Are Harrier's Easy to Shoot Down?

[Nicholas Bell]

Just wondering, as I don't fly that era.  But given the size of the hitboxes I'd reckon so.  Thanks to Mue, I don't think I'll be able to play much until I fix every hitbox on every aircraft...haha.  Actually this is the worse stock model I've run across so far.  Usually they are not so bad.  Tu-22 is close though...

 

[Wrench]

wow! that IS sad...when you compare the hit boxes shown with the bounding boxes (especially for the outer wing sections) one can see some real differences!

 

many of the hit boxes aren't even aligned to meshes they're representing!

[KJakker]

I was working on a fix for all stock aircraft hit boxes. These are the ones I did for the Harrier. They are untested but here you go.

 

Harrier HitBox edits.7z

[Nicholas Bell]

I was working on a fix for all stock aircraft hit boxes. These are the ones I did for the Harrier. They are untested but here you go.

 

Harrier HitBox edits.7z

Sweet!  Any estimated completion date on this endeavor, presuming you were planning on publishing?  Perhaps we might coordinate efforts?  I can at least see the light at the end of the tunnel on my FE2 hit box revisions (54 aircraft completed so far) and would be willing to handle some of the load.

[Do335]

I was working on a fix for all stock aircraft hit boxes. These are the ones I did for the Harrier. They are untested but here you go.

 

Nice one. It is probably overdue since we've had Lodviewer.

[KJakker]

Sweet!  Any estimated completion date on this endeavor, presuming you were planning on publishing?  Perhaps we might coordinate efforts?  I can at least see the light at the end of the tunnel on my FE2 hit box revisions (54 aircraft completed so far) and would be willing to handle some of the load.

 

No completion date at this time as it has been sitting mostly untouched for months but I would be interested in working together with you on it.

Edited May 11, 2016 by KJakker

[fallenphoenix1986]

If TK was trying to model the GR.7/AV-8B then fair enough but those wing boxes are ridiculous on a gen1 Harrier. 

 

Craig

[Nicholas Bell]

No completion date at this time as it has been sitting mostly untouched for months but I would be interested in working together with you on it.

 

PM me a list of what you need done and I'll get on it.  I'll send them back to you so you can review and post as you desire - or however you'd like to handle it.

[Gatling20]

I think I recall TK saying some time ago that the larger the hit box the stronger of the component was (without changing the parameter StructuralFactor=).

It seemed a bit counter-intuitive to me at the time, but I suppose it is correct.

Could that account for the large Harrier hit boxes? I guess not, some look way too big, especially the wing tips.

[Nicholas Bell]

I think I recall TK saying some time ago that the larger the hit box the stronger of the component was (without changing the parameter StructuralFactor=).

It seemed a bit counter-intuitive to me at the time, but I suppose it is correct.

Could that account for the large Harrier hit boxes? I guess not, some look way too big, especially the wing tips.

 

You are correct.  The larger the hit box the more damage "points" it takes before being destroyed.  VolumeStructurePoint increases the base amount of each hit box as I understand it.  Structural factor does the same, except it is aircraft & component specific instead of universal for all aircraft.   In the case of the Harrier with it's over-sized boxes, it would be advisable to increase the Structural Factor to offset the decrease in size.  Otherwise, it might be harder to hit, but easier to kill the plane.

 

The problem with these oversized hit boxes is that one doesn't need to hit the 3d model with mg/cannon fire to cause damage.  I would suspect that the hit boxes also have a role in detonating missile proximity fuzes, making smaller warhead and less accurate missiles deadlier than they ought to be. 

 

Apparently it was/is difficult for modders creating new models to see the hit box locations using whatever tools they are using.  Consequently many add-on aircraft have really bad problems with hit box sizing and location.  I'm definitely not trying to criticize any of these modders - none would intentionally make these errors given their talent and effort put into creating the 3D models.  Until Mue's outstanding tools we were none the wiser.  But it's hard to understand we didn't, as they have to have a visible impact on the damage modeling.  For example, a double "==" or a space in a value "0  .05" where their ought not be one creates hit boxes that stretch to infinity in 2 dimensions.  A missing or added negative "-" in the wrong place puts a hit box all on same side of a plane.  I've noted hit boxes that are sized properly but off in the z axis, eg you'd have to aim way above a wing in order to hit it.  I've noted pilots and gunners that are giants and extend 10 meters in height above the cockpit.  I could continue, but you get the idea.  What is amazing to me is I've noted some of these issues with 3W stock models, indicating a lack of quality control (although most are very good).