I'm in CT - USA.

 

Thanks All,

 

Velvet

 

Build your own, it's cheaper and you'll get much more bang for your buck!

[Siggi 10]

Hi All,

 

It seems my old rig is dying a slow death, and I'm thinking about pulling the plug and getting a new machine. (Not being able to play OFF for the past couple of months is making the decision much easier).

 

Can those with blazing OFF performance provide some hardware suggestions? I'm aiming to be able to play OFF with a high fps at high detail and density levels.

 

Also, up to this point I've primarily bought DELL machines, but I feel there is probably better sources. Any suggestions? I'm in CT - USA.

 

Thanks All,

 

Velvet

 

Get an E-series Intel CPU on a good over-clockable mobo, and at least an 8800GTX graphics card and also 2gb of RAM. My OFF flys with that real sweet, at very high detail settings. The newer 2-series graphics cards are cheaper now (I believe the Nvidia 260 is sub £150 now, cheaper if you're a Yank and buying in dollars) and is far more powerful than an 8800. My E8400 is clocked to 4gb and has been running at that for a good few months now, on air cooling. :)

[NS13Jarhead 6]

I'm partially with Gimpy on this one if you can't/won't build your own. But I'd recommend going with a local "geek store" (not BestBuy) rather than an online one like IBuyPower. I have bought an IBP machine before and thought it was a pretty good bang for the buck, but the local guys (I now use http://www.gtcomp.com/) can actually talk to you and find out what you want and make rational recommendations. These guys actually take pride in crafting a fast machine that goes beyond what you're looking for, because they're computer enthusiasts, too. Also, I thought this human interaction was more satisfying than clicking on a bunch of pull down menus. And as an added bonus, they didn't install anything other than the OS and a free, full version of Crysis. No AO-Hell, Norton, McAffee, or other "free" trials that you have to de-crapify off of your machine at a later date. Just a very neat and clean install. And when the motherboard had a bad capacitor about six months later, they not only replaced it for free, they upgraded it to the current standard board by that company (Abit IP35-E to IP35-P).

[sitting_duck 3]

hate to make recommendations, as it is crazy to listen to someone you dont know!!

 

hopefully you will get enough suggestions to point you in a direction where you can research it all for yourself, imho, a must.

 

build,,,dont go dell..(imho)

 

e8500 3.16 dual core is fine for off. Off gets no benifit from a quad core, but that doesnt mean that off5 wont eithere....

 

64bit os is a must...you dont want to be sitting on 2gigs of ram onna 2k$ machine..

research the ram,,,make sure you are getting timing cycles around 5 if possible,,,,i got cheap ram,,and am kicking myself for it..

 

I dont think i would ever consider sli or crossfire on a dualcore...upper end video cards are going to be ahead of the processor..why go 2..

 

nvida280. I am Not sold on the 285 (or any multiple core gpu card ) yet.

 

Go raid over a 10krmp single drive....

 

spend a lousy 20 bucks and put a floppy drive in it...when you sitting there with the floppydisk for the raid controller drivers you will be kicking your self if you dont...

 

biggest best cooler you can afford...just take that stock one and donate it to someplace...

 

newegg.com for parts...and pay attention to the reviews..

 

ask,,,ask...ask...ask....cant do enought asking...

[Velvet 1]

Thanks for all the advice, now to do some research.

[Velvet 1]

All right, I'm feeling ambitious and plan to build my own rig. Using all of your input as a starting point, this is what I've come up with:

 

Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Processor, 3.0 GHz

ASUS P5Q-E Green Mobo - Intel P45 chipset

EVGA GeForce GTX 285 FTW Video Card - 1GB

Kingston Hper X Dual Channel 4096 MB PC8500 DDR2 1066 MHz (2x2048MB) Memory

Creative Labs Soundblaster X-Fi Xtreme Bamer PCI Sound Card

Western Digital 750GB 7200rpm 32MB harddrive

 

Anyone see any gotchas?

 

I haven't decided on the OS to use yet. I'm torn between Vista 32 or Vista 64 bit. From what I've heard, the 64 bit will allow me to expand memory, but there may be some driver compatibility issues with the 64 bit system (I'm using TrackIR, Pro Pedals and a Logitec Wingman stick). There's also Windows 7 on the horizon, but given Vista's less than stellar intro, I'm a bit gun shy about making that leap any time soon. Any comments out there on OSs?

