The $164 Question

[Nicholas Bell 117]

I’m in a quandary and looking for advice.  I don’t know where the time has gone, but the last time I fired SF (or any flight sims) was 2007.  At my age time slips away quickly.  A lot has changed in the SF world since then.  I am especially disappointed in TK’s decision to essentially turn his back on this series and at the same time impose limitations on modding it.  Be that as it may, there are so many enticing aircraft, campaigns and other mods which dedicated modders have completed in the last 8 years which draw my attention.

 

The “problem” is that for me to use them I would have to spend about $164 on all the new SF2 series products necessary for the fully-merged installed required by most of the new campaigns.  That’s a big chunk of change to lay down for a program series moribund save for those here, who from what I can tell, find their enjoyment in creating works of art in their mods as opposed to in-depth playing.  And that is not meant to be a criticism – I totally get that, and have spent more time in the last 20 years hex-editing, writing little editors, creating maps & scenarios and volunteering for development/beta-testing than I have ever actually played anything (I think I am over that).  But it does beg the question on whether the SF2 series is holding anyone’s interest to play enough to get a decent return on a $164 investment.  If I had purchased the programs one at a time when TK was still apparently supporting the series, I would not have batted an eye.  But that is not the situation now.

 

When I read about how the patches have dumbed down portions of the sim, I get especially concerned.  I’m primary interested in air to air combat, and the SF series AI was “pretty good” in this area, although the lack of AI defensive action against SAMs and poor AI ground targeting really annoyed me.   From what I’ve read SF2 was originally reported to having improved AI, flight modeling and avionics - apart from the graphics improvements.  But I’ve picked up that follow on patches really pooched the AI and weapons effectiveness.  The fact that at some time apparently the 2012 patch was considered better than the follow on patches is troubling.  So what patch are you using?

 

Maybe I should just enjoy the SF1 series which I have in its entirety.  It does look a bit long in the tooth these days, and much as I hate to say it (especially as a long time wargamer) graphics do matter when it comes to immersion and suspension of disbelieve.  Once exposed to new graphics it’s difficult to go back too far.  I’m not a “systems” guy and don’t have the time or energy for DCS or F4 BMS, so SF has always been the sweet spot for me.  But I’m really having a hard time with this one.  Sure I could purchase one program and give it a try, but the knowledge that other new campaigns which I know are better done than anything stock are out there will be eating away at me… (not to mention the WW2 stuff).

 

Well, thanks for reading my ramblings.  Pretty ridiculous “predicament” to most people I suppose.  Nevertheless, I would appreciate your thoughts.

 

Nick

[Tappedops 18]

Well Sir, I came from JF15 so the old birds keep me more than happy, and even though ive messed with JFA18 and the SF2nam... SF2 and NA would be my pick---no need to pile on unless you feel you need the whole series...

[Wrench 9,848]

good to see you back again Nick!!

 

to the question posed....

 

I'm running at the July 2013, which is what level you'll be at if/when you decide to jump into SF2. They can't be purchased any other way from the 3rd Wire site.

The good thing about that is, all the DLC items are set for use ONLY at he 7/13 patch (they won't install otherwise).

 

what I'd start with, is all dependent on what you want to fly -- if you want carrier ops, SF2NA is must. It allows single missions off the boat (also on add-on terrains that have NA coding statements)

But starting off, maybe SF2E, then plane jane SF2 (as many terrains still reference the items from the desert.cat), then SF2V and SF2I at the last.

And don't forget Expansion Pack 1 & 2 that add a lot of goodies!

[+streakeagle 871]

If I were strapped for cash, I would buy one game per month. Try it out. Don't worry about mods. Just play that one new game that month. If you can't enjoy it without the mods, you won't enjoy it much more with the mods. So, if any point you get tired of it or just don't like it, you stop buying more SF2 games. Of course, along the way you will be able to use more and more mods. But the gradual expansion gives you time to appreciate what each game adds to the merged installation: maps, planes, missions/campaigns for the cost of a fast food meal each week.

 

A fully merged install is amazing with the variety of stock aircraft, both flyable and AI only. Of course, you will find mods to make almost any/all AI planes fully flyable. Just a matter of whether a good cockpit is available. I bought everything TK releases as he released it. So I have no idea how much I paid in total. I have ALL of the games and DLC. Of course, as amazing as the stock game is, addons like NATO make this game even bigger and better. So many planes to fly, so little time to fly them.

