PRESS RELEASE PRE-PURCHASE “DCS: A-10C WARTHOG”

[+Spectre_USA 7]

Spec

 

I would post those finds about the GAU-8 on the beta forum because I also ran into the same issue. I think your background with working on them will carry alot of weight in getting that corrected. A GAU-8 should of split those BMP's open like sticking a pencil through aluminum foil.

 

Already done did that, but maybe under the incorrect topic.

 

I would also like to whine about the CBU-87's and 97's. I have actually witnessed from an aerial platform the effects of

those air-bursting bad-boys. Popped a pair on a platton of Arty's, obscured `em all, but they remained unscathed.

 

Soviet super-steel?

 

Will have to add that as well...

 

___EDIT___

 

Had to add the comment I was referring to, as I did not see all the posts since Dave's.

 

As to SimHQ, I shant comment, as the feud between them and my site, CombatSim.com, pre-dates

this bit of simulation satisfaction.

 

I think it predates the predecessor, BioHazCentral, IIRC....

Edited October 13, 2010 by Spectre_USA

[Guest Magnum50]

oh Jedi's just fine, much respected and loved at SimHQ, by most if not all. (Damn his job for blocking our site!)

 

IMO, both SimHQ and Combat Ace serve the same purpose, bring news to the masses of gamers who like the games we cover. (we just do it better, lol...jk)

 

But whats different between us... well we don't allow members/staff to openly bash Combat Ace or it's admins, unfortunately we don't always get the same respect I've noticed sometimes as a casual visitor here... But I love all sim gamers, so I forgive, and move on. ;)

 

I do wish your land section had more activity thou, since land combat rules! You can't capture terrain with only air units! ;)

[JediMaster 451]

Stupid DoD proxy filters are a blight upon the face of humanity.

 

As for our land combat area, I wish we had more too. Unfortunately, you can't force people to show! I don't think enough of our TK fans are into the ground stuff, and the ones that are must visit other sites.

[+Dave 2,322]

oh Jedi's just fine, much respected and loved at SimHQ, by most if not all. (Damn his job for blocking our site!)

 

IMO, both SimHQ and Combat Ace serve the same purpose, bring news to the masses of gamers who like the games we cover. (we just do it better, lol...jk)

 

But whats different between us... well we don't allow members/staff to openly bash Combat Ace or it's admins, unfortunately we don't always get the same respect I've noticed sometimes as a casual visitor here... But I love all sim gamers, so I forgive, and move on. ;)

 

I do wish your land section had more activity thou, since land combat rules! You can't capture terrain with only air units! ;)

 

Hi Mag

 

Good to see you. Its not really SimHQ itself I have a problem with as much as some people there I have beef with. They know who they are and they know why. However never had a problem with you Mag and love reading your stuff over there. I will admit I am guilty of that bashing though. I often think that if we were all in a bar right now things would be different and maybe easier to get a point across.

 

I wish our ground section was more active here too. In fact I am going out of my flight simming zone and going to work on maybe reviewing Medal of Honor. Have any tips?

[Ruggbutt 45]

On the other side of the "Spectrum of Stupiduty" ^tm you have the ultra ED fascists who won't tolerate even a hint of constructive criticism. Jedi is perfectly entitled to his concerns, if you purchase a product, you are in effect putting bread on the developers and publishers tables therefore if they value their product, and by extension their livelihood, they will want to listen to what people have to say. Everybody has the right to an opinion, the trouble only starts when people are unwilling to allow others to have theirs too, usually out of some misplaced sense of loyalty to a particular game or dev.

Excellent point. I bought the beta, and was immediately banned by ED's producer. I thought after 5 years he'd stop having a hard on for me. So I contacted tech support and requested my money back. Part of the deal was access to the beta forums. I wasn't afforded that deal and after being replied to by ED's customer service and explaining that I would never be able to post in their forums my email has been silent. Looks like it's off to my credit card company to file a fraud charge. I'm going to be downtown next week, prolly file a complaint with AZ Attorney General as well.

 

I don't care that a particular person who works for ED doesn't like me or won't grant me rights that I've purchased. However, I expect to be treated like every other customer who has laid down their cash. It's unprofessional and it shows that the integrity of said producer goes out the window when my $60 means nothing while the rest of yours means something. I'd have even been happy had on the main page it said "everyone who preorders gets the beta and access to the beta forums except ruggbutt". At least then I'd have been apprised of the situation before purchase.

 

ED are fascists on their boards and so is their producer.

[Cali 6]

I talked to one of the mods at SimHQ about some of the things going on there. His reply back to me was reasonable, but I still have my doubts after I saw something posted on ed's forums. I still think my feeling about the deal is correct. JM, I thought your post were good and it was your feelings on how you see things. Some people took it the wrong way for sure or have other thoughts behind their post as well.

