OT; CPU Cooler Information Overload..

[Lewie 7]

I have been researching new systems here lately, doing a lot of comparison shopping and looking at 'Bare Bones' and BIY systems. One of the more important pieces of kit for the new gaming box is a sufficiently adequate heatsink/fan combo for the CPU. I think I'm going to build with another AMD processor, mainly because I'm a repeat and satisfied customer, they have a great bang to buck and they took the 3D world head on with the early K6-2 processor with '3D Now!'. I still have an old box running this relic.

 

And because of my fondness for this simple, and above all, quiet old machine I have to wonder about all the recent bells and whistles being thrown at CPU coolers. My other machine is a sub gigahertz Duron running a Thermaltake Chrome Orb cooler that the fan died early on, I just removed the cooler fan from it and put one of the case fans adjacent to it and it's been running this way since 2003. It never gets hotter than 40C, no matter what.

 

Now I understand the heat generated by a more recent CPU is many orders of magnitude greater than these old machines, but have you looked at the numerous and extensive amount of CPU coolers out there lately? And they all look like something put together by the borg collective. I'm a proponent of simple and easy maintenance, and low energy use, and tend to like small foot print setups in a PC box just because of the room it allows for airflow and cable routing. At any rate what is with the monsterous 'heat pipes' setups with the combination of copper and aluminum? Why can't they make them low profile? And coming from what I've researched, and unless aluminum has suddenly changed it's thermal conductivity and atomic number, I'm guessing it's still the best material to build your heat sink out of.

 

My other concerns came from reading one of the online CPU Cooler comparisons, the writer commented on that a lot of these new coolers are coming with less than polished heat transfer surfaces that actually sub optimize the cooling of the CPU. My old Thermaltake had a near mirror smooth surface for the contact patch on the bottom, some of these so called Heat Pipe systems are pretty crude, with gaps between the copper and aluminum. Has LED infested and decorated computer Nerd-dom taken over from sound engineering and precision of manufacturing?

[Rugbyfan1972 1]

Lewie,

 

If it helps any I am running an AMD Phenom II 965 with just the stock cooler, and at this time of year it is generally running at 35-45^oC, I have just checked using the AI Suite and the CPU is running at 38^oC with the temperature in the room showing 18.9^oC.

 

I have had no problems with it so far, although if either yourself or one of the techie's that frequent this forum could let me know what the maximum temp for a 965 is I would appreciate it, and also if they could advise any good CPU coolers if I need one in the future.

[Lewie 7]

Lewie,

 

If it helps any I am running an AMD Phenom II 965 with just the stock cooler, and at this time of year it is generally running at 35-45^oC, I have just checked using the AI Suite and the CPU is running at 38^oC with the temperature in the room showing 18.9^oC.

 

I have had no problems with it so far, although if either yourself or one of the techie's that frequent this forum could let me know what the maximum temp for a 965 is I would appreciate it, and also if they could advise any good CPU coolers if I need one in the future.

 

Hi Rugby,

Some of these newer AMD dual and quad core CPU they say it's about 70~120 watts output, depending on whether you overclock. That is a lot of heat for such a small footprint. Just from my own electronics experience running any complex semiconductor at over 80~100 C is asking for shortened life. My concern with these new coolers is that they are top heavy and the fans are mounted up high and are frequently plain bearing cheapies that can start to vibrate with age, if they aren't already somewhat 'buzzy' to begin with. Vibration is not a friend of your CPU. All box fans are fairly cheap in construction, it's one of the reasons I scavenge old systems for better fans.

[Panama Red 22]

You can also go with the new simplified "all-in-one" sealed water coolers. They are as good as any air coolers out there without a lot of the noise associated with them. Plus they are completely sealed so you do not have to worry about any maintenance or leaks.

[Lewie 7]

Yeah, see that's what I don't like about these water coolers, they aren't simple and one piece. here's a Thermaltake Chrome Orb for a Socket A AMD..

 

For 2001 it was a great CPU cooler and it is adequately effective even with it's fan removed and a case fan blowing on it. It's all aluminum, well made, if I was to make a motorcycle engine analogy this would be the radial finned head of a Maico 450, simple, easy to clean and more than adequate for cooling. Something like this in a much more effective low profile form package with about 4 times the fin area and the ability to adequately cool even if the fan malfunctions. Water cooling has it's place, but I don't trust it in a computer. It's still dependent on something moving, in this case 'water' in a thermosyphon system that still needs to liberate the heat away from the CPU after 'conducting' it away. Aluminum already does this.

