Joining the Marines?

[lexicon 0]

I was thinking about joining the Marines. But I have a few obstacles the first is that I have taken medication for depression for a long time. I have not taken medication in 6 months. But they always see this as a problem. My recruiter said, "Just lie". My second problem is that I have scars on my wrists (I will let you guess why). So my recruiters said get tattoos.... :P I would be willing to do that but all of this is a problem because if I do get in the Marines and I lied to get in then it could get me a dishonorable discharge down the road. Don't you have to sign a medical release? They could find out some things about my past.

 

All of this is really hard because my brother is in the Marines and I would like to go with him. So my question to the military people here is should I go for it and take the risk or should I not do it? I know that with any government job/occupation any sign of mental illness is bad but I know I am fine I just don’t want to get into legal trouble.

Edited August 14, 2004 by lexicon

[navychief 1]

Lexicon,

 

I do understand your frustration in this. And I commend you for wanting to serve our country in the proud tradition of the US Marines.

 

One thing you need to know, however, is that at some point, a background check will be done, and family/friends will be asked questions. If anything in your past, such as you alluded to, is brought up, and it is discovered that you lied, you are correct that you would probably be discharged. I doubt a dishonorable discharge would be assigned, however. Usually, a bad conduct discharge, or general discharge would be given, if I am not mistaken.

 

You need to do what you feel is best for yourself, however. But be aware of the possible consequences.

 

Good luck.

 

Navy Chief

[Scout_51 0]

"Just lie". My second problem is that I have scars on my wrists (I will let you guess why). So my recruiters said get tattoos

First thing Id say is STAY AWAY from that particular recruiter!,second thing Id suggest is go to another office perhaps,be blunt,direct and I can tell you they would be same way with you..but please STAY away from that particular recruiter..he NOT doing you OR the CORPS any favors

[lexicon 0]

First thing Id say is STAY AWAY from that particular recruiter!,second thing Id suggest is go to another office perhaps,be blunt,direct and I can tell you they would be same way with you..but please STAY away from that particular recruiter..he NOT doing you OR the CORPS any favors

The funny thing is that the recruiter was in Recon SF, a world class TRI-Atholon winner, and he was in some movies even (Courage Under Fire). He's older and he's a Master Srg that has a lot of connections. He got my brother in a while ago but my brother had a felony. He has gone out of the way for people. My friend is also going on the "buddy pass" he also had a lot of wavers. It's hard to know if you can trust him or not.

 

 

Well... I have a lot of thinking to do because if this guy goes out on a limb for me I don't want to disappoint him. Nor do I want to get him in trouble. So I need to be sure as Navy Chief said. But thanks for you advice :)

Edited August 14, 2004 by lexicon

[firehawkordy 34]

Take Scout's advice, STAY AWAY from that recruiter. If you are told to lie, that should be a red flag for you. I also commend you in wanting to serve your country,but, a fraudulent enlistment is not the way to start.

 

The best thing to do is go to another recruiter in another branch and be up front. The Marines have the highest standards, so if you are told no or to come back in anther six months, chances are a legit Marine recruiter can't touch you. I hate to burst your bubble but thats how it is.

 

One more thing, if you made an attempt on your life, even if you are accepted your choices will be limited. In the late '90s, Clinton signed into law a bill that made it unlawful to posess a firearm if the following conditions exist:

 

Conviction of domestic violence

Any crime, however minor, in which a firearm was used.

Attempted suicide

Court ordered mental health counseling

 

This law affected both military and law enforcement personel also. My unit had to evaluate all Deadly Force qualified watch standers. This was done throught out the military.

 

Again, I am sorry to give you this info, but better now than getting halfway through training and be sent home.

[lexicon 0]

Well I think I will try and follow your advice. I know this was an unusual question but thanks for answering. B)

[SDirickson 0]

FHO is right about the Marine's having strict standards. They are second only to the AF. Talk to an Army and Navy recruiter as well, see what they can do. You might be able to make a service transfer. I have a friend with multiple arrests and things on his record, including drug usage, and he was able to get a waiver to enlist in the Army. Another had severe athsma and attempted suicide and she was able to enlist as well.

