Increasing speed?

[tacoscent]

How would I go about increasing the speed of the aircraft, as in the top speed at altitude, without increasing the overall thrust. For example, there are 2 planes I know of right now, that seem pretty gibbled in terms of speed, regardless of what I set the thrust to. Those are, the F35, and the J10. What would I need to change in order for these planes not to hit a barrier? The j10 seems to hit one at mach 2.10. The F35 much earlier.

 

I know how to change the mach limit, so that isnt a problem. Both mach limits are at mach 3, I dont wish them to go that fast, I wish to solve the barrier which prevents them from going very fast. Also flaps are not an issue.

 

Where in the flight model can I change the characteristics to make it say, more aerodynamic, while still mantaining the overall flight model. I have no experiance with flight models, I am no expert on planes.

Im just a guy who likes fast jets. So any help from the experts who know about all this stuff would be appreciated.

 

Perhaps too see what I am talking about, fire up wings over israel, or wings over europe or w.e you have. Put the flight sim on normal difficulty. DL the j10 and get it to above 15k meters with full after burner. You will see, that regardless of even good increases in thrust, and obviously with the mach limit set high, it hits a wall around mach 2.1 . I wish to be able to solve that. Thanks for your time anyone who looks into this matter. Take care you guys.

Edited December 11, 2010 by tacoscent

[+FastCargo]

Well, considering you are trying to alter the fundamental laws that govern airborne flight, it would probably help to have at least a basic understanding of the terms used, which means becoming somewhat familiar with aircraft in general.

 

Assuming you are, the 2 main forces you are concerned with are Thrust and Drag. Increasing one and decreasing the other will get you your higher speed.

 

First, look here for definitions of some of the terms used in the flight model of each aerodynamic component:

 

http://combatace.com/topic/21867-definitions-of-aero-coefficients/page__p__96438

 

And look here for definitions on the Engine data:

 

http://combatace.com/topic/12100-basic-ini-editing-enginex/page__p__52908

 

After reading these sections, you should have a basic idea of what you need to manipulate to go fast.

 

FC

[+daddyairplanes]

also while not well versed in aerodynamics or FM's i do believe both of those aircraft have fixed inlets and therefore limited top speeds. with exception to the next generation bomber that is still in the designers brain pans, the worlds airforces seem to have traded max top speed for range, stealth, manueverability and precision capability(a2a and a2g). while it is fun in game to take the F-23 upto Mach 2.35 at 800 ft AGL it is not terribly realistic.(for those askin what im doin that for, ya then zoom to 101,000 ft , flip, dive and JDAM yer target like in Stealth. good times!)

[+Fubar512]

In my experience, the most likely causes are overly conservative drag values, and drag tables, for all aerodynamic surfaces.

[Stingray72]

Not sure if this was thought about by the originator, but the F-35's advertised speed is Mach 1.6+, indicating that it is probably faster than 1.6, but I would guess not that much.

 

Like Daddy was saying, the US is building planes for specific reasons and missions, not to go faster than anything else in a straight line; that's 1950's and 60's thinking, John Boyd and the Fighter Mafia put a stop to this with planes like the F-15 and F-16, which can pull extreme numbers at high altitude, but burn fuel at a criminal rate doing it. The Hornet can't even go Mach 2. Even the Raptor is only a Mach 2.2 a/c at altitude, indicating the importance of stealth and such above overall speed.

 

On top of these indicators, aerodynamically, and I'm no engineer, she's a lump lol. I mean, the thing doesn't LOOK very fast to me as compared to other super fighters, and the mission isn't that of air superiority; when you think about the multirole capabilites and who is buying it, it sure is sounding more like the F-4 of today. One more thing is that this plane was way over it's either advertised or projected weight, so on top of everything else, she's a heavy pig.

 

If you want to turn crazy Mach numbers download an F-22 or something!!!

 

~Stingray

Edited December 12, 2010 by Stingray72

[tacoscent]

Much harder than I thought... I have already increased the thrust by a large amount. And increased its ceiling. The only thing I messed with so far is CDL in the flight part, I made it all pretty much zero. Right now at 19k meters it tops out at 2.23. Gonna see if the CDL did anything.

[tacoscent]

Well. That was a failure, no higher top speed, and I can turn in a circle at sea level at mach 1.6 without losing speed, its a very small circle....

[+FastCargo]

CDL is induced drag, that's not really what you want to change. CD0 is the number you want to fix and the CD0 tables are what you need to adjust.

 

FC

[Fuza]

I love the futuristic aircraft, it's called something like Talon.

It flies very fast and it won't burnt. Magnificent, and it looks really cool, if only we can have one in the real world...

 

I read the links, that's too deep for me....thanks!

[tacoscent]

Just wanna say thanks to those that helped! I seem to have solved that issue! Great to get past a barrier and make the plane and the game a little more enjoyable for me. Thanks alot guys!

[Lexx_Luthor]

You would help others looking at this thread by sharing your solution.

 

Also, at least for SF1, the FM data, near the top, has artificial performance limits, I suppose make things easy. There's a MachLimit= and a Ceiling=. I've been able to eliminate the need for Ceiling by testing until I get FMs (and engine data) to top out in altitude near the listed ceilings. If I recall, since it has been some time since I've done this kind of thing, the Ceiling= works by rapidly reducing thrust to zero as the aircraft nears the defined Ceiling and above.

Edited December 14, 2010 by Lexx_Luthor

[+FastCargo]

Lexx is correct...it does the same thing when nearing Mach/speed limits.

 

FC