 

Thanks all,

 

Velvet

[+Polovski 460]

That's pretty much what I have now same CPU and mobo (PQ5 Delux) (suped up higher o/c 280GTX not 285 though) and it runs it at 1920x1200 full everything very nicely so you should be good to go.

E8400 is overclocked to 3.7Ghz with a big cooler.

 

Or you can go for a the new Intel i920- good great for overclocking.

[Test Pilot 0]

As far as OS go, Im a big Vista 64 fan. It hasnt let me down yet and has proven to be far more stable than XP was for me. That being said, I have Win 7 beta running and actually like it a lot. Plus people seem to be reporting improved perfromance with programs in it than Vista. As far as early teething issues with Win 7, it's based on Vista with a desktop design and a few tweeks here and there. But it's still Vista deep down which also means that drivers working with Vista work with Win7. No real reason not to go with 64bit as I have never had a driver issue (and supposing you do, 64bit will supplant 32bit and so driver support only will get better). 64 bit also means more secure (though as more apps become 64bit that is less of a factor) and have a slight numbers crunching edge over 32bit. Plus the ram. If youre building a new computer, might as well build it for now and the future. So Win 7 64 is my vote. Could see if you can get a free upgrade from Vista when Win 7 comes out, or try the Win 7 beta in the meantime which is fully running until March next year.

 

A side note about a system, dont count AMD's quad cores out. Their newest quad(the Phenom II 965 is supposed to be out in the next few days....) is clocked at 3.4ghz stock and is very overclockable (pushing 3.8 on air cooling) if youre so inclined. Might not be the numbers crunching machine that Intels are, but many benchmarks show the AMD Phenom IIs to be the equal of the i7 in some games. Plus the price may be less. Even if OFF doesnt use 4 cores, the rest of the computer does. I have a 2.2ghz quad and while the processor speed isnt that great and I cant get run scenery and terrain high, the fact that I have four cores means I never have to worry about what other programs are running that would affect performance. (Never had a high speed dual core though so maybe running other process simulatenously doesnt affect performance either...)

 

But once youre over 3.0ghz, you probably cant go too wrong anyways in your selection! :)

Edited July 5, 2009 by Test Pilot

[sitting_duck 3]

I would consider a board that has sli or crossfire support.

 

Even if its not a consideration now (going dual cards) it would be a shame to find the next generation of games you are going to play need it, and not have it available....

plus,,looked at the price of that board quickly at target, and sli supported boards are not that much more.

 

would go 3.16 over 3.0ghz ,,not that much more in price,,

 

and would stick with on board sound. one,,you clear up a pci slot,,,(that board only has 2), and on board sound has gotten a lot better, and imho is just as good if not better than pci cards..

 

do not use stock cooler,,,get the best one you can. That board doesnt seem to have a huge northbridge heatsink, but if you select another board,,make sure the cooler clears the heatsink (they are getting really big these days)

[Velvet 1]

Sounds like a 64 bit system is the way to go.

 

I checked the ASU P5Q-E stats, and it claims to be CrossFireX ready. I believe that will allow me to have dualing graphic cards (I think the documents mentioned the possiblity of 3 GCs if I use the PCI slot as well).

 

Any thoughts on the Intel Core 2 Quads? They use the 755 connector like the Duo. Or is the 755 connector starting to be a thing of the past?

 

Velvet

[Broadside uda Barn 0]

Just a couple of thoughts:

 

If you're going to build a new rig, build with the best parts that you can:

 

Dont go dual core, it's a dead technology. Socket 775 is a dead end now...

Even the 9550 quad core is a dead tech...the new intel chips are current and only a few dollars more (i920 is excellent and in some cases (like the 9550) is only $60 more than the now dead technology.

Dont go with a stock cooler, even if you plan not to overclock.

 

Do yourself a favor and get a good PSU (power supply unit). A cheap one can blow your whole system if it goes.

This is an important one....

