noisenormal & waternormal questions

[squid 21]

All of them. There's two for terrain, and two for water.

 

The files i found are

 

TERTERRAINEFFECT

 

TERWATEREFFECT0

TERWATEREFFECT1

TERWATEREFFECT2

 

 

( and

TERTERRAINEFFECTDX9

 

TERWATEREFFECT0DX9

TERWATEREFFECT1DX9

TERWATEREFFECT2DX9 )

Edited December 18, 2011 by squid

[+hgbn 91]

Uhhhh, not really. A title may be coded in DX7, and (if) you can still run it under a Windows 7 environment....it doesn't mean that the game's now capable of taking advantage of DX11 coding, shaders, (etc.)...it's still a DX7 game. SF2 titles are coded for both DX9 and DX10, and operate exclusively under one API, or another.

 

Keep in mind that TK has stated that SF2NA and it's successors will be DX10 only.

 

I stand corrected

[squid 21]

Depends on your graphic card. If its Dx11 capable your are most likely running it in Dx 11

 

 

HD 5850 ... (so +Win7 i guess its definitely DX10)

[squid 21]

- Fubar remember maybe what exact editing did you do on that DX9 case ?

- Regarding waternormal my original thought was if maybe there is

a) another bitmap file that needs to be resized to the same size as the waternormal.bmp (which is used as blending or something for the effect of animation) or

b) some code value that needs to be multiplied by the same factor as the waternormal.bmp size icrease ...

 

i think i saw long time ago some small variety of different waternormal styles uploaded in CA i think of increased than stock size too, was the animation working for them ? I guess the control of the water maps is not in the same inis between SF1 & SF2 ?

Edited December 18, 2011 by squid

[Fubar512 1,350]

The size of the normal files has less to do with the level of resolution that you're seeking, than the number of normals rendered per tile.

[squid 21]

The size of the normal files has less to do with the level of resolution that you're seeking, than the number of normals rendered per tile.

 

 

And its much more effective and convenient that way. i only wish at this stage i could manage to edit the normals grid .... (and next step would be to edit the fading distances so to minimize shimmering)

Edited December 18, 2011 by squid

[Fubar512 1,350]

And its much more effective and convenient that way. i only wish at this stage i could manage to edit the normals grid .... (and next step would be to edit the fading distances so to minimize shimmering)

 

Shimmering? Land or water?

[steelflanker 32]

(and next step would be to edit the fading distances so to minimize shimmering)

Interesting, I’d no idea these values were there to adjust!

 

Keep us posted with your results squid.

[squid 21]

Shimmering? Land or water?

 

 

Both ... I'll check and investigate about that after i manage to modify the normal tiling frequency / scale ....

[Fubar512 1,350]

Both ...

 

Well, I hate to break it to you, but water is supposed to shimmer

Edited December 18, 2011 by Fubar512

[squid 21]

Well, I hate to break it to you, but water is supposed to shimmer

 

lol :P you do have a point there but still , falling into the personal taste / quirk realm, shimmering still (unfortunately) annoys me. ( And the fact that i know that is a graphics technology shortcoming and not purposefully designed this way, doesn't help me not being annoyed by it :( )

[Wrench 9,855]

well, in that case...

 

open the offending terrain's data and do this:

 

[WaterTextureMaterial]

//EffectShaderName=terWaterEffect.fx <---this

DepthBufferCheck=TRUE

DepthBufferWrite=TRUE

RenderedInOrder=FALSE

AlphaTestEnabled=FALSE

CullMode=CLOCKWISE

LightEnabled=TRUE

SpecularEnabled=TRUE

EmissiveEnabled=FALSE

FogEnabled=TRUE

AmbientColor=1.000000,1.000000,1.000000,1.000000

DiffuseColor=1.000000,1.000000,1.000000,1.000000

SpecularColor=1.000000,1.000000,1.000000,1.000000

SpecularPower=10.000000

Reflectivity=0.00000

ZBufferOffset=0.000000

BlendOp=ONE

NumTextureStages=1

TextureStage[01].TextureName=

TextureStage[01].MipMap=TRUE

TextureStage[01].FilterEnabled=TRUE

TextureStage[01].StageColorOp=TEXTURE_MODULATE_DIFFUSE

TextureStage[01].StageAlphaOp=NO_OP

 

that should eliminate the so-called problem

Edited December 20, 2011 by Wrench

[squid 21]

My 1024px waternormal (made by tiling the stock waternormal) that appears motionless in the game and nice Paladrian's (a.k.a. Mago) 1024 waternormal that appears animated in the game. I guess if i am still curious about what makes a normal bmp to appear motionless in game , i should do some studying more about how normal maps work in games and how they are made ...

Edited December 20, 2011 by squid

[+SkateZilla 49]

you have to edit the water.fx file i believe..

 

i havent tinkered with water since SF2's release, maybe I venture back to water to see if I cant bring life to what looks like crap..

 

if I can export my water effects from premiere to an .FX file that would be awesome. or snag a .fx file from another game if possible.

The SF2 water has no reflection or "volume" to it...

[squid 21]

you have to edit the water.fx file i believe..

 

i havent tinkered with water since SF2's release, maybe I venture back to water to see if I cant bring life to what looks like crap..

 

if I can export my water effects from premiere to an .FX file that would be awesome. or snag a .fx file from another game if possible.

The SF2 water has no reflection or "volume" to it...

 

You are definitely right about the file. I don't itend so far to fiddle with that though. Just curious what is the difference between two normal bitmaps that "toggles" the "animation" .

