How Come all Combat flight Sims are stuck in the WWII era...

[SkyStrike 15]

Hi Everyone;

I've always been wondering: How come the most recently released combat flight sims for the P.C. are still stuck in the World War II era? As for the few jet sims they don't seem to proceed further than Vietnam....

 

Someone ought to design a combat jet sim with all the best fiighter jets of the last two decades...

 

Cheers!

[FastCargo 412]

Yea, good luck with that.

 

FastCargo

[FOTF 0]

You're kidding, right?

[Hawk MMS 0]

The guys here and elsewhere have made almost everything under the sun that has engines and wings. I have 11 GB's of planes WW2, Cold War, Modern), terrains, skins, campaigns, effects and so much more. The SF, WOV, WOE series gives you all this and more. Best money I have ever spent for computer games. I just downloaded WOV tonight (now i am complete, at least until that sick new 3rdwire sim comes out).

 

 

 

 

Thanks again to all who have contributed to this fine sim and board. i mean it. My wife is out of town for work and I actually get to get some time in. Hence the WOV purchase.

[RunsWithScissors 0]

you just got WoV & you're in here posting? Get back in that cockpit!

[Hawk MMS 0]

you just got WoV & you're in here posting? Get back in that cockpit!

 

 

Fly a little...

 

DOWNLOAD A LOT.

[Wrench 9,850]

Fly a little...

 

DOWNLOAD A LOT.

 

 

Gentleman, there you have it: the new CombatAce motto!!!

 

As to the original question....I'm not even try to reply to that. The evidence speaks for itself, as CSI Grissom would say

 

Wrench

kevin stein

[RunsWithScissors 0]

Right. This was bugging me since I read it. I just didn't feel that I've been around here long enough to make fun of it.

[JediMaster 451]

To be fair, there really aren't any sims with 90s and 00s stuff on the market other than F4:AF and LOMAC that let you have all the stuff those planes have now. Even the next TK sim will end in 1982 to keep the reqs for fancy avionics down. The last one to really do it was Jane's USAF.

 

Only ones I've seen lately are Over G Fighters and Ace Combat for the consoles, and those barely qualify because of their arcade nature.

 

While you can DL recent jets for WOE and such, you're still limited in what you can do with them vs what those older sims let you do. I'd love a modern rendition of ATF/NATO Fighters/Fighter Anthology with all those modern planes up to and including the F-22, F-35, F/A-18E/F, Typhoon II, Rafale, Gripen, Su-35, Su-30MK, MiG-35, etc etc. I just don't know if we'll see it unless several releases down the road TK finally goes that route.

[Wolf65 0]

I really don't get why developers keep using the same old planes, i read somewhere that when there finnished with Black Shark for LOMAC there going to make an f-16 and A-10 sim.

 

I don't want to fly those planes i want to fly the Eurfighter, Raptor, F-35, Rafale.....

[TX3RN0BILL 3]

Wolf65, it's actually great honor to some of the planes being better than their successors... I mean, no F-35 will be able to fully replace the sturdiness of the A-10... But in terms of simulations I must agree that it's a pity that there is no more innovative ground taken... I guess the new stuff is bound to be left to the community to make...

[+Zurawski 33]

As I see it... Sim enthusiasts associate aircraft with a readily recognizable theater of conflict or era of conflict. Once you get into these new warbirds, there is a sort of disconnect.

 

Don't get me wrong... these new birds are spectacular and I would love a chance to toss them around the sky... I just think that fictional theaters and conflicts turn off a lot of the purists (who we know are also the most vocal)...

 

What we need is a good ol'fashion world war to spur these developers into creating modern-day content!

 

LOL!

[Wolf65 0]

Wolf65, it's actually great honor to some of the planes being better than their successors... I mean, no F-35 will be able to fully replace the sturdiness of the A-10...

 

I don't have anything against the planes, i for instance love the F-16. And the A-10 is a great airfcraft.

But, I want a little more aircraft in flight sims and not just the same old.

 

Zurawski, that never occured to me.

That must be the reason.

Edited September 20, 2007 by Wolf65

[+Fates 63]

Hi Everyone;

I've always been wondering: How come the most recently released combat flight sims for the P.C. are still stuck in the World War II era? As for the few jet sims they don't seem to proceed further than Vietnam....

 

Someone ought to design a combat jet sim with all the best fiighter jets of the last two decades...

 

Cheers!

 

The basic problem around creating a modern day combat flight sim is the powerful avionics of these aircraft vs. your PC's capabilities to simulate them while still delivering incredible graphics at a descent framerate. WOV and WOE, IMHO, bring you descent avionics, but the cost is such that graphics take a hit. LOMAC delivers some excellent graphics, and very good avionics, but your PC takes the hit in framerate. The problems for developers is they have to build a game that will sell, not just a game that will only sell to HIGH END PC's.

 

When you create a WW2 flight sim, you can dumb down the avionics and increase the graphical world. This has been the tendancy for developers and it's not limited to the Flight Sim World.

[Wolf65 0]

I didn't know that...

Edited September 20, 2007 by Wolf65

[+{FL}Hausser 0]

I know I am coming in as a late sally but......

 

You have to keep one other BIG thing in mind when asking for a modern flight sim..... NATIONAL SECURITY OF ALL COUNTRIES INVOLVED!!!!

 

Many modern planes will never appear accurately with correct flight models, specs and electronics. Much of the equipment on these planes is at lowest "Confidential" information and protected by national security requirements. That doesn't even count the Secret and Top Secret information. It is VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY difficult for game makers to get permissions to release even semi-accurate models of these planes to the general public. Many of these systems are state of the art and the general public is not in the need to know on their avionics, flight models, etc. Take the old SR-71s for a great instance. Everyone knew they existed, everyone knew what they were for, everyone knew what they looked like, and some basic performance characteristics but that was it. The rest was security controlled. Very rarely did they even sit in plain view to be photographed and if they were you couldn't get anywhere close to them.

