Olham 164 Posted August 9, 2011 (edited) ...always a pleasure to visit "Jasta 11" website. Enjoy! http://www.jasta11.co.uk/ This series of pics is said to be an attack of a Siemens-Schuckert on a SPAD two-seater. It seems to have been photographed from the next SPAD's observer. As red appears black in B/W photography, and this Siemens-Schuckert appears all black, I wonder if it might be Ernst Udet in his all-red Siemens-Schuckert D.III ? Edited August 9, 2011 by Olham Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hasse Wind 46 Posted August 9, 2011 Are there any pics about WW1 air combat situations that are confirmed to be real? I know there are a lot of fakes. I'm no expert, so I don't know about that photo. But I know that photos and films about real combat situations, ie. filmed during a battle, not afterwards, on the ground are also very rare, almost all of them have been staged later. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
33LIMA 972 Posted August 9, 2011 (edited) Those pics look convincing to me - no sign of tracer smoke trails and the attack is not from the classic behind and below position...but they don't look too 'posed', the markings look authentic (remember the staged Luftwaffe pics of a captured Spit with the roundels too far in from the tips, in the position of crosses on post-1939 Bf109s) and given the SSW's engine's unreliability and its tendency to turn over on landing - even when maintained and flown by its rightful owners - how likely is it anyone would have used one with authentic markings to stage these pics? As for other real combat pics, can't find it now but there's a poignant, real photo of an RE8 B5073 going down vertically just short of the ground, after a run to drop ammo to troops (reportedly something they dropped got stuck and jammed something important). There is a photo of the wreck in Time Life's 'Knights of the Air' with some Tommies carrying away what's said to be one of the dead crew and another is standing to one side with what may be the body of another. Edit - here's the crash site pic, can't find the other one: http://cas.awm.gov.au/item/E04888 Edited August 9, 2011 by 33LIMA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hasse Wind 46 Posted August 9, 2011 A few years ago I saw a documentary, either French or German, about combat photography in WW1. They showed a lot of the rare original films and pictures there, from both French and German sources. It was interesting how different the films were compared to the staged situations, which were filmed usually after the war. The position of the cameraman instantly reveals if the situation is staged. Unfortunately I can't remember the name of the documentary. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+elephant 36 Posted August 9, 2011 Is this the picture you're referring to 33LIMA? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+elephant 36 Posted August 9, 2011 (edited) Another one I fished over at "The Aerodrome": apparently staged... This picture was published in the past as "an Italian fighter pursuing an Austian plane". Actually, the Br. C.I 61.57 was the first victory of Francesco Baracca. He forced to land this airplane on April, 7th, 1916. In the picture Baracca flew it with his fellow-citizen Aurelio Baruzzi in the back seat. The Nieuport was flown by Prince Ruffo di Calabria and the picture was taken by Luigi Olivari. Would be the Siemens-Schuckert case be something similar? Edited August 9, 2011 by elephant Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wayfarer 5 Posted August 9, 2011 As for other real combat pics, can't find it now but there's a poignant, real photo of an RE8 B5073 going down vertically just short of the ground, after a run to drop ammo to troops (reportedly something they dropped got stuck and jammed something important). There is a photo of the wreck in Time Life's 'Knights of the Air' with some Tommies carrying away what's said to be one of the dead crew and another is standing to one side with what may be the body of another. 33LIMA I have never seen that photograph before, thanks ELEPHANT for posting it. Poignant isn't the half of it. I keep going back to look at it. It makes a very deep impression, even on a day of constantly seeing photographs and films of people trashing parts of our city centre. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
33LIMA 972 Posted August 10, 2011 Is this the picture you're referring to 33LIMA? Yes that's the one; the RE8's upper wing extensions seem to have failed. Nothing fake about that one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Olham 164 Posted August 10, 2011 Staged or not, it may be as close as we can get - with the real planes, and still during or short after the war. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RAF_Louvert 101 Posted August 10, 2011 . The Jasta 11 website is a great place to visit, and I've been there many times looking through its resources. Thanks for the reminder Olham. And thanks for the shared pictures everyone. . Also, I'm not so sure about that dogfight being for real, but it is still neat to see. . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
