Correct "Brayelle" Location

[Olham 164]

When Jasta 11 was established, their first aerodrome was "Brayelle" near Douai.

I looked that up in "The Jasta Pilots", and found the dot and number for this airfield north of Douai in that map.

So I began searching there, but couldn't find a village or settlement of that name there.

Then I went to the war maps at McMaster University and searched around Douai.

That way I found the sign for "German aerodrome" above a settlement named "Brayelle" west-southwest of Douai.

The map was from summer 1918, but I guess the place is still the same airfield, from where von Richthofen

led his own Jagdstaffel into combat early 1917.

 

 

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Edited July 28, 2012 by Olham

[DukeIronHand 8]

For what its worth I used to teach map reading and land navigation for the U.S.M.C.

 

On a civilian map it means a "landmark".

 

We used to use it in the Marines (unofficially) to mark our objective since it stood out.

 

I seem to have a faint memory of also using it being used to mark Commands Posts (or was it Listening Posts?) but am not sure.

 

With the line thru it it must mean something.

 

Maybe the Army (RAF_Louvert)or our European military friends have additional info.

Edited July 26, 2012 by DukeIronHand

[Olham 164]

Thanks for your interest, Duke - seems I have found the map symbols explained at that maps site. Here is a wider bit of map of that area,

with explanations. I don't know if this kind of stuff ever interests anyone here? I often seem to get carried away with such sort of research.

 

 

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Edited July 26, 2012 by Olham

[HumanDrone 4]

I find them fascinating, myself. I'm a real map guy, and I love things like Google Earth, etc. But one thing I guess I never thought about until just now. We have Supply Dumps and Ammo Dumps and even Unknown Dumps. That's an odd idiosyncrasy of English usage - usually a "dump" is where useless stuff goes!

[Hauksbee 103]

I don't know if this kind of stuff ever interests anyone here?

Yes! Most definitely. Keep it coming.

Edited July 26, 2012 by Hauksbee

[Olham 164]

That's an odd idiosyncrasy of English usage - usually a "dump" is where useless stuff goes!

I looked the word up in my online-dictionary, and the most of the meanings were like you say, HumanDrone.

 

But the was also another meaning: "unloading point, unloading area".

So I guess it's a kind of shag or tent, where the suppliers drove the things to and unloaded and stored them.

The bataillons sent their own trucks there then, when they need ammo or whatever.

 

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Edited July 26, 2012 by Olham

[angles1100 0]

"I don't know if this kind of stuff ever interests anyone here?"

 

I'll put my hand up for more , im always fascinated buy the things you come up with Olham , please more

 

 

 

cheers

[RAF_Louvert 101]

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Thanks for sharing, Olham. I just love old maps, in particular WWI era maps. But then folks here probably knew that already.

 

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[Dej 17]

The trouble with the location of aerodromes as depicted on British trench maps of the period is that they show a symbol, at a point.

 

In reality of course an aerodrome covered a fairly large area. Generally there is little or no indication of this, nor the aerodrome's orientation, on the map. Sometimes, on the more detailed maps (1:20000 or less) hangars and sheds will have been drawn in too which provides a clue but usually one will have to check the location in Goggle Maps or Google Earth and hazard a guess from the shape of the field(s) that remain. In the case of La Brayelle there's a chuffing great Renault factory bang on top of it so one can't even do that!

Edited July 27, 2012 by Dej

[Olham 164]

Now I found an aerial photograph at "The Aerodrome", and so I could determine the exact location on the map.

(See first post - I changed the pictures).

 

I had to stick two different maps together, cause Douai lay at a cross point between two war maps.

The canal is not linking up exactly, but that is definitely a map incorrection.

There was a house on the aerodrome ground, which can be seen in the photo and the map.

I think it's done.

[Hasse Wind 46]

Depending on the scale, some of those maps in the collection can be very accurate, showing the locations of individual enemy machine gun nests and bunkers and huts. Obviously such maps were meant for the ground forces and not pilots. It would be great to find a collection of maps for pilots, both Entente and Central Powers.

[Olham 164]

Now I have added two other views (from GoogleMaps) to my picture; so there is the final version now in post 1.

[Dej 17]

Nice work, Olham!

 

I hope you're posting this over at The Aerodrome too. I think Mike O'Connor visits there and your detective work provides a more definitive position for the aerodrome than he attempts in 'In The Footsteps Of The Red Baron'.

[Olham 164]

Okay, thanks Dej, will do.

 

Edit: Dej, do you know how to insert a picture at "The Aerodrome"?

I put the graphic into a private gallery here at CombatAce, copied the URL-link

and inserted it at "The Aerodrome" - but all I get there is a text line?

Edited July 29, 2012 by Olham

[RAF_Louvert 101]

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Outstanding work Olham. Well done, Sir.

 

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[Dej 17]

Okay, thanks Dej, will do.

 

Edit: Dej, do you know how to insert a picture at "The Aerodrome"?

I put the graphic into a private gallery here at CombatAce, copied the URL-link

and inserted it at "The Aerodrome" - but all I get there is a text line?

 

You linked a link, not a graphic, Olham.

 

This is the code you should be using, I think:

[img=http://combatace.com/uploads/gallery/album_796/tn_gallery_46143_796_162740.jpg]

Previewed okay for me, anyway

 

To be properly scholarly about it, you should probably provide the links for the maps you used over at McMasters too, or at least give the map sector and name.

Edited July 29, 2012 by Dej

[Olham 164]

Thank you, Dej - now it worked.

Well, the map refence - I would have to search it again. I'll do, if anyone asks for it.

[Dej 17]

Thank you, Dej - now it worked.

Well, the map refence - I would have to search it again. I'll do, if anyone asks for it.

 

I checked against my mapping project data... It's map 062WW1 in Sector 51b... should anyone ask.