[eraser_tr 29]

That, and more pure and direct dogfighting with WW2 era stuff, with somewhat decent speed. But yes, the F-16, A-10 and F-15 start to get boring after a while. And why I'm getting started with my ATF/USNF project for strike fighters/WOE (yep jedi, I've found help and I'm going through with it)

 

I like thirdwire's way. They can do modern fairly well, especially once we get A/G radar with the new modes and HUD. You really don't need much more to do modern planes without going to the level of LOMAC and F4AF, which is IMHO a little frustrating to use. I want to be busy fighting, not setting my electronics. I think it would be a good move for TK to do the more modern, with the same simplicity as usual.

 

Hausser, 2 years ago, I got right up to the X-35 at Udvar Hazy(spelling?) and the SR-71 has been on the intrepid for ages. Sure, many exacts aren't known, but what is known is usually good enough for a flight sim unless you're a rivet counter.

Edited September 20, 2007 by eraser_tr

[Wolf65 0]

You have to keep one other BIG thing in mind when asking for a modern flight sim..... NATIONAL SECURITY OF ALL COUNTRIES INVOLVED!!!!

Yeah, that too.

 

I guess several years from now these planes will be realisticly modeled, but until then...

Edited September 20, 2007 by Wolf65

[+{FL}Hausser 0]

Hausser, 2 years ago, I got right up to the X-35 at Udvar Hazy(spelling?) and the SR-71 has been on the intrepid for ages. Sure, many exacts aren't known, but what is known is usually good enough for a flight sim unless you're a rivet counter.

 

Did you see inside? get inside? See flight controls and avionics? electronics? Outside close is one thing. Seeing the guts is another.

Edited September 20, 2007 by {FL}Hausser

[TX3RN0BILL 3]

FL Hausser, I remember being aboard the USS Intrepid in NY and that had a A-12 aboard... Don't remember seeing the "guts" of it... But hey, at least I flew around a bit in the A-6 cockpit simulator... I think I landed once well on the carrier... was fun...

 

As for Thirdwire simulations, I agree with eraser_tr, I don't think the way Thirdwire would represent new planes would put Governments in danger, because there's nothing stopping community members of portraying them in existing simulations, so... Bring on the Rafales and Gripens and Eurofighters and Berkuts and the whole rest!

[+Tailspin 3]

They've got (or had) an SR-71 on display at the USAF Weapons Museum outside Eglin AFB. You can walk right up to it and touch it....of course it was stripped of anything "important".

 

Anyway, 8-10 years ago the sim world was FULL of modern jet sims. We're just not in that "cycle" right now. Not so sure about the technology argument. At the hight of the modern jet sim era, graphics and effects (avionics, etc) were top notch. Before the advent of the sophisticated FPS's, flight sims drove the top end computer market. Now it takes a monster to run the new games. I don't see flight sims taxing computers any more than they are already.

[+JSF_Aggie 1,291]

Sure, many exacts aren't known, but what is known is usually good enough for a flight sim unless you're a rivet counter.

 

I don't agree if you're talking current day. But I guess if you don't know what you're missing, it's good enough.

[SkyStrike 15]

I know I am coming in as a late sally but......

 

You have to keep one other BIG thing in mind when asking for a modern flight sim..... NATIONAL SECURITY OF ALL COUNTRIES INVOLVED!!!!

 

OH PLEASE!!!!!!! Enough!!! Why not make a game based on Jane's USAF or WoE but with a superior graphic engine, better flight model & of course a fine choice of aircraft....

 

Games like jane's USAF were designed with a different flight model for each je plus well simulated avionics..

 

I don't think there's any question of a breach in national security by designing new jet-age combat sims...

Edited September 20, 2007 by Tomcat_ace

[SkyStrike 15]

The basic problem around creating a modern day combat flight sim is the powerful avionics of these aircraft vs. your PC's capabilities to simulate them while still delivering incredible graphics at a descent framerate. WOV and WOE, IMHO, bring you descent avionics, but the cost is such that graphics take a hit. LOMAC delivers some excellent graphics, and very good avionics, but your PC takes the hit in framerate. The problems for developers is they have to build a game that will sell, not just a game that will only sell to HIGH END PC's.

 

When you create a WW2 flight sim, you can dumb down the avionics and increase the graphical world. This has been the tendancy for developers and it's not limited to the Flight Sim World.

 

Yeah.. but what about Games Like Jane's F-15 , Israeli Air Force, USAF, and WOE? the avionics in these games are well simulated & the latter 3 games have at least 7 flyable jets...

[+{FL}Hausser 0]

I guess my arguments are being a little bit misintrepreted. I am not saying that a modern sim fighter game is not doable. I am saying it is difficult to make it doable with the "authenticity" that some if not many flight sim devotes expect. There are many people in the flight sim world that if it ain't exactly like it is in the actual world they don't wanna see it in a game. many game makers shy away from doing such things because they don't wanna get bashed by the hardcore "virtual" sim pilots that saw a video on the Military Channel and then get into a plane in a game and it isn't a perfect match.

 

As far as the comments that have been posted about the Sr-71 Blackbirds. Those have all been recent things within the last few years and as noted by one stripped down versions. When the SR-71s were in fulloperation you never would have seen that. My brother was a engine mechanic on F-111s at Mountain Home AFB in Idaho. When the SR-71 would land there they would taxi straight from the runway to a hanger and the doors would be closed, guards positioned at all entrances.

 

No I am not syaing modern fighters and planes are treated the same way but it is a far cry different from an operational plane to a display plane after they have been removed from service.