Which Vietnam B-52s Used Underwing Bombs?

[+Geary 1,889]

I recently read Osprey Publication's "Operation Linebacker II 1972 The B-52s are Sent to Hanoi."  I also have Osprey's "B-52 Stratofortress Units in Combat 1955-73."

Also looked at various sources online.  Combined there's lots of information in these sources but can get a bit confusing with information overload.

What I'm trying to figure out is Which B-52 models flew in Vietnam?  I think the D, F and G models flew there.

And which had the capability to care under wing ordnance?  I think the D & F models could carry under wing bombs but NOT the F model.

Can anyone confirm or correct my thinking here?

Thanks,

Geary

[MigBuster 2,884]

F, D and G models is correct

 

[+Geary 1,889]

Just now, MigBuster said:

F, D and G models is correct

 

Thanks.

Do you know which could carry underwing bombs?

 

[MigBuster 2,884]

Noted that D & G could do external bombs up to 24 x M117s.....is that final?

 

F could do the same

[+Geary 1,889]

8 minutes ago, MigBuster said:

Noted that D & G could do external bombs up to 24 x M117s.....is that final?

 

F could do the same

Thanks, again.

I think you answered both questions.

[MigBuster 2,884]

Okay I was wrong on the G I think ..................about external bombs................ conflicting sources

[+Geary 1,889]

8 minutes ago, MigBuster said:

................ conflicting sources

 

Hence, also my confusion.

Think I'll pick a course that you've helped strengthen and stick to it.  In my scenarios (until proven otherwise), the D & F models carried underwing bombs.

[KJakker 888]

My understanding is that the AGM-28 pylon was used to hang the MER's for the M117. After the AGM-28 was withdrawn from service they were all limited to the HSAB for external gravity bombs.

Is it possible that all B-52's could carry the AGM-28 pylon but that not all units were equipped with them?

Edited February 15, 2021 by KJakker

[+Geary 1,889]

6 minutes ago, KJakker said:

My understanding is that the AGM-28 pylon was used to hang the MER's for the M117. After the AGM-28 was withdrawn from service they were all limited to the HSAB for external gravity bombs.  

 

I recall reading something like this.

Were the AGM-28 pylons withdrawn during bombing in Vietnam?

[KJakker 888]

The AGM-28 was withdrawn from service between 1975 and 1978.

[+daddyairplanes 10,146]

a correction to note having read thru this

D and F carried underwing IN VIETNAM. G carried underwing in Desert Storm, but not during Linebacker. Look in the Units in Combat 55-73 book, and you'll see accounts of the D guys being ticked at how little (27 internally) the G guys were bringing to the fight

most common loadout on the externals was 117s or CBUs because of diameter. but 82s, 84s, and even British 1000 pounders (ODS) were not unheard of

all the BUFFs after the C model could carry the AGM-28 pylon, since many were tasked with carrying Hound Dogs as part of their nuclear warload. They werent used as commonly from around 1966 through 1972/3 timeframe as they were needed for the nuclear warfighting role.

F models pioneered the AGM-28 pylon usage, accomplised by mounting 2 MERs to a steel I beam, then mounting the whole assembly to the AGM-28 pylon

The Fs were the first in use, but withdrawn after 6-8 months of operations, as soon as the first Big Belly D models were coming available. E and H model never flew, and Gs went to bolster the force in 72 because they were more numerous than the Hs

while the AGM-28 was withdrawn from use in the 70s, it freed up the pylons for use in the 80s and Desert Storm. The pylons wre retired finally same time the G models were

in game, the AGM28 assembly is available on the G in my Desert Storm mod.  i modified it to be an ECMpod, so you could select the dozen bombe per side with that pylon or 9 per side with HSAB. it would need a slight bit of touch up as its painted for the dark grey undersides of that time, but not too hard to change.  the biggie would be editing the D and F data inis to accomodate it

not claiming to be an expert, just read that book and the G in Desert Storm books many times over when doing my mods

 

[+daddyairplanes 10,146]

now me being nosy, so whatchya doin?

on my todo list for this year is the E model (ini edit from D as it was internal diffs only), as well as F and Ds post Nam. lot to work with actually as they werent fully retired until 1978 and 1983 respectively. even if only on the Crested Dove operations last couple years for each

[KJakker 888]

I did some INI edits to the B-52's myself that updated and/or fixed a number of issues. If anyone wants the I will be happy to share.

[+Geary 1,889]

4 minutes ago, daddyairplanes said:

now me being nosy, so whatchya doin?

 

After reading the Osprey campaign series on Rolling Thunder, Linebacker and Linebacker II I though I would set up the Vietnam BUFFs to carry the Linebacker II ordnance.

A few years back I discovered gbreuder's SF1 Vietnam B-52 mods that allowed the Big Belly mod and the underwing mers and bombs.  Took me the better part of the day to reposition bombs and mers to get the Linebacker II setup. But I only loaded the F model that way.