[+daddyairplanes 10,241]

Personally, everything for me ties back into Europe. It was the first I bought, Vietnam added carriers, Isreal planes as well as the expansion packs. NA added better naval action and SF2 rounded out the collection as well as giving a good place for managerie collection (Dhimari AF Tigers with Dhimari Army Hips. Why not?) But that is my personal story. It took me about 3 years to get al theway there though I've got a wife and three girls so not as much disposable income for myself. The community here has quite alot to add to any of individual versions as well. Just my .02 on this

[+baffmeister 1,205]

Depending on how much you want to fly off carriers, SF-2 Israel might be a good bet for starters. You get an interesting collection of airplanes spanning old and new as well as historical campaigns. There are also some great mods available for it.

[Spinners 15,986]

My advice to very similar questions has always been to get one per month. Nowadays you can install them in any order but instead of agonising over the decision just get them in the order they were released. It spreads the cost and injects some anticipation into the enjoyment.

[Nicholas Bell 117]

Thanks for your comments.  I'll follow your advice for going slow on the purchases - now to decide where to start.

 

I must admit I am amazed at all the familiar names from 7-8 years ago.  Amazing dedication.

 

Nick

[+streakeagle 871]

TK may have never won the masses, but he got some of the most dedicated military aviation fans one could ask for.

 

Choosing the first purchase can be difficult. I favor the F-4 and think Vietnam first, then Israel (I love recreating historical missions).

 

But from a practical standpoint, SF2 Europe is the way to go. Diverse plane set and compatible with many mods (I am not sure what NATO Fighters requires anymore, but it used to be just Europe). When you buy the Expansion Pack 2 for SF2 Europe, you get the mission editor instead of buying it as a separate addon. So unless you need aircraft carriers immediately, really love the F-14A more than any other plane, or have some other preference that isn't covered by SF2 Europe and SF2 Expansion Pack 2, those are the first two things I would buy.

 

After SF2 Europe, the choices don't get any easier. Vietnam for plane set and carriers? Israel for plane set? North Atlantic for F-14 and really great naval action?

 

Again, Vietnam is my preference, and in this case it makes sense given all the cool planes and aircraft carriers. But Israel has its own unique plane set and a great looking terrain. If you are an F-14 fan, no contest if you didn't already get North Atlantic as your first choice.

 

If you get Israel at some point, you may also want Expansion Pack 1.

 

The original Strike Fighters 2 with the fictional map and mercenary campaign is the last thing I would buy. A completely fictional map with completely fictional countries is not my cup of tea. I enjoyed SFP1 until WoV saved me from fantasy hell, but I seldom go back to that map. The one thing to buy this for is the mercenary campaign. It is cool to start with almost nothing and build up your own air force with money you earn flying.

 

Then you can slowly work your way through any remaining DLC you might fancy. I bought all of it as it was being released, so it didn't seem like such a huge purchase. AI Plane Pack 1 and AI Plane Pack 2 are good candidates... lots more planes to shoot down or mod into being flyable.

[Nicholas Bell 117]

But from a practical standpoint, SF2 Europe is the way to go. Diverse plane set and compatible with many mods (I am not sure what NATO Fighters requires anymore, but it used to be just Europe). When you buy the Expansion Pack 2 for SF2 Europe, you get the mission editor instead of buying it as a separate addon. So unless you need aircraft carriers immediately, really love the F-14A more than any other plane, or have some other preference that isn't covered by SF2 Europe and SF2 Expansion Pack 2, those are the first two things I would buy.

 

 

You've nailed it for my Streakeagle - Thanks!.  But first I have to get my CH setup working with Win 10 in my new rig - nothing but problems which change daily.  The original plan to drop in my old Win 7 HDD, update some drivers, dual boot and carry on is a bust, so I may end up installing Win 7 on a third HDD this weekend and start from scratch. 

[+streakeagle 871]

My wife's attempt to upgrade her laptop from Win7 to Win10 removed any doubts I had about staying with Win 7 x64. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. When I need Windows 10, I will most likely build a new PC rather than upgrade this one. My current PC is stable and fairly fast. As my primary sims still use DX9 or DX10, I have little or no incentive to upgrade. Since my video card is AMD, I haven't had the driver issues that nVidia users have had with SF2. Win10? Why would I want or need it at this point?

Edited January 28, 2016 by streakeagle