Womenfly2 0 Posted May 31, 2009 (edited) The New York Times newspaper article .... Click here. Enjoy, WF2 Edited May 31, 2009 by Womenfly2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jammer28 0 Posted May 31, 2009 Womenfly2, Thank you very much for this. Interesting to say the least. Did you catch the reference to MvR and his “Tango Circus”? I found it amusing that Fonk would say, “Without boasting…” From all accounts, after flying, boasting was what he was famous for! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Canvas Wings 1 Posted June 1, 2009 (edited) Did you catch the reference to MvR and his "Tango Circus"? Yes was surprised to see that myself. I don't imagine I'm nearlly as wide read on WWI air history as a lot of people here, but I have never seen that apellation before;- but if Fonck used it and it was reported without clarification in the article, it must have been commonly understood. - Anyone?? :umnik2: Edited June 1, 2009 by Canvas Wings Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dutch_P47M 9 Posted June 1, 2009 (edited) Nice article, additional info at the Simhq RoF forum section were it was published earlier. Edited June 1, 2009 by Dutch_P47M Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Polovski 460 Posted June 1, 2009 Also says he had 3 witnesses independently witness for 33 kills "but it's more than 50 in actual fact" 50 claims? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OvS 8 Posted June 1, 2009 Also says he had 3 witnesses independently witness for 33 kills "but it's more than 50 in actual fact" 50 claims? Quote: "Without boasting. I may say I can take any machine in our group, and in a week, it will be the best of the lot - not because I am specially clever, but because I know the whole outfit thoroughly." Being a mechanic myself, I would have snuck in the hanger and cut the SOB's fuel line for saying that. It's easy to see, just in the short length of this article, that all that was written about his demeanor and attitude was totally true. #1 Rule of teamwork: YOU NEVER INSULT THE OTHER PLAYERS ON YOUR TEAM! On a side note, I never read that "The Flying Circus followed the Storks",did anyone else read that? As far as I know, they followed the RFC 56, and also moved around at will regardless, depending on where the Entente bombers were coming from. They followed the Storks... please! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dutch_P47M 9 Posted June 1, 2009 Read an article a while ago about France aces, they dislike Fonck fighting tactics and maybe they even dislike the person Fonck. I alway had in mind that Guynemer was lost in action and not that he was shot down????? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Creaghorn 10 Posted June 1, 2009 On a side note, I never read that "The Flying Circus followed the Storks",did anyone else read that? As far as I know, they followed the RFC 56, and also moved around at will regardless, depending on where the Entente bombers were coming from. as long as i know it was vice versa. the 56. followed the circus. that's why they were considered as the anti-richthofen-squadron with captain ball as their leader. but might also had been some propaganda work from the press, with all the rewards the pilot would get who succeeds in shooting down the red baron and a flightmember with a camera who should tape the dogfight on film. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+MK2 12 Posted June 1, 2009 as long as i know it was vice versa. the 56. followed the circus. that's why they were considered as the anti-richthofen-squadron with captain ball as their leader. but might also had been some propaganda work from the press, with all the rewards the pilot would get who succeeds in shooting down the red baron and a flightmember with a camera who should tape the dogfight on film. Great article. Thank you so much for posting it. His personality aside he might have been the greatest Ace ever IMHO. OVS, I think he meant that he knew which mechanics were the best. That is what he meant by knowing the entire "outfit". I think he was giving credit to them but I could be wrong. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gous 0 Posted June 1, 2009 Fonck was a well known poser. Guynmeyer on the other hand was very popular among the French. Apart from that, thanks womenfly for an amazing document. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Creaghorn 10 Posted June 1, 2009 Great article. Thank you so much for posting it. His personality aside he might have been the greatest Ace ever IMHO. the pilot who shoots MvR was supposed to get 5000 pounds sterling as reward, VC, a plane as a present of the type factory he uses and some special present. when MvR heard about it he said of course he also has to agree to it, but he wouldn't make getting the reward too easy. instead he said if there is some guy with a camera to film it, of course he will bag the cameraman first just for fun. probably only yellow press at that time. but at least MvR and all the other germans believed it. maybe only a coincidence, but that was the time when 56th came to flanders and the british changed their policy. it was the first squadron where the best aces were put into the same unit. before that they didn't do it but wanted all units to be somewhat equal qualitywise. the 56th followed the circus along the frontline. maybe also a coincidence because they got stationed where the most important work was necessary, and so did the circus. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OvS 8 Posted June 1, 2009 Great article. Thank you so much for posting it. His personality aside he might have been the greatest Ace ever IMHO. OVS, I think he meant that he knew which mechanics were the best. That is what he meant by knowing the entire "outfit". I think he was giving credit to them but I could be wrong. No, check-out the previous sentence, he points out that a pilot is taking his life in his hands by allowing a mechanic to tweak his plane, and that was not good enough for him. There were a few pilots that worked on their own planes, Fonck was certainly not the first, but his demeanor about it is what is so annoying. Who better to trust than your own 'pit crew'. I think he what he means by 'outfit' is what the plane is 'outfitted' with, like motor, carb, etc. I re-read it a few times as I was thinking the same as you, that 'outfit' meaning the military word for group, operation... etc. But, no, he definitely means the powerplant and set-up of the plane. Other than that, yes, I agree... I really have to say that hands down he was the best true fighter pilot. Although I have to add that Udet was right there as well, maybe not for kill numbers, but sheer piloting skill. There is no taking away what Fonck did, but it's a shame he had such a way about him. That's like meeting Tiger Woods and him being the biggest jerk on the planet. OvS Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