[tranquillo 10]

I have an AMD Phenom II 550 and I use a Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 Pro AMD 64. Works just fine but I think it's just as important to use a good quality TIM (thermal insulating material). No point fitting a good cooler and using rubbish TIM.

 

Where are you, in the UK Lewie?

Edited April 4, 2011 by tranquillo

[carrick58 23]

I use an AMD Phenom II x 4 Black Edition Its a Heat sink/fan combo and so far no Heating problems.

[Lewie 7]

I have an AMD Phenom II 550 and I use a Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 Pro AMD 64. Works just fine but I think it's just as important to use a good quality TIM (thermal insulating material). No point fitting a good cooler and using rubbish TIM.

 

Where are you, in the UK Lewie?

 

I'll have to look that cooler up, I'm in the USA. Yes, Arctic Silver compound comes highly recommended, and I'm using it in my laptop. It's stellar stuff.

[Panama Red 22]

Here is one of the new type water cooler Corsair H70: http://www.hardocp.com/article/2010/09/09/corsair_h70_highperformance_hydro_cpu_cooler_review/

 

They are actually simliier and more efficient that air coolers now days. Corsair sells both a H50 and an H70 and now Antic has gotten into the simple water coolers too. I have has the kit type water coolers in the past, but the last two high performance PC's have used these simple sealed water coolers and they are not only more efficient that air cooled, but quiter too.

 

Read the article and you will understand what I'm talking about.

[Lewie 7]

Here is one of the new type water cooler Corsair H70: http://www.hardocp.c..._cooler_review/

 

They are actually simliier and more efficient that air coolers now days. Corsair sells both a H50 and an H70 and now Antic has gotten into the simple water coolers too. I have has the kit type water coolers in the past, but the last two high performance PC's have used these simple sealed water coolers and they are not only more efficient that air cooled, but quiter too.

 

Read the article and you will understand what I'm talking about.

 

Granted it's a nice cooler, and respectfully I'm not sure I see the logic in buying a CPU cooler that is much more expensive than the CPU it's cooling. I'm not an overclocker, and I don't think that an Athlon II 3 GHz dual core would make appreciable use of it's overly ample cooling. You can't say that system is low profile or simple. The radiator itself is huge. I'm trying for a small footprint and low tech reliability. Plus I'm on a budget, that cooler is more than both the case and PS I'm looking at.

[almccoyjr 7]

Take a look at the CoolerMaster Hyper 212+. It has a very good TDP, quiet fan the heat sink is mirror quality. I scored one at MicroCenter for $19.99 when they were running a special.

 

plug_nickel

[Lewie 7]

I appreciate the recommendation plug_, but it's just another "We are the Borg, you will be assimilated" monstrosity. It's huge and weighs nearly two pounds!

 

My case will not have see through sides so LED fans are, well, useless.

 

This is close to what I'd like to get, but i'd prefer it in an all aluminum package..

 

 

This is the ThermalTake MeOrb Low profile, and it's looking better and better.

 

There's not a lot of options close to what I want, that aren't stock model coolers, that themselves are barely able to handle the heat.

[Parky 8]

Granted it's a nice cooler, and respectfully I'm not sure I see the logic in buying a CPU cooler that is much more expensive than the CPU it's cooling.   I'm not an overclocker, and I don't think that an Athlon II 3 GHz dual core would make appreciable use of it's overly ample cooling.   You can't say that system is low profile or simple.   The radiator itself is huge.  I'm trying for a small footprint and low tech reliability. Plus I'm on a budget, that cooler is more than both the case and PS I'm looking at.<br />

 

 

Yes, the H50 and H70 are nice coolers, but would be absolute overkill for what you're trying to achieve. On a side note, the radiator is the furthest thing from being "huge". It has roughly the same dimensions as a typical 120mm case fan. I have the H50 installed in two towers here, and until you go to a push/pull fan arrangement, it's not cumbersome at all. In fact it's quite compact....particularly with regard to the cooling block, which is in fact, extremely "low profile" when compared to your typical air-cooling solutions. It's also extremely effective. I've got two i7-920's here both clocked to 4 GHz and neither of them will get over 70c even when I'm priming the everliving snot out of them. As far as the system not being "simple", well from my experience, a reasonably clever and dexterous chimpanzee could install one, probably in 5 minutes or less.

 

Frankly I think you've pretty much answered your own question here. If you aren't planning on overclocking the processor, and you don't want to spend unnecessary cash, why wouldn't you just go with the stock cooling that comes with the processor?? Besides....even if the the fan bearings turned out to be absolute garbage and the fan died or was making an unbearable racket, you could just remove it and aim one of your case fans at the heat sink, just like you did with your other tower. I wouldn't recommend that approach, but it's worked in the past, right?