 

And as a servicemember, you'll hold a clearence level of some type. They're serious about those background checks. I had a guy interview me for hours because my mother has a dual citizenship with Sweden.

 

Also, make sure that the Marine Corps is what you want. I'll tell you, I could never be a Marine. I'm definately not hooah enough.

 

But absolutely don't lie on the forms. Its not worth it if they find out. The best option is to talk to different recruiters.

 

No matter whats on your record, if you can display to them enough willingness to join the military, they'll find a way for you. Just be persistant and honest.

[zagnut 0]

Lex,

 

Take Chief's, SDirickson's, Scout's, and Firehawkordy's advice, check twice before you decide on the path of the military (in general). I understand you want to be with your brother; actually, my brother is 18 and in the DEP program. He would've left last June, but he had to lose around 10 pounds to make weight even though he was a bench-pressing fool. Long story short, his recruiter put him on a laxitave, PT, and nill-water diet before he was supposed to ship, and at the time I infomed him about how some of these recruiters work. Lest to say, he ripped a muscle in his abdominal area and was withheld until September. Now, I understand that you have had problems in the past. Unfortunatley the U.S. Gov. doesn't make certain exceptions for those who enlist and lie. I know that you want to be closer to your brother, but beware of the unnecessary trouble that you could cause for yourself and your family. To be upfront with you. I got a DWI from 1999, and now I'm going up for a security clearence. I know since this is my 3rd enlistment, that I WILL have trouble securing it. I know for a fact that this will impede my military career, but I'm still going for it because I was honest about what happened.

 

LEX, you need to be honest with your recruiter and expect and honest answer back. I can't express that enough! If he doesn't give you an honest answer, which you deserve, then he shouldn't be in that MOS. The first thing about being in the military requires rules. These rules are always applied and are far more harsh than the civilain side, and it's not worth the gamble.

 

 

My advice to you is to consult with a new recruiter, even over the phone is OK, just be honest and make sure that you have that person's full attention. After that, you decide what is right for you. Just make sure that you are honest with that person..... Seriously, it can come back to haunt you.

 

I wish you luck on your endeavor, I've been there, and it's not easy. Yet, if you have the determination and the right mindset, you WILL always succeed!

 

Good luck Lex, send me a PM if you need more info.

Edited August 14, 2004 by zagnut

[Dagger 21]

Ok..gotta throw in my 2 cents worth...GREAT choice with the CORPS,RUN,don't walk away from that recruiter,also just be up front about your past..like everyone has said there will be a back ground check,and there will be pych elavs. BUT don't let that bother you...just decide if you want to be a Marine,if so find a recruiter that wants to know the truth,I saw guys with alot worse than scars on their wrists make and became GREAT born again Marines.I won't lie to you and say it's easy..IT'S NOT,then if iy was even Navy Chiefs could be one :D (sorry Chief had to get atleast one jab in)heck even Chaingun could have been one( :ph34r: ).But what it is ..a great future and great way of life,you'll build friendships that are based on trust and loyalty,you'll learn just what you have inside you and you will be forever a Marine.

My best advice would be to talk to ALL recruiters from every branch...and I might even recommend the Coast Guard...they're not under DoD except in times of war and are higher payed.

Keep us up to date on whats going on.

[Creepy847 0]

First you will probably never get into any branch if they find out you have a history of mental illness. It would require alot of effort on behalf of your recruiter an some recruiters just wont waste all that time on one person if they think its for null. You have to face the fact that it would be very uncomfortable to hand you a weapon or have you handle weapons if they suspect you have a history of mental illness or a habit of cutting yourself.

 

The recruiter is only trying to help you. I doubt very much youll be able to walk into a recruiter office an tell them you have a history of mental illness or you have had a history of slashing yourself. Please dont take that wrong. Its just a fact. The only way around this is to keep your mouth shut.

 

Depression meds will not show up in your system if you have been off them for over 6 months. There will always be a medical history on anyone. Its like you broke your arm. If they find out an they research it then yes theres a good chance that will pop up, but it will take time an resources an with the current situation today the recruiters dont have time to search thru that s**t.

