Sights

[Krasny 0]

I am flying a Fok.EIII. In iron sights view the bullets fly to the left of the sights.

 

How do I aim when flying a Fok.EIII?

[shredward 12]

Correct your aim, or speak to your ground crew

[Krasny 0]

Correct your aim, or speak to your ground crew

 

So the sights are useless?

[+Polovski 458]

The Iron sights view isn't in the EIII it's just a bit zoomed in view. Don't use F6 in that craft if you want to look down the sights.

TIR is the way for that, or use the tracers.

[RAF_Louvert 101]

Krasny, the sights will only get you "close". You will have to watch the tracers to really zero in on your target. At least, that is my personal experience with 'em so far.

 

Cheers!

 

Lou

[Krasny 0]

Thanks Lou.

 

I think aiming at the center and then correcting is probably the way to go.

 

What are the sights for? They seem to be a redundant piece of metal that adds to drag.

[Krasny 0]

How would TIR help me aim?

[Rickitycrate 10]

IMHO these early planes were low tech. The gun sights often were ornaments. A pilot uses the whole plane as his gun and because of knowing his weapon in effect he could fire from the hip rather than take a long slow look down the barrel and have all day to press the trigger at a tin can sitting on a fence post. If you are fixated on your gun sights you are likely to get shot down. From behind I center the enemy plane in my relation to the forward view from the cockpit and then it is a matter of proper elevation angle. I use the tracers at all times time fine tune my aim. Now deflection shooting is more of an art as you are in fact aiming your shots for where you hope the enemy will be rather than where he is. You "lead" or fire in front of the enemy plane. How much lead you use depends on factors like the speed of the e/a, your speed, distance and angle of attack. So relying on a gun sight is a bad form of attack as I see and will get you dead pronto. Become one with your plane ,young skywalker, and in time you will not think about aiming but will know when the time is right.

[Rickitycrate 10]

Tir will help with your situational awareness. It is of primary importance to know all you can about the situation around you. Shooting down an enmy is of little importance if you don't live to tell about it. With better vision you can anticipate the enemies actions and know where he has gone too. And what are his mates doing, Ther may be a target of opportunity coming up on your left althought the guy you were watching was veering to the right. Targets of opportunity is what it is all about IMHO. Let them cross your path rather than fixate on following because if you follw you too will be followed and then it is a matter of who goes down first.

[Rickitycrate 10]

Sorry but one more bit. It will soon become obvious that your views with the hat switch are very limited as determined by the original CFS3 engine. There are so many blind spots that you are in a terrible disadvantage. I know this because I fly OFF a great deal and as yet have not used Tir. I will be getting Tir soon and I know that it will level the playing field.

[Ras 0]

With the Albatros, or any of the twin gun German Machines there is No Designated front sight, each gun has a sight, but they're never used. You have an imaginary point of impact, it might be the top edge of your windscreen, or the X of 2 Braces. Likewise it's almost impossible to get a sight picture with the Sopwith Tripe or Pup.

If you need to aim, you're not close enough. You're using your aircraft as a weapon, try to ram him, but don't. When it looks like a crash is unavoidable, a short burst will suffice. Then do turn away or you day will be ruined. Trackir allows you to see everything, as if it were actually happening

 

 

I am wondering what some of you might think your situation awareness has improved and how well your shots are placed with the Trak IR? I still don't have one either and I can see that after many lost pilots, I have improved greatly as far as my kills/sucess is concerned. Rickitycrate, when you get it (or Olham) I believe you just have had yours in recent weeks, how much have your skills improved? Some? Very much? When one has to think about spending $125.00 and more (US) it doesn't come easy of course. I know there is Free track, but I have trouble virtually no skills like that and would not even consider it. Thanks all

[+Polovski 458]

Thanks Lou.

 

I think aiming at the center and then correcting is probably the way to go.

 

What are the sights for? They seem to be a redundant piece of metal that adds to drag.

 

With TIR you can move your eye and line up on the tracers and hold it there for subsequent shots. Wobbly yes, but in real life you'd also have a 100mph wind. G force and extreme cold to deal with so yes they'd be pretty useless. Use the tracers, that's what they are for.

F6 fixed sights view is fun, but completely unrealistic.

[Krasny 0]

Does this mean we're not going to get a AH64 type gun aiming system, with floating heads-up reticule an' all?

 

I may just dust off (literally) my TIR!

[+Polovski 458]

Yep best idea is to lick your finger and stick it in the air as good as anything ;)

[Rick Rawlings 136]

Does this mean we're not going to get a AH64 type gun aiming system, with floating heads-up reticule an' all?

 

I may just dust off (literally) my TIR!

 

In real life, of course, you could just lean over and look down the sights to get an approximation of where your shots will fall. The developers modeled this as well as they could with some of the F6 views. TIR will let you do just that and will probably help out alot. I'm not going to be one of those people who says just get close and don't aim, because that is a good way to run out of ammo. The N17 and SE5a have Aldis sights that work as advertised. Even in the Sopwith Tripe and N11, I have memorized where the rounds hit relative to the cross wires. If you want to have ammo for the homeward trip, I think it is necessary!

 

RR

[tttiger 0]

I'm on a roll now, so I might as well continue. There are those who claim a certain prowess with the arching trajectory of the bullet, regeresting hit's at 400 yards or better, that's within the confines of the game. Because in 1917 the bullet itself was travelling quite a bit slower, was of a different shape, therefore it had less retained energy, and was more prown to be thrown off course by the wind.