Unfortunately the game doesn't allow an easy, correct  transition of B-52 bomb loads throughout the three major Vietnam air campaigns, but if I can wrap my head around it I might get something useable and close to reality like different sets of B-52 for each campaign.

Of course the gbreuder mods are for SF1.  Might need to readjust bomb positions for SF2.  (Thought this issue came up a year or two back for SF2.  But my memory is short term, mostly now.  Why even though I've read all this, can't remember most of it.)

[+Geary 1,889]

7 minutes ago, KJakker said:

I did some INI edits to the B-52's myself that updated and/or fixed a number of issues. If anyone wants the I will be happy to share.

 

 

Please share.

[+daddyairplanes 10,146]

3 hours ago, KJakker said:

I did some INI edits to the B-52's myself that updated and/or fixed a number of issues. If anyone wants the I will be happy to share.

iirc you did alot of the ini work on the AGM-28 pylons that i put in mod (spilline104s model iirc), my main bit was changing from fakepilot to a gunpod so i was selectable in the weapons dropdowns. the antennas and other items via fakepilot for the D are awesome tho if im remembering correctly that you did them

3 hours ago, Geary said:

Unfortunately the game doesn't allow an easy, correct  transition of B-52 bomb loads throughout the three major Vietnam air campaigns, but if I can wrap my head around it I might get something useable and close to reality like different sets of B-52 for each campaign.

my suggestions would be to make year specific versions of the BUFFs you want to use, and then work in teh loadout ini for each one. something like  B-52D_67 and CBU Strike, MK82 Strike, M117 Strike, Mix Strike (82 inside, 117 outside) etc within the loadout.ini of that plane.

making the new plane is pretty simple, copy paste and dont forget to change folder and aircraft ini names. the loadout is a little more detailed but still not too hard.

 

let me know if you need help with the inis. my planned BUFF work is near enough in the future i can give ini work a jump start while helping you

 

Edited February 16, 2021 by daddyairplanes

[+Geary 1,889]

8 minutes ago, daddyairplanes said:

iirc you did alot of the ini work on the AGM-28 pylons that i put in mod (spilline104s model iirc), my main bit was changing from fakepilot to a gunpod so i was selectable in the weapons dropdowns. the antennas and other items via fakepilot for the D are awesome tho if im remembering correctly that you did them

 

Are you saying you've added the pylons to the B-52s for the underwing bombs?  If so, are they available?  No sense in my being redundant.

[KJakker 888]

5 minutes ago, Geary said:

 

Are you saying you've added the pylons to the B-52s for the underwing bombs?  If so, are they available?  No sense in my being redundant.

Yes. I need to look through my Mods to find where I put everything but I should have a package for most of the B-52's for you tomorrow.

[+daddyairplanes 10,146]

Just now, Geary said:

 

Are you saying you've added the pylons to the B-52s for the underwing bombs?  If so, are they available?  No sense in my being redundant.

look up B-52G_89 for Desert Storm in the download section.

yes, i have them as selectable weapons, and the various ini edits to not only make it all work, but prevent arcade loads like cruise missiles on the HSABs AND bombs on mers.

that said it is set up for Desert Storm era. some things will need to be removed for Vietnam timeframe (like cruise missile capability). looking at the inis and plugging into the F should work ok.  the underwing parts will work for the D as well. but internal needs to be changed up for the D model because of Big Belly and holding 84 Mk82 bombs (less other versions). it should still be useful as a guide but wont be a direct swap in the D

the G_72 (or whaterver year) model, as said earlier, dont need no stinking pylons for Linebacker!

and since you replied while i was editing, relook at my now changed post above

[+Geary 1,889]

I appreciate any help you guys can give.  Prefer not to be redundant if possible. If you've already done it, no sense in me re-doing it.

 

[+Nyghtfall 2,154]

Sorry for the hijack, but I always wondered, why no B-52E found it's way to Vietnam...only older Ds and newer Fs and Gs. Was there any particular reason for this?

[+daddyairplanes 10,146]

i wouldnt say its a hijack, pretty relevant if youre digging into teh why things were

only 100 of them built, and the units flying them were working on the below the radar techniques that the others would use up until the 90s. also those Hound Dog pylons after 1966 were more likely to be on an E models than D (until they started being replaced with SRAM in the early 70s)

bigger question in my head was how was SAC convinced to allow the D models to be primarily used for conventional bombing in the 60s, when providing central heat and heat in the Communist heartlands was their gospel at the time

yeah between Big Belly and Rivet Rambler it was better suited esp. when Linbacker 2 rolled around. But im talking the politics of SAC. Though retiring as CSAF in 1965, Lemay's presence still likely weighed heavy on the USAF in general and SAC in particular

Then again Gen MCConnell was a fighter guy originally. great, gotta go back and read the book again

[KJakker 888]

I think these are the attachments you want.

Alt B-52D.7z

Alt B-52G & B-52H.7z

B-52 Alt Weapons 1.7z

Edited February 17, 2021 by KJakker