 

Now your mental issues are considered very private. Most Dr's that treat you also have a confidentiality guidelines. That means theyre suppose to keep theyre traps shut. Now if you have had legal issues involving depression such as you have gotten depressed then decided to steal cars or hurt people an its become a matter of the state an you have been found guilty of such crimes it will be very difficult for that to not show up. They will run a history check on you an if you have any crimes pending or past tried they will show up.

 

Recruiters arent bad people an yes some will tell you to lie but then again you have to see it from there eyes. You walk in an say I want to be a Marine. Then you say I have a history of this an that. Yes its nice that your honest enough to say that but thats not what they want to hear. It causes much more work. ALot of times recruiters are trying to make there numbers an the last thing they want to do is spend hours waivering you for this an that.

 

Mental illness is pretty hard to waiver. I would be very nervous having you in my plt if I knew or even suspected you had a case of depression or the impluse to hurt yourself. I suspect your young but your now getting into a different world. You may be asked to go overseas in engaged an enemy. If your fellow Marines suspect anything weak about you they will be very wary about you. Youll have to proof yourself time an again till they feel a sense of security with you.

 

On top of that there are programs in the Marines where you might not want to take assignment. Such as the PRP program. These programs an assignments could be from Barracks Duty to Fast companies or Embassy Duty. These billets require extensive background checks. Including talking to friends family an other methods of finding out who you really are an what your history was.

 

Now the larger question. Military service for all its good things can be very depressing. Time overseas limited personal space physical an metal an constant stress can push folks over the edge. I know you said you have a brother in the Marines an thats a pretty big motivater but it should be more than that. It has to be in your heart of hearts. My brother an I were in the Marines together. For afew years I wasnt even stationed on the same coast as he was. After 3 years we finally ran into each other but it was only for a weak.

 

You have some thinking to do. This really isnt about your brother this is about you an your future an how motivated you truly are. Theres a war on right now an I highly doubt this will end anytime soon. The days of peaceful service an getting away from your spouse an kids for the weekend for beers an laughs is pretty much over. You face the serious test ahead. You may find yourself in harms way an theres a very good chance you may be directly involved in combat. If you choose combat arms you stand very good chance of going overseas.

 

Alot of folks have no idea the price of what is going on in Iraq an Afgan. Just about 1000 killed an another 6000 wounded. Alot of those wounded will never be the same. Arms legs hands eyes are gone. Also on top of that they will now have to deal with PTSD an other mental injuries.

 

Theres alot to gain from the Service but theres alot to loose. For me I joined when I turned 17. In my mind there was no question of my motivation. I come from a family of Marines an paratroopers. I didnt do it for brothers or family. For me it was my deep down commitment of what I loved about my country an my feelings that I needed to take that step to do my part.

 

Sorry this is so long but your question has no short answer. If you want to join you better be prepared to do whatever you can to get in. If your not willing to do that then your not as sure as you should be an should take a step back an think harder about your decision.

 

If you get caught for lying it will most likely cost you a medical or general discharge but Im not a jag so this is just speculation.

 

R/S

Creepy847

Semper Fi.

 

Heres some info you might find helpful.

 

An honorable discharge can occur for several reasons:

 

the contracted period of service is finished;

an order of a superior or military court decides the term of service is over;

the conflict is finished and the military unit is disbanding;

being passed up twice in a row for promotion when eligible, though this may vary by branch of service;

certain other circumstances, including (in some countries) homosexuality, though in the United States this was replaced by the "don't ask, don't tell" policy in 1993.

A medical discharge is given when the service member has a medical condition that makes them unfit for military service. This may be an injury sustained in combat.

 

A less than honorable discharge refers to a discharge that occurs under other than honorable conditions. This can be due to generally improper conduct, conviction of a crime either in a military court martial or a civilian court, or some other inappropriate action on the part of a soldier or someone associated with that soldier.

 

The United States military subdivides less-than-honorable discharges into four categories, in increasing order of severity:

 

general discharge;

undesirable discharge;

bad conduct discharge; and

dishonorable discharge.