 

A thought on SLi....it really doesnt pay. Really it doesnt. You are better off buying one good video card, than two lesser ones, as the increase doesnt really amount to all that much. Multiple GPUs have yet to deliver...unless you have lots of $$ to spend on a system. If you're on a budget, then best to put the few extra dollars in a better CPU. Triple GPUs is not going to give you much more either. Is 10% more graphics power worth the extra Cash/power draw on your PSU/etc? Not unless, again, you have the cash for it.

In the future, rather than matching your existing video card in SLi or Crossfire mode, why not get an updated graphics card that is (likely) as fast as 2 or 3 of your current cards?

 

You can save on the sound card. On board sound is actually VERY good now.

 

Vista or XP? XP is still more stable and windows 7 is just around the corner. XP will only read 3gb of your RAM, but windows 7 is an upgrade that I think most of will be making, so for a few extra $ go with 2 sticks of 3gb RAM. Buy quality RAM (OCZ, Corsair, etc)...it makes a difference.

 

and yes, a floppy is a must...I recommend a floppy/SD reader. It's one of the greatest upgrades I've ever made

 

I guess a huge factor is your budget in all of this....

 

As stated, there's a lot of opinions....so best advice (other than dont go cheap on a PSU), is: buy the best you can afford. It'll serve you in the long run.

Edited July 5, 2009 by Broadside uda Barn

[Velvet 1]

Another iteration. I think this covers all the bases, should keep happily running P3 & P4 for a few years and will allow me to grow some in the future.

 

Intel Core i7 920 2.66Ghz Processor

ASUS P6T mobo (sli & crossfire support)

6GB Corsair Core i7 Dominator PC12800 DDR3 RAM - tri-channel, 1600MHz (3x2048MB)

EVGA GeForce GTX 285 FTW Video Card - 1GB

Western Digital 750GB 7200rpm 32MB harddrive

Ultra LPS750 750watt powersupply

Ultra 3.5" Floppy and multi-card reader

Plextor Blue-ray, dvdr, cdrom drive

Noctua NH-U12P SE1366 CPU Cooler (it looks like a beast)

Vista 64bit system

 

Do any of you computer gurus see any gaps?

 

Thanks again,

 

Velvet

[Test Pilot 0]

Another iteration. I think this covers all the bases, should keep happily running P3 & P4 for a few years and will allow me to grow some in the future.

 

Intel Core i7 920 2.66Ghz Processor

ASUS P6T mobo (sli & crossfire support)

6GB Corsair Core i7 Dominator PC12800 DDR3 RAM - tri-channel, 1600MHz (3x2048MB)

EVGA GeForce GTX 285 FTW Video Card - 1GB

Western Digital 750GB 7200rpm 32MB harddrive

Ultra LPS750 750watt powersupply

Ultra 3.5" Floppy and multi-card reader

Plextor Blue-ray, dvdr, cdrom drive

Noctua NH-U12P SE1366 CPU Cooler (it looks like a beast)

Vista 64bit system

 

 

Do any of you computer gurus see any gaps?

 

Thanks again,

 

Velvet

 

 

 

 

Get yourself one of these and let us know how they help OFF

 

http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCategory.as...lid-State-Disks

Edited July 7, 2009 by Test Pilot

[Velvet 1]

Get yourself one of these and let us know how they help OFF

 

http://www.newegg.com/Store/SubCategory.as...lid-State-Disks

 

 

Hmmm... they look a little pricey, plus I'm not sure there's an advantage over a more traditional hard drive. Then again, I'm not familar with solid state drives.

[Test Pilot 0]

A solid state drive is really no different than a USB flash stick, just bigger (usually!) and internal just like a traditional hard drive. They are set to replace mechanical HDs in the near future since they dont have any moving parts (meaning more durable and shock resistant) and can run much faster. Presumably in games like flight sim where files for textures are constantly being pulled from the HD the faster access speed is appreciable. Plus they are silent. But still as can be seen very expensive though the price has dropped quite a bit. Probably worth waiting for a year or so yet to let more of their bugs and price settle down :)

 

 

Reports of Solid State Drives' performance in a RAID setup are phenomenal!!!

Edited July 7, 2009 by Test Pilot

[Broadside uda Barn 0]

Another iteration. I think this covers all the bases, should keep happily running P3 & P4 for a few years and will allow me to grow some in the future.