If NA will not have an improved water, i will be definitely looking forward for a third party major improvement :) Besides reflections (eg ship reflection) the wakes also would be an area definitely needing improvement

Edited December 20, 2011 by squid

[Fubar512 1,350]

You are definitely right about the file. I don't itend so far to fiddle with that though. Just curious what is the difference between two normal bitmaps that "toggles" the "animation"

 

There is nothing in a normal map that "toggles" animation. All a normal map does in this series is provide a relief or bump texture. The shader itself provides the animation by juxtaposing two normal maps over one another and shifting them, simulating motion, and by providing simple point-by-point reflection mapping, or "noise" (ergo the shimmering that you dislike).

 

If NA will not have an improved water, i will be definitely looking forward for a third party major improvement :) Besides reflections (eg ship reflection) the wakes also would be an area definitely needing improvement

 

No third-party shader mod will ever achieve fresnel reflections, displacement mapping, surface pertubation (etc), if the sim's developer doesnt make full use of what's available in the DirectX libraries, to begin with.

 

To simplfy it for you: You can't use what you don't have.

Edited December 21, 2011 by Fubar512

[+SkateZilla 49]

unfortunately...

 

when Sf2 was released, and i started tinkering with it,

 

certain changes to the water maps would either kill the animation

 

or kill ship movement effects (saving the normal.noise as a TGA and modifying the .fx file to use the tga.)

 

dont remember what broke the alternating animation.

 

 

water and terrain (including the sky/environment) are really the only things that need updating now.

Edited December 22, 2011 by SkateZilla

[Fubar512 1,350]

unfortunately...

 

when Sf2 was released, and i started tinkering with it,

 

certain changes to the water maps would either kill the animation

 

or kill ship movement effects (saving the normal.noise as a TGA and modifying the .fx file to use the tga.)

dont remember what broke the alternating animation.

 

Ahhh......NO. My current water shader uses a normal file in tga format, and works it quite well, as evidenced by the videos that I've released.

Edited December 22, 2011 by Fubar512

[+SkateZilla 49]

Ahhh......NO. My current water shader uses a normal file in tga format, and works it quite well, as evidenced by the videos that I've released.

 

like i said.. when SF2 was released, TK has since fixed the TGA issue. i think it was fixed in the first patch (and it was a DX9 issue, DX10 was fine).

 

sorry left that part out...

Edited December 22, 2011 by SkateZilla

[Fubar512 1,350]

like i said.. when SF2 was released, TK has since fixed the TGA issue. i think it was fixed in the first patch (and it was a DX9 issue, DX10 was fine).

 

When SF2 was first released, I used the same water shader in it, that I'd written for SF1, and that one used a tga file, as well I'm sure that Dave will chime in and verify that

 

Somewhere around the time that Third Wire released the patch that "fixed" DX10 (If memory serves me right, that would have been about the time that SF2I was released), the series had issues reading shaders outside of the default ones.

Edited December 22, 2011 by Fubar512

[+SkateZilla 49]

i know it was when SF2 debuted, i had to edit the TGA save as a BMP and change the .fx to read the bmp instead of the TGA, or none of the shipmovement effects would show up. dont remember which water map it was..

 

Edit:

I know this one worked fine: (I dont even remember where to download it again, but I got it from a link the Author on Thirdwire's boards, I actually liked this one... wasnt this one code named north atlantic?,)

 

This is the one I had to convert from TGA to BMP to get it to work with ship effects in DX9 Mode

 

Sorry for the old images, had to raid my myspace for pictures of the water maps, as I'm in office.

[Fubar512 1,350]

i know it was when SF2 debuted, i had to edit the TGA save as a BMP and change the .fx to read the bmp instead of the TGA, or none of the shipmovement effects would show up. dont remember which water map it was..

 

Edit:

I know this one worked fine: (I dont even remember where to download it again, but I got it from a link the Author on Thirdwire's boards, I actually liked this one... wasnt this one code named north atlantic?,)

 

This is the one I had to convert from TGA to BMP to get it to work with ship effects in DX9 Mode

 

Sorry for the old images, had to raid my myspace for pictures of the water maps, as I'm in office.

 

 

DO, Don't even go there.....I was using the same TGA-driven water shader effect in SF2, SF2V, and SF2E that I had been in SF1...and I have full backups of the game at that patch level to prove it

Edited December 22, 2011 by Fubar512

[+SkateZilla 49]

okay... lol.... maybe my system back then just didnt like TGAs, as I had to do alot of crap to get other things working as well.

 

i'll prolly play with water this weekend a little to see what i can come up with in regards to normal/noise maps.

 

i wish i still had that north atlantic normal somewhere in my old backups... cant seem to find it.

Edited December 22, 2011 by SkateZilla

[Wrench 9,855]

actually, i wouldn't even bother. We don't KNOW yet what SF2NA is going to bring; so anything done now is likely to get hosed by the 'new' system.

 

why not be smart, and wait and see what we get?? Otherwise, it just pissing in the wind

[squid 21]

actually, i wouldn't even bother. We don't KNOW yet what SF2NA is going to bring; so anything done now is likely to get hosed by the 'new' system.

 

why not be smart, and wait and see what we get?? Otherwise, it just pissing in the wind

 

That is certainly common sense.

Cant speak for the others here but personally these days i am in dire need of some distraction, in the form of hobby i guess, from some stressful issues i have to deal with in my life out of here at this phase, and found playing with the normals an interesting subject (includes inquiring, creativity, reverse engineering thinking etc) and is an attention absorbing enough thing to shift my focus for a while to recreation i understand. Even if the "research" won't lead anywhere or results in something that NA will make even maybe incompatible or obsolete :)