Undesirable discharges or worse disqualify the soldier from receiving veterans' benefits under most circumstances, and any less-than-honorable discharge - even a general discharge - usually renders the discharged soldier ineligible for unemployment insurance benefits, because such a discharge is considered tantamount to having been "fired" from the most recently-held job.

 

In addition, those given dishonorable discharges permanently forfeit certain citizenship rights, including the right to vote or legally possess a firearm in certain states. According to the government, there is no way for one to lose citizenship as such by any means, aside from voluntarily, and there is no federal law barring discharged soldiers from voting.

[SDirickson 0]

About the Coast Guard for a sec. If you want to be in command of a ship, the CG is the way to go. In the Navy, it might be 18 years before you get full command of a ship, and after that, you're off to a staff job. In the CG, you start rotating between CO and XO of increasingly large commands after as little as eight years.

[firehawkordy 34]

Depression meds will not show up in your system if you have been off them for over 6 months. There will always be a medical history on anyone. Its like you broke your arm. If they find out an they research it then yes theres a good chance that will pop up, but it will take time an resources an with the current situation today the recruiters dont have time to search thru that s**t.

 

Now your mental issues are considered very private. Most Dr's that treat you also have a confidentiality guidelines. That means theyre suppose to keep theyre traps shut. .

Okay, I have to make this very clear. On enlisting, or appliing for a Security Clearance, you will have to sign a "Release of Medical History/Records". This allows the DoD, and the seprate branches to look at your entire medical history.

New federal laws are restricve in what can be released, but if you sign a waiver, all is open to investigation.

The new regs are called "HIPPA". Dont ask me what it stands for, but I work for the county Medical Center here where I live and EVERYONE from the folk who work in the kitchen to the caregivers have to take annual training in Patient Privacy.

I'll say this again,

Your background check will be very thorough,They will talk to people you hadn't thought of in years. The older you are, the more folk they talk to. If you have something to hide, THEY WILL find it, it may take time, but if something in your paperwork doesn't look right, they will look deeper.

 

If you are honest and open, you may have a chance to get in, if you lie or hide a secret, the doors will be closed.

 

Please considder all that has been offered to you, even if you are not accepted, there are other ways to serve your country, ones that give good life and job experiance. The PEACE Corps is still a going concern and have a bigger impact on peoples lives than the military. In some cases it is more dangerous and challenging. Service to country is noble, but in many cases we forget the military is not the only path.

[Dagger 21]

You're getting some great views and alot of info...take some time before deciding to persue any course of action.First how old are you? You sound like a person whos not quit sure of the direction you want to go...I spent 8 years in the corps and My opinion is VERY biased.Take some time,think about it...the Corps or military in general isn't for everyone,it is tough,and it's work...alot of work.My best advice for you is think about where you want to be say 5 years from now...look at the long term.If you think the military is for you then talk to a recruiter..if you have ANY doubts,then stay out,theres alot of things for a young person to do.Not everyone can serve...don't let that bother you.follow your heart and make a decision based on facts and that gut feeling you'll get telling you this is right or this is wrong.Best of luck to you...

[lexicon 0]

Thanks for all the info guys. I do appreciate it I know the implications of lying now. But one of the reasons I want to be a Marine is my physical conditioning. I went into the recruiter’s office and pulled out 60 pull-ups 320 push-ups and 250 timed sit-ups and ran 6 miles (on a track ) for them in less than 15 mins but they let me do what I could with out a time limit becuase they can see I am in good shape. I qualify for a bonus for doing this ($25,000 maybe). At MEPS I know there are people that can’t do 1 pull-up. Physically I am most likely already like a Marine. I do nothing but work out and run all the time. The guys in the recruiter’s office loved me and had a great time watching me do these things. I was honest with them and my recruiter talked to some people and I guess some one on the very top cleared and waved every thing for me. So I told them that I am going to think about it for two weeks (they did not like that) but it’s my life. Then if I decide to do it I will leave on the 18th of October and then I will go to San Diego. I know that physically the Marines will be ok for me but I also know that mentally I will be born again hard. So any ways thanks for all the posts and your advice.

 

 

PS: I am 23 years old if any of you were wondering.