 

When the AI hits you from 400 yards out ( formally a 1000 ) They think it's WWII, and they're shooting .50 cals. . . it's a CFS3 thing

 

 

Uncle Al,

 

We went through this on your theory that machine guns jam because they overheat, which, of course, they don't.

 

This is yet another statement that is absolutely incorrect.

 

The .303 Mark VII bullets used in Vickers and Lewis MGs in WWI were exactly the same as the ones used in WWII. Same powder (cordite). Same shape and weight bullet. Same velocity. Same muzzle energy. Same ballistics. Same everything.

 

Ditto the 8mm German round. Ditto the US .30-06.

 

All were replaced in the 1950s by the 7.62 NATO round, which had very similar ballistics (in fact the bullet is exactly the same as the .30-06 -- which was adopted in 1906 and was copied from the German Spitzer round).

 

I agree you can't hit much with a machine gun at 400 yards if it's attached to a bobbing and very light airplane.

 

What was different in WWII was (generally) the gun platforms (the aircraft) were heavier and more stable and better able to handle the harsh vibration of the machine guns.

 

It had nothing to do with the bullets. They were exactly the same in both wars (except I doubt they had API -- armor piercing incendiary rounds -- in WWI but even API ballistics are pretty much the same as ball ammunition).

 

I'm not going to debate this with you.

 

But, please don't put out bad information. Look stuff up.

 

Google is your friend. So is Spell Check (it's prone, not prown and arcing, not arching).

 

Aloha,

 

ttt

Edited March 30, 2009 by tttiger

[Olham 164]

Krasny and Ras;

TrackIR will improve your overall view, and situational awareness immense.

It will NOT improve your shooting skills. Shooting will rather get more difficult,

as your head moves now. But you can press "precision", that's like stiffening up your body and neck.

Now you can't check your six so quick anymore, but therefor aim and shoot more precise.

 

Your shooting skills must be developed. Forget the gunsights. Find out, were the tracers meet (when you have two guns) -

that's your "hit spot". Do some Quick Combat, and shoot at planes. When they come from right to left,

shoot somewere in front of them. The faster they fly, the more distance in front of them.

That is deflection shooting. It will sooner or later become a feeling. You will now feel, were to shoot.

That's when you've got it. Then, you can become an ace.

Edited March 30, 2009 by Olham

[Ras 0]

Krasny and Ras;

TrackIR will improve your overall view, and situational awareness immense.

It will NOT improve your shooting skills. Shooting will rather get more difficult,

as your head moves now. But you can press "precision", that's like stiffening up your body and neck.

Now you can't check your six so quick anymore, but therefor aim and shoot more precise.

 

Your shooting skills must be developed. Forget the gunsights. Find out, were the tracers meet (when you have two guns) -

that's your "hit spot". Do some Quick Combat, and shoot at planes. When they come from right to left,

shoot somewere in front of them. The faster they fly, the more distance in front of them.

That is deflection shooting. It will sooner or later become a feeling. You will now feel, were to shoot.

That's when you've got it. Then, you can become an ace.

 

Thanks, Olham. Situational awareness, I am looking forward to the improvement with the purchase of the TrackIr.. my shooting skills I am happy with. It is like hunting waterfowl, one must always lead them in advance and it is dependent on their speed and rate of descent or rise. Your anglish spelling is very good by the way. Excellent in fact

[tttiger 0]

The only reason I can come up with for the .30 cal Vickers remaining constant, was the action of the weapon itself, couldn't stand an increase in pressure, without self destructing. Was the .30 cal Vickers used by first line troops, in WWII ?

 

The Vickers was the primary British and Commonwealth ground heavy machine gun through WWII and Korea. The Lewis Gun and, of course, the Bren, were lighter infantry weapons. All fired .303.

 

By the Battle of Britain, Spits and Hurris all were armed solely with .30 caliber Brownings firing the .303 (yup, the same bullet used in WWI) and US early WWII fighters carried Brownings in .30-06, that bullet adopted in 1906. The gun itself originally was the water-cooled M1917 (you guessed it: WWI) that led to the air cooled M1919.

 

The Browning was considered more reliable than the Vickers, especially once they started mounting guns in the wings where the pilot could not reach them to try to clear jams.

 

It was acknowledged in WWI that the .30 cal (or German 8mm) did not create enough damage as a fighter aircraft weapon and it became even more obsolete by the beginning of WWII when air frames were much more sturdy. By mid-WWII the .30 had pretty much disappeared as the gun for fighter aircraft, replaced by the .50 and the 20mm.

 

The big difference in WWII aircraft armament was larger calibers (the Browning .50 is WWI vintage but much too heavy for WWI aircraft) and higher rates of fire.

 

Destructive power in an aircraft gun is measured by how much weight in lead can be put into a target within a given period of time. Obviously, that favored large calibers and high rates of fire.

 

But the .30s that were still used at the beginning of the war fired exactly the same bullets that were used in WWI. And the bullets were all of pre-WWI design. They remained unchanged for more than half a century.

 

Lots of interesting stuff here. Although it's WWII-oriented it traces the development of aircraft guns:

 

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Han...un/fgun-in.html

 

ttt