 

Intel Core i7 920 2.66Ghz Processor

ASUS P6T mobo (sli & crossfire support)

6GB Corsair Core i7 Dominator PC12800 DDR3 RAM - tri-channel, 1600MHz (3x2048MB)

EVGA GeForce GTX 285 FTW Video Card - 1GB

Western Digital 750GB 7200rpm 32MB harddrive

Ultra LPS750 750watt powersupply

Ultra 3.5" Floppy and multi-card reader

Plextor Blue-ray, dvdr, cdrom drive

Noctua NH-U12P SE1366 CPU Cooler (it looks like a beast)

Vista 64bit system

 

Do any of you computer gurus see any gaps?

 

Thanks again,

 

Velvet

 

Hrm...where did you find that Power Supply? I searched on Newegg but couldnt find it.

This is what I put in the rig I have now:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16817139006

Corsair makes a good PSU. AT $90 (after rebates) that's a great deal. One thing to keep in mind is that if you do decide to go SLi down the road, you'll need quite a bit more power. This 750w will run SLI and Crossfire, but depending on what you have in the system, the power might be close....just a thought.

 

I'm with Al regarding the graphics card. If you have the $, great, get the best you can. However, just under that best card are more reasonably priced cards. The EVGA 285 on newegg is $329 (after rebate)...that's a big jump from the 280

Here's a 280 for $230 (after rebate)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16814130492

and a 260 for $154 (after rebate)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16814130434

 

however, here's an article on Tom's hardware about why the 285 warrants purchasing even tho it's only about a 6% increase in performance...

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforc...x-285,2139.html

if you can afford it, great, if not, your options are also pretty outstanding.

 

 

Lastly, make sure your cpu cooler will fit in your current case (I'm assuming you're not getting a new one?). I went with a monstrous cooler and couldnt tell whether it would fit by the dimensions it gave. However, when I got it, (and I had my dremmel ready to cut the case if I had to), it fit....providing that I put the side window fan on the outside, instead of its normal mount on the inside. Get your tape measure out and make sure it'll fit. :yes: Dont want that to be the hold up in your build... From what I found, all the i7 coolers are monsters, tho, so there's not that many to choose from.

 

HTH

 

BuB

[Velvet 1]

Bub,

 

The power supply is listed on Tigerdirect.com. I plan to get a new case, I had picked out the Cooler Master Centurion (sound impressive eh?) also on Tigerdirect. I kind of figured that I can give the CPU cooler a go, and return it if size is an issue (thus the build delay you mentioned).

 

Unleal & Co,

 

Thanks for the suggestions on the Graphics cards, I reconsider the lower price options. After all, almost whatever I get will blow the socks off my current rig, and there's always the option to upgrade later.

 

Test Pilot,

 

I'm going to have to pass on the SS drive for now. That's way to futuristic for me. Plus isn't it your job to "test"?

[sitting_duck 3]

Sounds like a 64 bit system is the way to go.

 

I checked the ASU P5Q-E stats, and it claims to be CrossFireX ready. I believe that will allow me to have dualing graphic cards (I think the documents mentioned the possiblity of 3 GCs if I use the PCI slot as well).

 

Any thoughts on the Intel Core 2 Quads? They use the 755 connector like the Duo. Or is the 755 connector starting to be a thing of the past?

 

Velvet

 

 

crossfire is for ati...sli is for nvidia,,,and pretty sure you are going nvidia

 

so,,that board will not support 2 nvidai cards,,,it will support 2 ati cards...

[Velvet 1]

Thanks for the heads up Sitting Duck. My latest itteration has both sli and crossfire support I believe (The P6T board). I'm slowly learning....

[Duce Lewis 3]

A solid state drive is really no different than a USB flash stick, just bigger (usually!) and internal just like a traditional hard drive. They are set to replace mechanical HDs in the near future since they dont have any moving parts (meaning more durable and shock resistant) and can run much faster. Presumably in games like flight sim where files for textures are constantly being pulled from the HD the faster access speed is appreciable. Plus they are silent. But still as can be seen very expensive though the price has dropped quite a bit. Probably worth waiting for a year or so yet to let more of their bugs and price settle down :)

 

 

Reports of Solid State Drives' performance in a RAID setup are phenomenal!!!