Edited August 14, 2004 by lexicon

[PG_Raptor 0]

I went into the recruiter’s office and pulled out 60 pull-ups 320 push-ups and 250 timed sit-ups and ran 6 miles (on a track ) for them in less than 15 mins

[SDirickson 0]

Holy s**t, dude. If you can bust out those kinda PT scores, then the mental won't be s**t. Trust me. When you go through basic, having a skill like that to fall back on is a life saver. Its so much easier getting through the mental aspects when you don't have to worry about the physical. Besides, its always a good anti-depressant watching other people screw up, lol.

[Scout_51 0]

Its so much easier getting through the mental aspects when you don't have to worry about the physical

thats a good point,but lets be fully honest,MARINES,NAVY,AIR FORCE,ARMY(Airborne!) they allways tell you straight up,it is your ATTITUDE,your MINDSET they want,the body WILL FOLLOW what your MIND tells it to,your WILL is what they say IS required,everything else DOES fall in place..we all seen little squirly eyeglasses wearing little guys turn into monsters out in combat or a hard deployment,by same token we all seen supermen break down..it is the MINDSET

[Gator 0]

First of all the medication is a definate sign fo doom in the service. If youa re taking a major depression med it is likely that you have a chemical inbalance int he brain. The service especially the marine corps is a hard life chocked full of stress. especially in combat. I highly recomend you not join with any recruiter for that. AS for the tattoos that is not an option either. if you have any visible tattoos the marines will not take you anymore for that either.

 

Sounds like you have went through some very trying times. I would not want to have you risk your self for the service int his way. there are many other ways to support the sailors, soldiers, marines and zoomies(airforce) with out actually joining. Having done a stint as a recruiter I had to learn the policies for all of the services. the only way the marines or navy could bring you in with out you lying is for you to be off your meds for 2 years with no episodes and you will have to be inthe treatment of a psychologist or psychiatrist during that time who will give you a clean bill of health. Then and only then can we bring you in the navy. As much as you want to join please look at this scenario and consider if it would be worth it to join at this time.

 

You are under enemy fire and you have an attaack and freeze. suddenly you are not funcitoning and the marines you serve with need your help. If yiou can not function then you are now a detriment to your platoon.

 

Young and old marines are dying everyday in IRAQ. I implore you to make an appointment with a psychologist first and discuss this with them and see where you stand on the road to recovery. You sound really bright and have a brite future ahead of you with out the military.

 

I dont want to sound mean or callous. I am just trying to be a voice fo reason and air the truth of the decisions and their consequences that are ahead of you.

 

 

Gator

[lexicon 0]

Thanks Gator for being upfront with me. I do understand these rules and laws as they were explained to me. We were able to get around the rules with testing my PT scores and then submitting them to the command at MEPS center for their approval. And they cleared me based on my PT test. As far as mental "road to recovery" I don't see a psychiatrist any more and he gave me the go ahead to do this if I want to. You see the reason for my cutting was me being hard on my self and I was 16 at the time. And I would say I never had a chemical imbalance. I don't believe in that because with every emotion your brain chemicals change. This I believe is not the reason I ever had any problems. It was my upbringing and really nothing more. It's hard to say if some one is really mentally ill. I know from a military standpoint they can't just take my word that I am fine. But I know I am and I know I can prove it. I know it's going to be hard but I don't mind getting drilled and the stress of that I will take very well. Working out extremely hard has been my outlet for over coming stress. So the more stress I have the more I will want to do the physical things because this is a comfort zone for me. I will consider doing other things but right now I just don’t have any other things going for me. And if it is a mistake then the worst that can happen is I will get discharged. The Marine BT is like Army Ranger training for the most part except a few things (being biased). Not every one can be a Marine I know. And as some other Marines have told me I can get discharged if they feel I am now going to do well mentally. So worst-case scenario I will but get the boot in my ass and have to go home. :(

Edited August 16, 2004 by lexicon

[Snacky 0]

Lex, why not get college under your belt bud?? Life is much better in the military as an Officer. Spending 4 years in school also gives you a buffer of time to show them that you have recovered and are stable. I feel for ya because too many times young guys don't realize how things early in life can effect you from that point on.