[GwynO 16]

I'm sorry to hear that Ruggbutt, it sounds like you've been treated abysmally and I hope you get somewhere with the legal approach. As much as I want to "believe" in a particular game or sim, I'll never get sucked into all the fanboy fascism stuff that goes on, I lurked on ED forums in the past but wouldn't dare say what I really felt because I knew what that would result in. There's only one thread I'm following over there now and that's not about ED products. I intend to enjoy the product without getting into any kind of dialogue with the surrounding fascists, sad really as it's basically giving up. I suppose the customer relationship some favour is a Coca Cola kind.. they make a product, we lap it up, end of. With a flight sim though, it just isn't the same, many times there will be people playing who know more about the actual subject matter represented than anyone on the dev team or so it would appear , the comments here about effectiveness of the GAU-8 for starters.

 

Ah well.. coke anyone?

[JediMaster 451]

If ED ignores my concerns, that's their right, but some of the people in that thread seemed to feel I should just STFU and dance a naked jig for the honor of being allowed to buy a study sim.

 

I've been simming for over 20 years, and I love study sims as much as survey sims, but for different reasons. No one laments their virtual elimination from the scene more than I, but to blow sunshine up a dev's ass is counterproductive. I understand why they started DCS with Ka-50, and as it's never been in a sim before (although similar to the Ka-52 in EECH) I was happy with that choice. The A-10C I was happy with for those reasons plus I wanted something more accurately modeled than the A-10A in FC (which was always overly easy to fly and fight in, it's barely more difficult than TK's A-10). I'm just worried what may (or may not) come next, and I think every ED customer should have their say.

I've never used the forums over there, only read some things, so I can't comment how people are or aren't treated, but if that thread at SimHQ is an indicator, that's not beneficial.

 

I didn't demand "do this plane!" or "don't do that or I refuse to buy!" even though a differently worded request saying the same thing wouldn't be out of line, I just think what they've said about how they're going to proceed and the timeline of that path is very worrying and it got me emotional. That was weak of me to allow that, I should've posted a day later after I'd had some time to cool down.

 

 

[+Dave 2,322]

As if anyone didnt know, I like the Thirdwire series of sims. Having said that though, I dont go into other forums for hit and run "My sim is better than yours" tactics. The Thirdwire series is what it is. It has its warts but there is more good with it than bad. In fact I dont think I stand up here and say Tk's sims are better than others. I prefer them yes, but the my sim is better than your sim arguement is so freakin' dumb. I have said this before, I m a fliht sim junkie. There are those I like and those I dislike but that is everyone. The whole crowd of you either like my sim or you're a loser is never going to go away though. The over the top uber Falcon 4 crowd is a prime example. The zealots of that sim is what led me to quit playing it. It seemed like no matter what you said about the sim, a zealot would come in and tell you why F4 was ALWAYS better. Remember the F4 vs LOMAC flame fest? I am sure some F4 fan has bought the DCS A-10C beta and started comparing start up procedures between each sim on what is more techincally correct. I can see it now, "Well in Falcon 4, you have to turn this switch 4 times which is more correct than the A-10C sim which doesnt model this at all."

Its great to have loyality and passion for your sim, but in the end everyone is going to like what they like and have an opinion on it.

 

 

[Ruggbutt 45]

Good point Dave. The F4 crowd is the reason I left Frugal's. That and the good 'ol boy clique. Basically you could talk mad smack to anyone you wanted as long as you were in the kool kidz krowd. LOMAC bashing was part of that. The funniest thing is that one of the most vocal LOMAC/ED bashers is now posting on ED's forums and decrying how wonderful ED and DCS is. DCS: A10 is going to be killer when it's finished, no doubt. But I just find it funny that the aforementioned gentleman (Mower) is now a convert. What's next? Bard is gonna show up and give ED love too?

[GwynO 16]

Amen Dave and Ruggbutt! I could say something bitchy about some (and I stress, thankfully "some", as in no where near all) of the people on the other forum I frequent.. s**t, I think I just did! Anyway, point is, Hate the Sin not the Sinner kind of thing, Love the Game, not the Whiners .. ah you all know what I mean, take everything with a pinch of salt and a shot of tequila

[JediMaster 451]

Don't forget a personal peeve of mine, the "I'm a SIMMER" types. The ones who will get upset if you call DCS/F4/whatever a "game" and say "it's a SIM not a GAME" because, after all, they play it and are obviously above such childish things as playing a mere GAME. They handily ignore the fact that these sims use all the same methods GAMES do, including awarding points, saying you won or lost, mission fail/complete, etc.