TP, I used to work in the motor industry

We developed Spindle Motor Prototypes for Hard Drives

They look like a Spool of thread and are extremely precise, high speed screamers

 

IBM was begging us to put them into production

Sticking Point was who would pay for the considerable tooling, Clean Rooms, Precision Maching Centers, etc

One of our engineers threw a wrench into it when he stated the "HardCard" was about to replace the HD anyways

That was in the early/mid nineties, HD's were about 40 MB and the HardCards were up to about 20 MB

 

Well we balked and IBM went elasewhere

HardCards/Solid State Drives have been chasing HD's ever since and never quite catching up

Their problem has alweays been cost and the ever increasing need for Memory

HD have been able to add discs and write data closer together - cheap

If you want to double the memory of a Hard Card - the cost doubles

 

Hard Cards do have a definate spedd and reliability advantage

But 95% of applications (Excel/Word) don't require high speed and Intranet backup covers the reliability

They've been predicting the demise of the HD for many years, butI don't think it'll happen for a while yet

 

Adding a smaller Solid State Drive to accomadate Sims is a great idea though

[Test Pilot 0]

TP, I used to work in the motor industry

We developed Spindle Motor Prototypes for Hard Drives

They look like a Spool of thread and are extremely precise, high speed screamers

 

IBM was begging us to put them into production

Sticking Point was who would pay for the considerable tooling, Clean Rooms, Precision Maching Centers, etc

One of our engineers threw a wrench into it when he stated the "HardCard" was about to replace the HD anyways

That was in the early/mid nineties, HD's were about 40 MB and the HardCards were up to about 20 MB

 

Well we balked and IBM went elasewhere

HardCards/Solid State Drives have been chasing HD's ever since and never quite catching up

Their problem has alweays been cost and the ever increasing need for Memory

HD have been able to add discs and write data closer together - cheap

If you want to double the memory of a Hard Card - the cost doubles

 

Hard Cards do have a definate spedd and reliability advantage

But 95% of applications (Excel/Word) don't require high speed and Intranet backup covers the reliability

They've been predicting the demise of the HD for many years, butI don't think it'll happen for a while yet

 

Adding a smaller Solid State Drive to accomadate Sims is a great idea though

 

 

That's the history of technology... the next big thing (eg. SDD) will change everything! But it never happens.... Ha, well I can always hope for it nonetheless!

[Check Six 2]

I'm typing this on my "old" computer. My new gaming machine is sitting behind me. I picked it up today.

 

 

I have a USB Wireless Broadband connection, so I suppose I'll be able to connect to the internet on it, but I don't want to connect it to the net just yet. I will keep this one for checking my emails, posting threads here, just general stuff. Now I need to buy a new monitor for the old one, maybe some speakers.

 

Intel Core 2 Quad Q9650 CPU

Kingston 4GB DDR2 800 RAM

300GB 10krpm SATA Hard Disk

Nvidia 1.792GB GTX295 PCI Express Card

Inwin Midi Tower case with high wattage output and cooling fans

Dual Layer DVD-RW

Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi Xtreme Gamer

Cambridge 5.1 Speaker System

MS Windows XP Pro

Logitech G-19 Gaming Keyboard

Plantronics 777 Surround Sound Headset

 

Saitek X-52 Flight Control System

Saitek Pro Flight Rudder Pedals

TrackIR 5

Edited July 8, 2009 by Steve Drew

[Duce Lewis 3]

That's the history of technology... the next big thing (eg. SDD) will change everything! But it never happens.... Ha, well I can always hope for it nonetheless!

I'm hoping too

[Broadside uda Barn 0]

Bub,

 

The power supply is listed on Tigerdirect.com. I plan to get a new case, I had picked out the Cooler Master Centurion (sound impressive eh?) also on Tigerdirect. I kind of figured that I can give the CPU cooler a go, and return it if size is an issue (thus the build delay you mentioned).

 

Unleal & Co,

 

Thanks for the suggestions on the Graphics cards, I reconsider the lower price options. After all, almost whatever I get will blow the socks off my current rig, and there's always the option to upgrade later.

 

Test Pilot,

 

I'm going to have to pass on the SS drive for now. That's way to futuristic for me. Plus isn't it your job to "test"?

 

 

Enjoy your new rig Velvet! See you on the front lines soon!