 

Cheers,

 

Parky

[Lewie 7]

Thanks Parky, I get the impression you take your tech more seriously, considering what you had to share you could have ended it at the first paragraph, but...

[Parky 8]

Indeed,

 

Then however, some of my fans here would feel deprived if I didn't include my usual, superfluous commentary.

 

With all sencerity though, the recent Athlon-based systems I've looked at had no problems at all just running with the boxed cooler....even with some moderate overclocking. It may not be as "low profile" as some might prefer, but it certainly seems up to the task. I'd probably give that a whirl before I went out and spent any of my beer money on an upgrade.

 

Best of luck with whatever you decide on.

 

Cheers,

 

Parky

[Lewie 7]

( Hmmm, 305 posts and he already has a fan base?..) I'm not trying hard enough, obviously..

[Parky 8]

 I'm not trying hard enough, obviously..

 

 

Neither was I. It's just that I'm so adorable there's no effort required I really don't like this kind of fame, but it comes with the territory I s'pose. Just ask Elvis. He's alive, living in Istanbul, and would like to sell you a very nice liquid cooling system.

 

 

 

Cheers,

 

Parky

[Lewie 7]

As you know Elvis sightings are highly over rated. And besides, Mojo Nixon put that Istanbul malarkey to rest.

 

Elvis is everywhere, man...

[Herr Prop-Wasche 7]

Don't forget the Dude, man.

 

The Dude abides.

[Typhoon 5]

Here is the ultimate cooling solution:

 

http://www.pugetsystems.com/submerged.php

 

Tony

[Lewie 7]

Here is the ultimate cooling solution:

 

http://www.pugetsyst...m/submerged.php

 

Tony

 

Oil cooling, it's not a bad idea if you got the inclination..

[MikeDixonUK 5]

On the subject of CPU cooling, I was having some trouble running Shogun 2, as it kept restarting my PC after a few minutes, which I found was because of overheating.

 

First of all I found that (acording to Speedfan) it was running at 60c idle! With presumably 100c + when running at full power - then I cleaned out the dust from the inside, which resulted in it idling at around 48 - 55c, but still 95 - 100c at full power!

 

So I've decided to order one of these Arctic Cooling Freezer 7s to replace the stock Intel fan:

 

 

Not sure if it's the most powerfull or fastest or smallest or what not - but it costs £15, arrives the next day and it's probably better than my CPU exploding!

 

Never know, might even be able to overclock my CPU after I install it! (E8600s are supposed to be good for overclocking aparantly - only running at stock at the moment, but then that's probably for the best at 100c!)

[Parky 8]

Mike,

 

Unless the temperature in your tower is smoking hot to begin with, that e8600 is idling at way to warm a temperature....even with the stock Intel cooler. Shouldn't be much more than about the mid 30's. Perhaps somebody botched the seating process with the stock HSF would be my guess. Regardless, the Arctic Freezer should be considerably better than what you have. I've used it in the past, which leads me to this bit of info. You might want to remove the fan from the heatsink before attempting to do the install. Makes it much less awkward, and it can be clipped back on quite easily once the heatsink has been seated properly. One other little detail. That cooler is mounted using the same method as the stock Intel thingy. From my experience, those four plastic pins that pop into the holes in your mainboard can "split" open if you don't line 'em up properly. It happened to me on one of the four corners....at which point there was some rather colourful language. Make sure you line those puppies up precisely, and insert them from diagonal corners as opposed to doing one side and then the other. One other little thing I didn't like about the design was the amount of thermal paste that comes in the pre-applied pad. Far too much of it for my liking. It's easily cleaned off and replaced with a nice thin layer of Arctic Silver or any other good quality product. That's strictly a matter of personal preference though...

 

Best of luck with the upgrade.

 

Cheers,

 

Parky

[Lewie 7]

Do the stock AMD II K8 coolers come with the same 'pad' of cooling compound as the earlier K7 series?

[Parky 8]

That's a damned good question, and one that I can't answer. The last time I put togther an AMD based tower was many, many moons ago. An Asus K8N-E Deluxe Socket 754 board with an Athlon 3400+ which was a great gaming rig in it's day, when paired with an ATI X850-PE graphics card.

 

BirdogICT has a tendency to go with AMD builds, and would probably have the info you're looking for.

 

Cheers,

 

Parky