Like everyone else has said, you stay honest and maintain your integrity and you will overcome this and find your place. If you really want to be a Marine then the only thing holding you back is you. Everyone here has given you advice and now it's up to you to make the right decision. Best of luck to you and I think we are all pulling for you. Never give up, never quit.

[utley 0]

Hey yall...Im new at this board, been coming here for a long time, thought I would put my 2 cents in here.

 

I went into the marines in 2000, came out in 2002. Severe hernia, intestines damn near came out of my scrote. Got hard one day in training is how it went down.

 

Anyways, during my stint thru boot camp, we had this kid named pannel...he tried to hang himself with his boot laces from the top rack. Needless to say they gave him the boot a few days later. Another recruit tossed himself from 3rd deck near the chow hall one night during firewatch. He lived, escaped uninjured (albeit a little shook up) but he got his million dollar wound. I managed to get into bootcamp with bad hearing and a few tickets still out (one was a traffic warrant) and I dont recall a psych eval. I'm not saying they do that now, but they didnt when I went thru MEPS.

 

If you are interested in joining the Marines, make sure its the one for you. It is very different from the way the Army and Air Force trains (I should know, I spent some time at Ft. Wood watching army nasties train) their guys. Most of the time is spent in drill, and the other 1/3 of boot camp is spent shooting or cleaning your rifle. And yes them Drill Instructors will CHEW YOU UP!!! But if you do go to the marines, this is my opinion though and it is definately not the right opinion, but if you trust your recruiter enough, he will help you out if he is sincere enough. You said he is a Master Sergeant right? Methinks Tops Gunny knows that most ppl want to be a freakin marine. And on that he will do everything in his power to HELP YOU! This is what mine did...I had 1500 bones in hot checks out there somewhere, on top of a med condition, and I still got in.

 

Them scars on your wrist can be surgically altered can they not??? Ask your recruiter if you can get plastic surgery done and get them removed. They dont see scars, they dont report scars, and they dont look for scar history in the books(unless you give them a reason).

 

And for the love of god, please make sure its what you want to do. The Marine Corps Basic Training is NO-JOKE! It isnt that hard, but its the mentality of the way it is done. The physical part is the easiest, believe me when I say that.

 

Ask me how I busted my scrote and I will tell you a little story about it. Its really quite amazing. It will also tell you the kind of mentality the Marines expect from their recruits.

 

Just make sure its for you. I cannot stress that enough.

P.S. I'm not an officer...I picked that sig up somewhere...cant really find an enlisted EGA...just so y'all know I'm not posing.

 

Hitman out

[lexicon 0]

Lex, why not get college under your belt bud??  Life is much better in the military as an Officer. Spending 4 years in school also gives you a buffer of time to show them that you have recovered and are stable. I feel for ya because too many times young guys don't realize how things early in life can effect you from that point on.

Like everyone else has said, you stay honest and maintain your integrity and you will overcome this and find your place. If you really want to be a Marine then the only thing holding you back is you. Everyone here has given you advice and now it's up to you to make the right decision. Best of luck to you and I think we are all pulling for you. Never give up, never quit.

Well I have an AS in information systems. So with my PT scores I am going to get a record $30,000 bonus.... I am going to do it so I will be fine. I went to MEPS so I am in as of now. I kicked ass there but I know there is a long way to go. But some people that are Marines are just weak compared to me. But I am going to get my scars laser removed so I will be fine with that. I am not even worried about it now. BT is going to be a breeze for me. I think I made the right decision because I can kick my DI’s ass with out trying so I will be fine. I got to meet him, which is very rare so I am told (one of them).

 

 

I can’t wait to get drilled because I think I have some thing to prove now I am going to show every DI I have been in hell and I can defeat them in every thing they try to do. I don’t even care what people say now because I went to PT with Marines that can’t keep up with me. I am glad I waited this long because I am ready now. But on a down note I will go to Iraq when I am done with BT and IT. So I am going to Iraq for sure but I plan on going into Recon like my brother is and maybe also a sniper if I have the QAL’s.

 

I know 2 Marine snipers now and they say if I don't do it I am missing out in my reason for living.

Edited August 17, 2004 by lexicon