I just want to tell them to get over themselves, they're not above the rest of us or superior in any manner because they only fly sims with everything set "full real."

[+Dave 2,322]

Don't forget a personal peeve of mine, the "I'm a SIMMER" types. The ones who will get upset if you call DCS/F4/whatever a "game" and say "it's a SIM not a GAME" because, after all, they play it and are obviously above such childish things as playing a mere GAME. They handily ignore the fact that these sims use all the same methods GAMES do, including awarding points, saying you won or lost, mission fail/complete, etc.

I just want to tell them to get over themselves, they're not above the rest of us or superior in any manner because they only fly sims with everything set "full real."

 

Guilty as charged JM. However I do not think I'm superior because I call it a sim. Its my preference to call it that.

[GwynO 16]

They're all games unless you're doing it under the auspices of a training regime intended to fly the real thing, in real life, where you really live, or really die. Anything less is always going to be a game. A fun game, a hard game, a compelling game, but it will always be a game. It's all a matter about how you mean it, some of us when we say we're simmers mean we enjoy switching off our disbelief for some entertainment just like we might watch Flight of The Intruder, or read Phoenix Squadron, to imagine ourselves in those situations, to have some fun or to help us understand what is an interesting subject for us. There will always be the Walter Mitty types too, who actually believe, because they can do X, Y and Z in a game, and it's called a "sim" with all the fancy bells and whistles, procedures and buttons to memorize, that they earn some sort of kudos as "could do" guys should they bring back the draft. I like it when the guys with real life experience chip in and the Walts suddenly get a bit shy.. If they're such hot shots then they would have joined up surely? It's even worse in some ways with the ground warfare gamers, the snot nosed punks who think because they can bunny hop all across Iraq in MOH that they're somehow real life hard nuts that just too good for the real thing. You get them from time to time here in the Guz, people passing themselves off as having some special insight when all they've done is sit in front of an X box or PS3, needless to say they don't last long past freshers week!

[Cali 6]

I never really understood the fight between F4 and Lock on, they are 2 different beast. It'll be like comparing Roseanne Barr against Jessica Biel they are totally different. Falcon has things that lock on doesn't have and still don't have after a few patches. Even having a better graphics engine the nights in lock on is nothing compared to F4, F4 looks way better. But F4 has some horrible graphics compared to lock on. F4 simulates 1 jet, well lock on does more then 5. Like you guys said, it's a game, we play it on the computer, it's a game. And like Rugg said, Mower seems like a die hard DCS fan now. I remember him always bashing lock on, but he has been spamming the ed forums over the last few weeks. I don't think the F4 fans are gonna bash DCS, but they might not be truly happy until they get a fighter, but that is how most of us feel. I said it beofre and I'll say it again, it's gonna be some years down the road until we have enough jets like in lock on.

[JediMaster 451]

Arguments over whether a particular title is a sim or just a game are neither here nor there, I just mean the types that only fly F4 or Il-2 or whatever and say they don't touch anything else because the ones they fly are "sims". Of course some people enjoy the more educational button-pushing nature of the hardcore sims and others enjoy just hopping in and flying around for 30 mins without having to put their study cap on, there's nothing wrong with either idea. I don't have a problem on paper with such games as Ace Combat and HAWX, it's when people say "they're pretty realistic" that I spit up whatever I was drinking. For some people, "excellent graphics" = "realistic" regardless of modeling of how things are!

 

It's a circular ego stroke. By saying such and such is a sim, they inflate its rep, then they state that they only fly that, to inflate their own rep. Another hallmark of the "wannabe officer" vs the normal sim pilot is that they complain when a new sim coming out will need more than their 4 yr old PC can handle that "I'm not going to spend hundreds of dollars to upgrade just for this". Well, no, you shouldn't "just for this", you should because EVERY newer game will run better, but since they ONLY play 1 or 2 sims the cost is harder to justify so instead they wail about how the developers want everyone to be rich or something. I never have fewer than a dozen games on my PC (that's counting every TK sim as ONE), from flight sims to racing sims to FPS to RTS to the occasional Tomb Raider or other oddball genre. I'm a gamer, and it's not something to be ashamed of, but these people think it is so they have to emphasize just how real their sim of choice is and how they're better than "gamers". The F4 and Il-2 sites are full of these people. They're like the ones that claim they don't ever shop at Walmart because it's so low-brow, like there's something wrong with buying the same bottle of milk they sell at the grocery stores but for 50 cents less. It's all about making themselves feel better at the expense of putting others down.

[+Dave 2,322]

Ah I see your point. Me calling them sims does not me better than them, I have never thought that. I have however seen the people you are talking about.

[Cali 6]

Beta 2 is out for those that have A-10C already. http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=1018903